The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Sheep => Topic started by: Dans on May 22, 2017, 05:28:44 pm
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Hi all
I have a 2 week old CMM ram lamb who has started butting me when I go on tour sort thier water. What can I do to convince him he doesn't want to do that?
Currently, when he tries it I put my fist where he would butt another sheep and give him a shove. I figure if I don't sort it now he'll grow to be a pain and I was hoping to have a go at showing with him.
Any tips would be gratefully received.
Dans
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You're doing exactly what he wants just like another lamb would . slapping his nose or a water pistol neither of which is a normal sparing should work , I know you want him friendly but keep hands away from his head and stop any butting /shoving immediately , You are no1 sheep in his flock
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Try putting your hands, palms flattened, about 8cm each side of his eyes and moving them up and down quickly, a bit like drying your hair. Having different vision from us it often scares them off.
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I agree with shep53, definitely no head contact, (or cuddles) even if you plan to show him it is better if a ram isn't too tame. He still needs to respect you and keep his distance. I know it's hard when he is your first born, but otherwise you will regret it later.
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Thanks guys.
We've purposefully avoided contact as we didn't want him too comfortable around us but I just wasn't sure how to respond to him butting me.
I'll try the arm waving and nose slapping. Fingers crossed they work.
Dans
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I think your overhandling him, overhandled rams can be challenging as they have no respect for you.. The game is head butting and your engaging with him by offering your fist. If he does it I'd shoo him away, or a light slap on the nose.
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I think your overhandling him, overhandled rams can be challenging as they have no respect for you.. The game is head butting and your engaging with him by offering your fist. If he does it I'd shoo him away, or a light slap on the nose.
I thought that too- is he still in (you say about doing water buckets)... put him out with his mother and leave him grow up. My lambs come to call with their mothers but you haven't a hope in hell chance of catching one in the field, they have a healthy respect for me and personal space.
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They are out in the field and I haven't handled him since we turned him and mum out at day 5 (we had a cold snap and I was an anxious first lamber). We don't have a water trough though so every couple of days I refresh the water bucket (our crows make a mess of it). I butted him back today but that was the first time I've had contact with him since he went out, I just didn't know what to do in response to him butting me.
Dans
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Just out of interest is it normal for a ram lamb of that age to make contact with you in that way?
Ours would never come anywhere near once out in the field with their mum's. They have no interest in us at all really.
Maybe Soay are different. ???
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I may just have an abnormal lamb.
His mum only comes over if she thinks we might have food, same with the other ewe outhe with them and the other two lambs (ewe lambs) don't come near at all.
He was butting the second ewe when she was turned out with her lambs and he was about 5 days old...
Dans
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Always try to make yourself look big - carrying a big stick helps. Run after him waving your stick and shouting, so he becomes scared of you. A shove directed at the shoulder too will help. Nip it in the bud or else you'll have problems. :)
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Sounds like he needs to be castrated. That sort of butting of a person from such a small lamb isn't something I've ever seen, just little play butts between lambs. Aggression is an hereditary trait to a large extent, so you wouldn't want to be breeding from him anyway.
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Sounds like he needs to be castrated. That sort of butting of a person from such a small lamb isn't something I've ever seen, just little play butts between lambs. Aggression is an hereditary trait to a large extent, so you wouldn't want to be breeding from him anyway.
I was thinking on these lines too. Lambs who have been bottle fed even just a top up can be a pain looking for a bottle but this doesn't sound like that sort of attention. He is only going to get bigger and stronger and you have a little one to think about.
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Mmmmm that's what I was thinking but don't have enough experience of many lambings or different breeds to know if it's normal for some.
Perhaps he isn't one to leave as a tup, especially with a toddler around?
Next week or two will perhaps show if it is just a growing phase or a pattern that could get worse.
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Two strikes and nuts off, Dans. Don't take risks with a wee one about. (He may still be pushy even when castrated, of course.)
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uh oh a fair percentage of my lambs will come over for a "play" chewing jeans and shoelaces is a favourite. :sheep: :sheep: I don't discourage it. Amongst the boys there is usually at least one who will try the head butting game admittedly my ram lambs are pretty small so i can lean over and swipe their backside just enough to make them back off a little. it doesn't take more than once or twice for them to realise I am not going to "play" with them.
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If he's 2 weeks old isn't he too old to be castrated - unless done by a vet of course? I personally don't castrate anymore, but when I did I did it was when they were between 24hrs and 4 days and even then the lambs would roll around in pain :(
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I personally don't castrate anymore, but when I did I did it was when they were between 24hrs and 4 days and even then the lambs would roll around in pain
Really? That sounds awful. The worse reaction we have had was a lamb standing stock still looking rather shocked for about 10 seconds.
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roll around in pain sounds a bit more dramatic than it should of when I read it back. The lambs would walk off, sit down, get up, walk, lie on their side etc. for 10 - 15 mins. I'd say that they were obviously in pain or a lot of discomfort
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My experience is the same as Dukes Mum.
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Hi Dans- what I would do is reduce your contact with them for a while (don't call mum's in to feed for example, which may be taming their offspring). This should make the lambs a bit more wary of you over time. I would plan to send all ram lambs to slaughter in the autumn. I have done this once or twice, Castlemilks won't make much weight at that age but at least won't be a danger to children and you'll get some meat (you might be able to offer food to build them up in some sort of creep feeder where they cannot work out that you are providing the food?).
Castlemilk wethers can be 'butty' and giddy also at times so castration doesn't always calm them down and I wouldn't ever 100% trust them with children.
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If a ram lamb sees you as part of the flock rather than a potential predator then he will always try to dominate. "Play" butting at such an early age would flag him up for an early trip to the market in my flock.
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Well the arm waving seemed to work a little but following it up with me flapping my skirt as I ran around behind him making a ssshhhhh noise seemed to do the trick. It also gave my husband a good chuckle. He still comes to the fence to investigate me but he hasn't butted again and a quick wave of arms and ssshhhhh sound sends him running off again.
He does seem to be a very forward lamb. He is mounting the ewe lambs that are in with him which I figured was normal but he also started sniffing the back end of the other adult ewe that is in with him and making the lip curling face. Is that normal at that age? Do I need to worry that he might mature early?
We put our newly lambed ewes in the field next to the older lambs today. He's already got into a head butting competition with one of them. Her lamb was born bigger than him though so maybe he'LL have competition soon and calm down a bit. He is currently on his own with 2 ewes and 2 ewe lambs.
Dans