The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Pigs => Topic started by: GenghisChris on April 17, 2008, 05:44:58 pm
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HI guys, I still have to check the rights of way in some forest I own (3 acres over 2 plots)
I wondered has anyone tried keeping pigs in a heavily wooded area? Obviously shelter and fencing will be built. The way I'm looking at it is it is a much more natural enviroment for them and would free up my other land for horticulture/agriculture.
I should point out this land is in Austria and I have yet to confirm that it would be ok, but I'm still interested in peoples views.
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Hi, I haven't tried it and I'm a much less experienced pig keeper than many on this forum, but I would think that woodland would be a great place to keep pigs - it's their natural habitat.
I can remember years ago, when I was at University, going to the College farms and seeing an "experiment" where a handful of commercial Landrace x Large White gilts were turned out in a woodland, with a boar. Within days, they had built nests and wallows and were completely at home, so it's all there, even in domestic pigs.
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We had 2 Berkshires and the farmer had 3 saddlebacks. We ran them together in woodland with access to a small grass field. They loved it. Interestingly they spent a lot of the time digging up the field :) Woodland gives them a bit of everything. Shade, shelter, sunlight, digging ground, surface feeding....
Good luck with whatever you decide.
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When Mrs. DeVere decided to go 'walkabout' several weeks ago she was found lauding it up in a wood without a care.
She was happy rooting around under the trees for nuts, acorns and the like, had built a nest, created several wallow's and was as happy as a pig could be. The only thing she didn't have was a T.V. and a dvd player to be able to watch past episodes of Pinky & Perky and a cocktail cabinet!!!
Pigs living in a forest??? What could be better.
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:pig: :'( You forgot MISS PIGGY from the Muppets.
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Hi there, we have some Tamworths in fenced areas in our woodland. They do love the shade but they also love digging and chewing at the bark and at the roots, our big beeches in one of their runs now has pallets round them to protect the roots. The other run that they have has some old hawthorn trees in it and these are slowly being dug up. I guess my point is that if they are confined in an area with trees be prepared for some damage. (Our pig runs are not small and are certainly not pig sty size). We also had a stone retaining wall that they gradually demolished, relocating the stone to elsewhere in the run. They are natures tractors right enough. I couldn't believe the size of the stones that they could move.
Carol
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Just a word of caution to check first, If thetre is Fern there and it is in its early growing stage ie shooting again for the new year it will kill your pigs within 4 hours if they eat it, When it is shooting it is highly toxic, Once the vigorous growth stage is over it is not harmful to pigs and in fact they will dig it up and eat the roots/
Beware as it is a horrible death for the pigs where poison comes out of every orifice possible, not a pleasant site to see,
tony
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Tony again can you quote your sources?
Quoting from Black's Veterinary Dictionary -
"The eating of bracken (Pteris aquilina) by horses, cattle or sheep may lead to serious illness and death; symptoms appearing a month or two after the first meal of the plant. The llness lasts from 1 to 6 days. Although in some cases death may occur sooner, and be accompanied by bleeding from nose and anus.
Symptoms vary including faeces, passed without straining are usually blod stained. Respirations are accelerated.
PREVENTION: Bracken is usually eaten only when no other food is available; avoid the situation in which animals turn to bracken out of sheer hunger or thirst."
There is a lot more about sheep, cattle and horses eating this, however it appears according to my book that its very, very rare in pigs. I suppose as the woods are their natural environment, and they have been around for longer than man, they may have learned that bracken is not on the porcine good food guide.
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All of our pigs live in the woods.
We have four large pens (approx 1 acre each) which they rotate through. We sow behind them with an understory and wild flower mix as well as a kale and stubble turnip mixture. Combined with ever present comfrey and garlic this keeps them fairly happy.
We have loads of ferns but they leave them
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I keep 6 pigs in our woods, 25ft tall Christmas trees. They have lots to eat like loads of Qs and Bananas. They never seem to attack the trees however I do hope they would not get any harm from them. They have been in there for about 8 weeks now. They are eating great and drinking good as well. IO did put a posting on this site asking if anyone knew if it would be OK but little responce however I would like to thank the ones taht did.
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MRree thanks for message, once i had replied I realised it might be useful info!
Regarding 'understorey' we sow this mix behind the pigs:
5% common bentgrass
5 % crested dogstail
10% smaller catstail
15% sheeps fescue
20% red fescue
5 % wild white clover
10% late flowering red clover
4 % alsike clover
4% birdsfoot trefoil
10% sainfoin
8% common vetch
4% yellow trefoil
At the same time we sow a mix of
30% mustard
30% kale
40% Stubble radish
and a good splash of
wild garlic
cowslip
lady’s bedstraw
lesser knapweed
ox-eye daisy
meadow buttercup
meadowsweet
ragged robin
ribwort plantain
self heal
yellow rattle
we also stick in jerusalem artichokes and comfrey whenever we have any spare as they seem to keep coming back all the stronger when theyve been ploughed in by the pigs.
This may seem a hassle, but its all cheap seed and we feep big bags ready mixed, the woods look great and are full of insects and birds and most of all it avoids us having to buy in any food for the pigs as it keeps the fodder coming and biodiversity up. As time goes on less seed is required to re-establish.
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That sounds really interesting, do you achieve a good slaughter weight on this? We find that although the pigs clear the ground totally, once it is rested it quickly rejuvenates. Have tried growing beteraves in the fields, this works to a limited extent, but I am no gardener so anything that grows is a bonus.
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Tony again can you quote your sources?
From the top pig stockmen in u.k. who have had it happen to them and also through personal experience
Whilst not all fern is the same when it is growing it's new shoots that is when it is at it's most dangerous.
unfortunatly the blacks Vetrinary dictionary is so vague in that it is saying this could happen or this might happen, I think they are scooting around the issue as they do not know the answer
Unless the book is written by Specialist Pig vetrinarians it isnt worth the paper it is wrote on.
Also the majority of top vetrinarians are now consulting the breeders who no what they are on about before putting pen to paper.
Regards
tony
Quoting from Black's Veterinary Dictionary -
"The eating of bracken (Pteris aquilina) by horses, cattle or sheep may lead to serious illness and death; symptoms appearing a month or two after the first meal of the plant. The llness lasts from 1 to 6 days. Although in some cases death may occur sooner, and be accompanied by bleeding from nose and anus.
Symptoms vary including faeces, passed without straining are usually blod stained. Respirations are accelerated.
PREVENTION: Bracken is usually eaten only when no other food is available; avoid the situation in which animals turn to bracken out of sheer hunger or thirst."
There is a lot more about sheep, cattle and horses eating this, however it appears according to my book that its very, very rare in pigs. I suppose as the woods are their natural environment, and they have been around for longer than man, they may have learned that bracken is not on the porcine good food guide.
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Hilarysmum wrote:
do you achieve a good slaughter weight on this?
We normally kill to achieve around 50-60kg deadweight, but are looking at going a bit smaller as more oredrs are coming in requesting slightly smaller joints and also the parma hams would be easier with lighter leg!
The pigs tend to reach this weight in around 6 months, but the beauty of the system is there is no pressure for them to fatten quickly as the overheads just dont really cause a problem.
We are growing supplementary food in the form of a root break (mangolds, fodder beet, swede) and a higher protein mixed corn, oat, bean and pea crop. (this goes to the poultry too).The horticultural area also provides alot of food that would otherwise just be compost material.
The cost of commercially milled pig food is ridiculous and this in tern seems to keep pork prices uneccessarily high, so we are pleased to be able to sell ours more reasonably due to the lack of external inputs.
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Thanks RIF thats fascinating.
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The mixes for above 'understorey'.
Does anyone know if anything like this can be bought in France by the sac and if so what would it be called? I guess it would be foound in the likes of Agriel and Pont Vert but would have a problem explaining what I wanted despite having some command of the French Language.
It sounds like a plan, would like to investigate it further.
Thanks
Kate :pig:
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best bet would probably be to contact your local organic organisation, or maybe Inter Bio Bretagne? as they should know where to get good seed mixtures.
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???
I think I have seen some in Cecab, do you have one locally?
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I am probably being a bit thick HM but what is Cebab - is it an Agriel?
Kate :pig:
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Sorry yes its an agricole. We also have a CAM which although dearer would probably have the same.
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Very interesting on the mix you plant "resistance is Fertile"
Do you buy all that already mixed or do you buy individually and mix it yourself?
I'm not sure i can get all that in North Carolina but would like to find something close.
How many pigs to you run in the 1 acre padocks?
I have pine trees i'd like to manage for harves too so I really don't want them destroyed either
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Higgins 11 re your fir trees - Hilary , aka death to all trees - does not touch firs, doesnt even eat the roots.
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I know this is an old post but I just thought you might be interested to hear of our experiences. We have 32 acres of broad leaf woodland and introduced two tamworth sows 18mths ago to see if they could help keep the undergrowth in check. They have been a great success and are now very very big girls. We do feed with nuts but they also forage for themselves all day. We got two more gilts in November and have started a breeding plan. Some management is required if you do not want any area over dug! They particularly like young oak roots and the big girls can make quick work of felling a 10yr old tree but they do not touch Ash trees which is good because we also have soay sheep who would kill for ash. So the sheep can graze round the oaks and the pigs we keep to the ash areas. We have other species of trees in another area yet to be worked. Pigs up to the age of 6months are fairly light on good ground. The big girls could be hired out as bulldozers and rotivators. But they all really love living in our wood and I certainly feel they have all had a really good life even if it has to be a bit short. The resultant meat is to die for - you'll never want to eat any indoor pork again and as for the bacon - dribble dribble - be prepared to be spoiled!! :) :pig: :sheep: