The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Cattle => Topic started by: Rosemary on November 21, 2014, 08:08:28 pm
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Just got our new bull calf home. We didn't nose ring the last one. Thoughts on nose ringing?
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Congratulations Rosemary & Dan.
I'm sure pic's will follow.
I don't have cattle but I have customers who have cattle and any bulls nearly all have nose rings.
Even when you think the bull is a calm beast they can still turn.
For safety reasons for yourselves I would ring it. It will allow you to control and move him more easily.
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Not an expert but can share what I know.
All the bulls we've had have had rings in. We used one once to control his head (previous bull, also an Angus, and a gentleman), and I wouldn't ever do that again unless I had no choice. But even though I'd have no intention of using the ring, I think I'd still want any bull of ours to have one fitted.
We have purpose-built very robust cattle-handling facilities, which makes not using the ring to control the bull an option for us. If we didn't have that, then I guess we would have to be able to use the ring.
I've never been involved in ringing a bull, and don't know what, if any, discomfort and/or inconvenience the bull experiences on an ongoing basis in his everyday life. It's not like a pig, stopping him rootle - but does it interfere with grazing in any way? Clearly they can graze, but are they prevented from doing anything an unringed animal can do?
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I spent a few months driving a vet who had lost his driving licence many years ago. He was a farm vet and one of our call outs was to ring a bull. Got to admit it was seriously unpleasant!!!!! :o
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I spent a few months driving a vet who had lost his driving licence many years ago. He was a farm vet and one of our call outs was to ring a bull. Got to admit it was seriously unpleasant!!!!! :o
Can I ask why? I thought it would be like getting your ears pierced but bigger. Although I suppose it's cartilidge rather than ear lobe (whatever that's made of).
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Ear lobe also cartilage.
I've only rung one adult bull, but it didn't seem to upset him too much, there was some bleeding, but the nose is known for this as anyone who's had a thump there will tell you!
Given it seemed to cause little distress to an adult, will not interfere with grazing or natural behaviours, but is something there to handle them if required (not wise to have no plan b with something a size that can kill you unintentionally!) then I would say ring him.
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I've put a few in, it is a bit of a job, two halters to cross tie the bull, waft in some lignocaine (or whatever!) crunch around with those totally ineffective hole punch things if you like and then just push the spike of the ring through the soft bit with brute force. If you wait for the local to work they just give you a hard stare (I hide before the crush is opened!).
I have heard stories of farmers pinned to the floor by bulls just being able to grab the ring and relieve the pressure on them enough to crawl to safety and wouldn't consider leaving a bull without one, also its a sign to other people that it is a bull.
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If your grazing is rough hill with whin bushes etc then i'd avoid ringing. Lots of bulls seem to catch & rip rings out on branches, sheds etc. In Scotland I'm pretty sure its not a legal requirement but I think it is in England. If you were showing etc then I would ring as you may be deemed not in full control if an accident did happen. For short term use on farm a heavy duty humbug is handy.
Most bulls need a 31/2" ring. But you cant seem to get them now! The 3" is usually to neat & 4" catches on everything. Anyone got a source for 31/2"?
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heavy duty humbug
I've got to ask - what is a humbug - apart from references to Scrooge...
Sue
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If your grazing is rough hill with whin bushes etc then i'd avoid ringing. Lots of bulls seem to catch & rip rings out on branches, sheds etc. In Scotland I'm pretty sure its not a legal requirement but I think it is in England. If you were showing etc then I would ring as you may be deemed not in full control if an accident did happen. For short term use on farm a heavy duty humbug is handy.
Most bulls need a 31/2" ring. But you cant seem to get them now! The 3" is usually to neat & 4" catches on everything. Anyone got a source for 31/2"?
Our grazing is flat, sandy fields with the odd tree and hedge. 3" might be OK for our boy 'cos he's only wee and will be comparatively small all his life.
Many shows make ringing compulsory (or snigging, which is use of a bulldog, I think).
A bulldog is like a temporary ring, Sue, doesn't go through the nose but gets screwed tight a bit like those spiky things you get for weaning calves.
TBH, I'd rather have the one off trauma of the ring than trying to get a bulldog in when required :eyelashes:
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It really doesn't bother them much ime
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I spent a few months driving a vet who had lost his driving licence many years ago. He was a farm vet and one of our call outs was to ring a bull. Got to admit it was seriously unpleasant!!!!! :o
Can I ask why? I thought it would be like getting your ears pierced but bigger. Although I suppose it's cartilidge rather than ear lobe (whatever that's made of).
Unpleasant for me watching!!! :innocent: Almighty crunch as the hole punchy thing went through the cartilage! bull bellowed a bit but was fine after 2 minutes! Vet and a scarpered before he was let out of the crush!! Got to admit I find ear tagging sheep rather ikky!!! I think its the noise!!!
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those spiky things you get for weaning calves.
OK thanks - we've not put anything on Tavish - had him since he was 13 months, now 28.5 months - he's not been any trouble. Though he did get a bit excited about a new bale of hay in the feeder ring recently and wanted to eat it before Steve could get the net off. Not a problem, Tavish got out of the way when required. This doesn't mean Steve waved a big stick and shouted at him - we make a point of wandering around all our beasties and getting them to 'give way' - can't be having with cattle that challenge us, be they cows or bulls. They may be small compared to a commercial breed, but the adults weigh over 500kg and they have sharp pointy bits at the front.
We've had 3 bulls here - none of which was ringed at the time - Viking was very quiet and very efficient; Tavish squeaks a lot, also very efficient. Both of those came here as their first active duty at about 13 months. Petroni was a bit older, and he was a bit moody - it seems he's got moodier as he's got older according to tales we've heard about his adventures in NI.
I guess it depends on the bull - I think I'd leave your youngster be for a while and watch how he behaves around you.
He looks very good, like his nice white flash between his horns. When does he get to play with the ladies?
Sue
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He looks very good, like his nice white flash between his horns. When does he get to play with the ladies?
Sue
Not till next August, so he'll be 17 months. A big lad :)
He's being kept in until his post movement TB test then he'll go up to our temporary grazing until required.
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Ear lobe also cartilage.
Is it? Don't think mine are, they are soft and wobble!
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OH's current bull has a ring but the one before didn't, they are bought as stock bulls from the sales. I don't think so far we have had to use the ring on this bull, our crush is excellent and seems to restrain him well.
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ours isn't rung. hes no bother as hes very quiet. we have a crush and handling gates, and as yet havent had a reason to ring him. id rather he thought of me as the food lady rather than the one who hurt him. ::) ::)
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Ear lobes are soft fatty tissue - the pinna contains the cartilage - that's the bit that makes up the largest section of the outer ear in humans.
Don't think many other mammals have ear lobes - not quite sure what advantage they have, except of course for hanging earrrings and giving husbands an easy option for a Christmas present for the wife...
Sue
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I'm on my third bull and none of them have had nose rings. We have not had any trouble apart from one who started being bolshy and wouldn't go where he was told for a month or so towards the end. (not long before he went to the abbatoir.) I don't think a nose ring would have made any difference as you wouldn't have wanted to get near enough to him to be using it. He would paw the ground and toss his head when you went past so I couldn't keep a bull who was doing this. I got scared of him and he knew it so that didn't help.
I do use the temporary nose rings ( mine has sort of springs rather than screwing in) I use it when they are already in the crush if I need to hold their head up and keep it still eg for replacing a tag or giving a drench if they are too strong or too awkward for me to hold their nose up ( cows too if need be) I find it works very well.
I have observed more experienced handlers doing the same thing with fingers in nostrils for these types of procedures but I don't seem to be able to coordinate everything well enough to do this and dodge horns and do the procedure.
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I don't think the bulldog clip is as effective as a ring for your safety/cattle restraint, I saw a farmer 1/2 killed once by a suckler cow he was holding with a halter and bulldog clips (front row seat - very scary)