The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Community => Coffee Lounge => Topic started by: mariegold on June 12, 2016, 04:08:59 pm
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Hello,
We thought we had it all so well planned out.... but it looks like our purchase of a smallholding in Powys is about to fall through :(
Been looking for a plan B and cant seem to find anywhere affordable apart from ceredigion/cams/pembs area. I do love it around there (it's where I grew up) but would rather be somewhere new (too many terrible teenage embarrassments keep me away!).
So, can anyone suggest an area where we could afford a nice house with at least 3 acres, not too far from civilization and maybe a friendly inclusive community? We have about £260,000. My dream is to set up a community supported micro dairy with goats and maybe some icelandic sheep.
I prefer rain to sunshine if that helps :fc: thanks everyone
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Have you looked on Rural Scene? They have a couple
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You could buy the house next door to me for £215,000 - 3 bedroom house, 18 acres, common grazings rights, barn, stables, sheep pens and views over the beach. The downside is that it's on the north coast of Scotland, which is not most people's idea of a desirable place to live, but we love it (husband was born up here, I'm an import from Bristol though). It's not on the agent's website at the moment, but it's been on their Facebook page:
https://www.facebook.com/206532089529687/photos/a.206991919483704.1073741826.206532089529687/570312813151611/?type=3 (https://www.facebook.com/206532089529687/photos/a.206991919483704.1073741826.206532089529687/570312813151611/?type=3)
It was on before Christmas with 28 acres for £235k, not sure if the other 10 is still available or not.
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Mmm I think its a bit North for my o/h sadly.... but I do like the idea of Scotland!
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Aberdeenshire still has some affordable smallholdings, and if Scotland appeals to you look at aspc.co.uk and add the filter "acres". There are a couple under your budget at the moment, alternatively try the Aberdeen and Northern marts properties page. (it looks like they are updating their website at the moment so the links don't all work at present)
We used both extensively and found our smallholding that way, but you have to be patient - it took us two years and several false starts but got here eventually!
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Thank you! I am also considering Cumbria/Nothumberland area. Does anyone on here live near Hexham?
The trouble is we have already sold our house, we would consider renting for a bit but would need a place for our goats, dog and cat....
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Thank you! I am also considering Cumbria/Nothumberland area. Does anyone on here live near Hexham?
The trouble is we have already sold our house, we would consider renting for a bit but would need a place for our goats, dog and cat....
You would have to go outside the Newcastle commuter belt to get anything reasonable I would guess. same for the Scottish Borders (Ednburgh commuters obviously and also not many smaller holdings - mainly large farms and estates, plus horsey country), maybe Dumfriesshire?
Also if you want to run a micro dairy - no sale of raw milk in Scotland, so your costsmay make it prohibitively expensive to set up, and away from large conurbations you may not have much of a market...
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I'm not far from Hexham. Prices near to 'civilisation' don't seem cheap around here to me - much cheaper over the border or on the higher, more remote ground.
As Anke says, restrictions on selling raw milk may rule Scotland out for you.
If you head into the higher ground south of Hexham, through to Weardale, you might find something more affordable. As you're community-minded, it might be worth exploring the area around Nenthead/Alston.
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Hello,
We thought we had it all so well planned out.... but it looks like our purchase of a smallholding in Powys is about to fall through :(
Been looking for a plan B and cant seem to find anywhere affordable apart from ceredigion/cams/pembs area. I do love it around there (it's where I grew up) but would rather be somewhere new (too many terrible teenage embarrassments keep me away!).
So, can anyone suggest an area where we could afford a nice house with at least 3 acres, not too far from civilization and maybe a friendly inclusive community? We have about £260,000. My dream is to set up a community supported micro dairy with goats and maybe some icelandic sheep.
I prefer rain to sunshine if that helps :fc: thanks everyone
Try the smallholding centre a lot of their properties are very reasonable. There was one availble just down the rd from me which was cheap but nice but it soon got sold.
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Mmm i didn't realize about the raw milk restrictions in Scotland... that's very useful to know.
I've seen a couple near to Alston and we will try and do a trip up there later this month...
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When it became the 'in thing'. . . . . the prices went through the roof.
I'm from Wales. . . . and when back in rural Wales, especially the West and North. . . . . . no one else appears to be!
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France.
Just like the uk some areas are cheaper than others and the geograph, climate and quality of land differs to. Depends what you want to do and if you want to renovate the dwelling. All rural properties will have outbuildings and the remains of livestock pens etc etc
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With ag ties: Dead cheap and getting easier and easier to comply with it seems:
http://swarb.co.uk/shortt-and-another-v-secretary-of-state-for-communities-and-local-government-and-another-ca-18-nov-2015/ (http://swarb.co.uk/shortt-and-another-v-secretary-of-state-for-communities-and-local-government-and-another-ca-18-nov-2015/)
"There is no obvious reason why this condition should be read as applying only where the agricultural worker provides financial support to the family members living with him or her. Indeed, it would be very surprising if the intention were to permit an agricultural worker to have family members living with him or her only so long as the agricultural business was profitable, or to require family finances to be organised in such a way as to channel profits from the agricultural business into meeting the family’s ordinary living expenses rather than, for example, allowing them to be reinvested in the agricultural business while relying on the spouse’s income to meet the living expenses."
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Just a quick thought that was important to us:
We seriously considered moving to Northern Scotland, The Hebrides etc, and I'm sure we'd have loved it there. However, whilst it's true that you can get a lot more for your money, there also aren't the same employment opportunities that there are in more populated areas.
So for us, since the bank won't take mortgage payments in the form of eggs, it made most sense to fork out a bit more for the smallholding, but buy somewhere still accessible for work in town. This means that we can enjoy the smallholding, but don't have to make it pay. (Don't get me wrong, I'm full of admiration for those who do, but I'm soooo glad we don't have to be in that category, as I think the stress would have killed me by now!!)
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+1 Womble, Also 'cheap to buy' places tend to be 'cheap to sell produce' places too. I'm always surprised in the huge difference in price people make for half pigs when we have a thread on it, feed costs don't seem to be equivalently cheaper up north/out west either!
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Mmmm so much to think about! I'm hoping to do a sort of community supported dairy thing so would need to live within a short distance of an 'alternative' type town where people would be interested in investing in local food (and where people can afford to pay for it!).
Obviously i cant just rock up somewhere and expect the locals to support me and my smallholding dreams but I'm hoping to join in with the community and wriggle my way in....
I have considered France but I cant speak a word of french and really like the British weather too much.
My o/h works in homelessness so would be good to be within an hours drive of a city.
I am thinking that Alston, Cumbria could tick all the boxes. But its such a big move! Did most people on here just up sticks and take a gamble? Or did you slowly get to know a place before diving in head first?
its an interesting idea about properties with agri ties... i will look into this!
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Mmmm so much to think about! I'm hoping to do a sort of community supported dairy thing so would need to live within a short distance of an 'alternative' type town where people would be interested in investing in local food (and where people can afford to pay for it!).
Hexham a bit more well-to-do, of course. But prices near Hexham steeper. Nenthead has a thriving community shop, but from Alston through to and including Weardale is a relatively deprived area. You might need to think farmers' markets in the more well-to-do locales ;)
Also, consider the issue of your OH getting to work in the winter. When you visit the moors around Alston, you'll see coloured poles sticking up alongside the roads - they give the line of the road when the snow is lying ;)
Not trying to put you off, just making sure you have your eyes open!
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We upped sticks and moved from Scotland to Lincs but before that we upped and moved from London to Scotland and we've moved like that before.
If you're looking into ag ties then contact the planning department of the area you're interested in and explain what you want to do and see if they have advice. You're unlikely to get a yes that is fine or a no that doesn't fit but you will get a feel for how they interpret the ties.
Dans
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Have you tried thesmallholdingcentre website?
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All good advice, thanks very much.
I have tried the smallholdingcentre website but they are all in south west wales and as lovely as it is around there, I fancy a change!
I wonder if I should look into buying a house and land separately, maybe within a mile of the house. Is anyone else doing this? I would have to find somewhere with a barn and water etc... but I guess it might be cheaper.
:fc:
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Have you looked into building plots with land? That is what we did, although that was over 12 years ago now... Took us two years to build the house and of course we did not have any buildings on the land, no fences etc and this can work to your advantage or not...
Having your animals away from the home is also going to give you some problems - security for example, time spent going there and back and we do have snow in the North... sometimes rather a lot of it.
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We live in an expensive area ....easy travel to Manchester and Sheffield, probably why. We sold our farm, and now live in a tiny cottage.. Own two parcels of land, can see some from the house. Had we bought house with the 20 acres, it would have been £800,000 plus not £300,000
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We were in a very similar position, we wanted a smallholding but were priced out of the market because we are self employed and could not get a mortgage. Our budget was no more than £140,000 and we realised very quickly that we had little chance of success, a house and land for that did not look hopeful.
But then we started to think outside the box. If we could not get a mortgage to increase the budget could we get a loan? We managed to get two short term loans for £25,000 each, increasing our budget to £190,000 but still not enough to buy anywhere we looked at. So, we looked into buying just the land and doing the field to farm route, I could not convince myself it was achievable given the potential planning issues for our area, North East Wales. We thought about buying land withing 3 miles of our exsisting home but nothing really ever came on the market.
So we started to believe it was something that only others would achieve, everything we looked at was well over £300,000. Then we struck on an idea that gave us a chance to make it happen. Old pubs, you see lots closing being converted into houses. Could any of those have land attached? I signed up to two specialist websites, Fleurets and Christie & Co and within a few minutes found where I am posting this from, a 300 year old stone built 4 bedroom pub with 3.5 aces in a small hamlet, all for the grand total of £175,000. The house across the road was built around the same period and has no land and sold for £420,000 3 years ago.
It took a good deal of educating myself on the subject of planning for residential use and how not to pay the vat on commercial properties but that was only time missing alot of telly at night trawling the internet.
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Wow Toots! That's very impressive! I will try this route myself.
Thanks everyone for your thoughts and suggestions so far. We are heading up to Cumbria next weekend to look at a few.....
I'm wondering if we might have to move into rented for a while, so we are not tempted into rushing into something we might later regret! Not that i can find anywhere that will take two humans, a dog, a cat and 6 goats.....
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Wow Toots! That's very impressive! I will try this route myself.
Thanks everyone for your thoughts and suggestions so far. We are heading up to Cumbria next weekend to look at a few.....
I'm wondering if we might have to move into rented for a while, so we are not tempted into rushing into something we might later regret! Not that i can find anywhere that will take two humans, a dog, a cat and 6 goats.....
Where are you - might be someone on here you could rent from short term
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We are in Stroud, Gloucestershire but my o/h has just heard he has an interview near Newtown, Wales this week! So if he gets the job we will need to focus our search near there.
:wave:
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Newtown shouldn't be too bad for properties to rent. It might be worth going around the local estate agents and they will be able to put you in touch with anyone who has anything available. All the best! :thumbsup:
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We are between Newtown and Welshpool and moved here 7 years ago from the Midlands. Moved with 2 young children, 2 dogs, old cat, chickens, house rabbits, fish and stick insects! What a job it was to transport everyone!
Absolutely love the area and our wonderful neighbours.
Pm me if you want to know anything about the area.