The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Other => Topic started by: Vinnie on April 15, 2016, 08:34:01 pm
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Anyone else grow mealworms? We grow them for our chickens they absolutely love them. We have them in a shed outside in an aquarium and because the winter was so mild they lived. The adults didn't make it but the mealworms did. So the chickens like to eat the adults too. So just wondering about anyone else that may have mealworms?
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Interesting! What do you feed them? Do you just have some adult beetles in there that lay eggs or do you buy small worms and grow them on?
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All I did is buy some mealworms from the pet store. Then you put a couple inches of oatmeal the small flakes. Put the worms in a few carrot pieces for their water, then a few cardboard egg cartons for them to hid in. Then you wait and wait then they turn into little alien pods ( my scientific name). Then take those out because they are helpless and the worms and adults will eat them if they run out of water.. Those little pods become the adults once the adults turn black they are fully grown. As soon as they can crawl around I usually put them in a separate container. So you have 3 containers. Some people leave all together I may try that this year because I ended up with a lot of adults but I couldn't find any eggs. But apparently there was because they lived the winter. If you google raising mealworms there is a lot more detail on how to set up a colony ( or is it a herd ;D no idea what a bunch of worms is called). I guess some people grow them and sell to pet stores, but we just do it for our chickens. Tomorrow I will try and take a picture of there aquarium.
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I recently started a colony and do pretty much what you describe except i keep them all together. I haven't had them long enough to get a second generation yet but soon hopefully!
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Best of luck on your next generation Clarabelle, they should do real good especially as the weather gets warmer they like to be cozy. I don't know how to get them going faster, because our chickens eat them in like 30 seconds. So we only give the dead ones, I guess when they really start going you can give them live ones which the chickens really love.
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I Accidentally started one today.
After reading your post I rang my daughter to ask how much she pays because she has a hedgehog...... well, she was actually in the petshop buying some!
I asked her to see if they would sell me some beetles or pupae and they had a box that had started to pupate and gave it to her at half price.
So I have the same question - how on earth do you produce enough mealworms to treat 15 large fowl every now and again. :innocent:
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I tried to start a colony last summer but not quite as easy as I thought.
While I got a lot of adults hatched from my first handfuls of worms it didn't go any further - I waited and waited for eggs to hatch but nothing.. so never got a second generation of worms, not sure where I went wrong.
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Well Q I don't think you can grow enough they say a chicken can eat up to a 1/2 lb a day. Not sure how many worms that is except a lot. So they are just for treats, you can buy freezer dried mealworms in Walmart in the bird food section. In Canada at least they are $7.98 for a bag I can remember the size. In case your birds really start liking them, to tied you over until your colony takes hold.
LadyK that happen to me to, I think I started them to late in the summer and they didn't have enough time. At least that's what I hope was the problem. I'm going to look up more info I think though see what a person can do to speed it up.
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I tired to start a colony last summer but not quite as easy as I thought.
While I got a lot of adults hatched from my first handfuls of worms it didn't go any further - I waited and waited for eggs to hatch but nothing.. so never got a second generation of worms, not sure where I went wrong.
I am only quoting what i have read on the internet but I thing the adults will eat the eggs and the young. Most people I have seen separate the adults as soon as they think enough eggs have been laid - I have seen this timed at 2 days and at a week. It was quoted that the adults can lay up to 100 eggs per day each.
I dont know how long it is from turning to adult to start laying eggs.
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What if you don't see any eggs ?
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The eggs are tiny. depending on the substrate I would be surprised if you could see them.
The youtube video I saw used a filter to separate the beetles and lots of the eggs were stuck to the container they were in.
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Interesting thread - my OH is talking about doing just this for his pheasants (like they don't get enough treats already, they get more fresh fruit than I do ;) ). Looks like it's not as straightforward as he thinks - is this a fair assumption?
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Q would you happen to have a link to that you tube video, it's sounds like it gives more detail about the eggs. I have watched a bunch and they all say is and you gets lots of eggs but not a lot of detail.
I think it is fairly easy once you get the hang of it. Which apparently I haven't yet :thinking:
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Q would you happen to have a link to that you tube video, it's sounds like it gives more detail about the eggs. I have watched a bunch and they all say is and you gets lots of eggs but not a lot of detail.
I think it is fairly easy once you get the hang of it. Which apparently I haven't yet :thinking:
Yep - no problem - I have to say most of them are cringeworthy to listen the whole way through.
This first one deals with eggs and the eating eggs bit. She goes on about using a scrap of material but then in the follow up video she did there was no mention of the material so I personally ignored that idea.
You can skip to the 5.20 mark and save 5 of your valuable minutes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9-M3XV71dY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9-M3XV71dY)
This second one is the guy who sieves and goes on about the eggs being stuck to the container.
(skip to about 6.20 for the filtering bit)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LczqEONN1Ho (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LczqEONN1Ho)
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Thanks Q I am definitely going to try the idea about the screen and cloth for egg laying. Those people really have a quite the colony set up. And maybe the ground up chicken food would be the extra nutrition the worms need to speed them up.
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I used to keep mine in bran.
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Spotted our first beetle today from the meal worms we bought from the petshop. :excited:
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Bran is a good idea too some use ground up flax, anything soft for them to crawl in and can eat too.
:thumbsup: Q
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Thought I would separate the beetles & found 20 or so - they were hiding !
I also separated about 100 pupae because when the turn into beatles they will be easier to find.
Just need to find out how long to leave the beatles to lay eggs to create the first lot of mealworms.
I intend to separate the beatles every 4 weeks so that each container contains 4 weeks worth of eggs that I can keep separate to make sure they are roughly the same age and size.
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That's great I found this website gives a short outline of the life cycle of mealworms. It says after the beetles turn black about 2 weeks later they should start mating and laying eggs.
http://mealwormcare.org/life-cycle/ (http://mealwormcare.org/life-cycle/)
Hope that link works
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That's great I found this website gives a short outline of the life cycle of mealworms. It says after the beetles turn black about 2 weeks later they should start mating and laying eggs.
http://mealwormcare.org/life-cycle/ (http://mealwormcare.org/life-cycle/)
Hope that link works
Thanks Vinnie - that was the bit I was missing - two weeks as a black beetle before laying eggs.
I assume over winter the beetles will die but the worms would survive & cooling them down slows the process.
I fed my chickens a few adult worms today just to make sure they would eat them after all this effort - they did :relief:
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That's what happen to mine over the beetles died and about half of the worms lived. They probably would all live if you brought them in the house or some other warm area. I had my out in a garden shed so they had some protection. Our chickens eat the dead ones too, I think they think they are alive because in the pan as they peck the worms bounce. ;D
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This is a brilliant thread, I would love to see a book or website with all the concise info needed for growing mealworms.
Can I ask somebody experienced are meal worms the easiest and best bug food to bread? Or what other bug food is fastest, easiest to get per gram of edible food?
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This is a brilliant thread, I would love to see a book or website with all the concise info needed for growing mealworms.
Can I ask somebody experienced are meal worms the easiest and best bug food to bread? Or what other bug food is fastest, easiest to get per gram of edible food?
Interesting question.... Now I want to know the answer to that as well ! ::)
Here's a nutritional comparison to housefly maggots :-
http://www.mypetchicken.com/downloads/MuscaDomesticavsMealworms.pdf (http://www.mypetchicken.com/downloads/MuscaDomesticavsMealworms.pdf)
For me though - mealworms are good because they seem to be a 'clean' insect to deal with. I am happy to have them around and handle them.
The beetles dont fly - I couldnt imagine breeding flies in the same way - yuk
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Have a wee look on reptile forums UK you don't have to be a member but in the feeder area there's loads on breeding mealworms
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I don't think I could handle doing the maggots from like flies. iI don't know what type of bug it is but there is one bug the queen is long and black stripped I only saw her a couple of times and she lays thousand of maggot like babies, they are usually around decaying stuff I will have to see if I can find its name. But breeding them is not for me they look way to much like maggots. I think mealworms are about the easiest. The are quite, barely fly, don't smell too much, and don't bite. :thinking:
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I think mealworms seem to be the most popular. There is so much info about them, I can't wait to get started. I'm going to add them to my muesli ever morning.
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I have never tried them ,but they say they have nutty flavour and are crunchy if you toast them.
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I catch insects and bugs of all kinds in my bug traps, I like to put them in my blender with some mixed frozen fruit and a little vanilla ice cream and wizz it all up. delicious.
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I catch insects and bugs of all kinds in my bug traps, I like to put them in my blender with some mixed frozen fruit and a little vanilla ice cream and wizz it all up. delicious.
Nope - not doing that !
I had thought of possibly trying some mealworms but you just turned my stomach. :o
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Think I would rather put sunflowers seeds or peanuts on my ice cream. Some eat chocolate covered grasshoppers too I tried those at a Fair one time the only flavour was the crunchy chocolate.
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UPDATE on my mealworm 'farm' which is all Vinnie's fault !
We are now two weeks on and I have quite a lot of beetles - probably over 100 I think and I have moved them to a slightly bigger home.
They have started doing all the necessary activities for babies now so I will leave them for 2 maybe 3 weeks and then move all the beetles out into a new home and leave the eggs to hatch without being eaten.
If its true that they lay up to 100 per day then the chickens are in for a treat.
I will repeat this every 2-3 weeks to keep the same age groups together and see how many baby mealworms we end up with.
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;D :roflanim: welcome Q Sounds like the little critters are doing really good. That seems to be the trick to get the eggs or beetles out before they are eaten. You are going to have happy chickens, not sure how many chickens you have but it is annoying after all the time spent growing the worms how fast the chickens eat them. Chickens that turn into :pig:
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UPDATE on the mealworm farm
Its 3 weeks since I moved the beetles into a bigger home because I was getting more beetles hatching than I anticipated.
Still getting new beetles daily from the pack of mealworms I originally bought from the pet shop. ( 15 new beetles yesterday ) but these are definitely coming to an end now - must be hundreds now!
Anyway, I have now moved the beetles which have been laying eggs to their second home to keep the eggs from being eaten and just need to wait 4-19 days for the eggs to hatch.
But...... I kept the original home separately just in case there were eggs and yesterday I saw the first baby mealworm that had hatched :excited: it was absolutely tiny but shows that the process works.
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Just to add.......
Moving the beetles out was much easier than any of the videos that I have been watching where they were sieved out. To me that looked messy and time consuming.
I have kept a few toilet roll insides in with the beatles because they like to hide under them & cling on to them.
Just moved the loo rolls over and shake it to get the beetles off - easy - I just put the loo roll back and left it for a day to catch the next lot.
Finally had to manually catch the last 10 or so that were burrowed in the oats - job done - clean and simple.
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That's great Q, you know you are doing something right when you get baby mealworms :thumbsup: Good idea about the toilet rolls, I was using cut up egg cartons which was kind of annoying, but the rolls work good.
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UPDATE
its been another 3-4 weeks now and I am just preparing to move the current set of beetles to a new home and preserve a new generation of mealworms so I thought I would put in an update.
Firstly, all the original mealworms have been through their life cycle and I finally have NO MORE DAILY BEETLES which is a relief because I have PLENTY!
Secondly,The previous eggs batch I had saved weren't looking likely because I hadnt been able to SEE anything happening but TODAY I had a quick firkle through the oats and there are baby mealworms EVERYWHERE! I can see them better now because they are brown and about a half inch long.
I am more optimistic about a bumper batch from the current lot because there are a lot more beetles this time and they have been active for slightly longer.
The only 'work' I have had to do is to cut up a carrot every 4-5 days and drop in a handful of new oats once a week.
I will post another update when there's some food for the chickens!
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Another UPDATE - I hope somebody is reading this.
So, another 8 weeks on and I have just re-homed the beetles again. I should not have left it this long because there are thousands of worms in with the beetles this time - they are small but visible and I had to be extra careful not to harm them. Some will surely have found their way into the new beetle home but couldnt be helped.
Proves one theory though - the beetles DO NOT eat the eggs and the small worms if left together.
Progress on the other batches of worms - the very first lot of worms are getting quite big now - some of the bigger ones larger than 25mm. They are probably at size where they are one (or two) skin sheddings away from being chicken food but I have noticed they have grown really quickly with the recent warmer weather.
The second lot of worms that I separated have also become easily visible but they are noticeably smaller (3 weeks behind the first lot). There are far more of them in the second and third batches which is exactly as I expected because the beetles wouldnt have laid so many eggs in their early days.
WORKLOAD
Little to nothing - the carrots tend to dry up quicker in the hot weather. I have also been putting in cucumber, lettuce and potato on occasions. I haven't had any real problems with mould although they do drag the food down into the oats and it does come out shrivelled and a bit mouldy but not spreading.
COST
I have just started on my third 1Kg bag of oats - very cheap and I (my chickens) have a huge volume of worms to look forward to.
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So what weight of worms do you think you'll get this time? I'm intrigued by the process, but it sounds like a hell of a lot of work compared with buying layers' pellets!
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So what weight of worms do you think you'll get this time? I'm intrigued by the process, but it sounds like a hell of a lot of work compared with buying layers' pellets!
I hadnt thought about weighing them - its a bit tricky when the mass at the moment is the oats that the beatles were using mixed with thousands of tiny worms.
I dont have really accurate digital scales but it might be interesting to weigh the ones I have just transferred then do it again in few months time.
As for comparing buying pellets well, no, but my chickens appreciate a live meal worm more :eyelashes:
Its a bit like the allotment though - plant / feed / wait 3-4 months then reap the reward.
Compared to buying mealworms in the shop - £2.40 for a small box ( about enough for 1 frenzied chicken snack) - I think this will yield at least 100 times that - if only there was an outlet for them :thinking:
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Hi sorry haven't written for awhile. Wow q your mealworms are doing great!!!! Not sure about where you live but in Canada some put ads like on kijiji or some other classified website and they sell them. Their prices are crazy expensive but people are willing to buy them for their pet reptiles. Also pet stores may buy them from you. If you want to sell them if not you have some very happy chickens :excited:
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was looking on ebay - they sell a 500g bag for £8.00 on there. That includes postage and there would be fees.
would cover the cost of my porridge oats though :roflanim:
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Some sell them live here they are 100 mealworms for $5.00 or 500 for $20.00 or 1000 for $35.00( Canadian not sure how many £ that is). And then the pet stores usually just have the gut loaded ones or super worms they call them ( don't mix those with your worms it will kill them)but sometimes you can buy the regular for 50 worms at like $2.50. I think we all grow them mostly just to feed our animals don't think anyone will be getting rich on worms ;D
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ANOTHER UPDATE - the full cycle is complete and a new use for overgrown courgettes.
Well, 1st September it is and the first lot of mealworms have now reached max size and are now chicken treats. I was a bit late really because some have already started to turn into alien pupae with the recent hot weather probably speeding it up. Lucky the chickens like the pupae too.
The beetles really should have been removed from the eggs again by now but a little laziness got in the way. The second and third batches of worms have far more worms than the first batch partly because of the extra time I left it but also probably because the beetles will have been producing more.
Either way I have produced more worms than I ever thought possible - absolutely thousands and thousands.
I love the noise they make when munching on the oats - its a lot louder than you think and reminds me of rice crispies.
The grand kids are always fascinated by the worms and beetles when they come round too.
The original beetles are still going strong - not showing any signs of dying off at all.
Costs and time. Again, hardly anything.
I have been putting in oats and topping up a bit every week or so. For moisture the beetles have had sliced potatoes and the worms had been eating cucumber but I found those overgrown courgettes better for the worms because they are a little dryer and they definitely seem to devour them pretty quickly.
Haven't had any problems with mould or smell at all.
So, project is a success to me - will I continue - hmmm not sure
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Congratulations Q sounds like a booming success :excited:
What are courgettes?
Also is your mealworms farm inside or out? Just wondering because mine were outside in a shed but we had a very wet summer not if that was the reason but unfortunately mine didn't make it. So if I can convince my family :thinking: to let me have them in the house I may try again
I bet your chickens just gobbled them!
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Congratulations Q sounds like a booming success :excited:
What are courgettes?
Also is your mealworms farm inside or out? Just wondering because mine were outside in a shed but we had a very wet summer not if that was the reason but unfortunately mine didn't make it. So if I can convince my family :thinking: to let me have them in the house I may try again
I bet your chickens just gobbled them!
Hi Vinnie - you may know a courgette as a zucchini. the mealworms are kept inside but I dont think it would have mattered as its been quite warm here over the summer - I am sure the beetles should be approaching the end of their life span - I thought it was 3 months but they seem to be going ok.
The Chickens get all excited when they see the mealworm box coming - the first batch is now almost gone but I'm trying not to give them too many at a time because I dont want to unbalance their diet with all the extra protein.
Here's a picture of the third batch - give you some idea about how many.
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Vinnie , courgettes are what you guys over the pond call Zuchinni , if left to grow on past nine inches long they can become 2 foot long monster " Marrows "
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We have lots of zucchini but think I will start calling them courgettes. ;D
Q wow you do have probably 1000's of worms that's so neat. I am definitely going to try and grow them inside I think our summer this year just wasn't good for them too chilly
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Now i have more worms maturing than the chickens can reasonably eat.
Even though I separated the boxes out at intervals there are mature mealworms in each box mixed in with the younger ones.
I think I may need more chickens!
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Freeze the worms in tie wrap bags perhaps ... So that when it slows down in deepest winter you can feed the chucks on newly thawed ones .
You ought to also be able to dehydrate them and vac pack worth while amounts .
That could be an interesting exercise in making a simple 50 watt light bulb dehydrator and some form of cage to hold the worms in till they get dried & died out .
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Freeze the worms in tie wrap bags perhaps ... So that when it slows down in deepest winter you can feed the chucks on newly thawed ones .
You ought to also be able to dehydrate them and vac pack worth while amounts .
That could be an interesting exercise in making a simple 50 watt light bulb dehydrator and some form of cage to hold the worms in till they get dried & died out .
I did a bit of research on freezing them on the reptile forums - apparently the freezing process breaks down the fat after a few days. there was a comment that they wouldnt feed the mealworms to their reptiles after they had been frozen for more than a few days.
I also read that keeping them cool slows down the development of the mealworms - that would explain why they all seem to have matured at about the same time.
But chickens ain't reptiles & dont need the worms as a protein - just a treat.
Did find out why they mealworms were not being used quickly enough - I think my OH was giving the chickens too small amounts - they must have been getting about one each :roflanim: