The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Sheep => Topic started by: Young Ed on April 26, 2014, 10:20:33 pm
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sorry first post here so if I don't quite post in the normal style that is why!
any way I am looking at starting a small 'flock' or 'herd' not a real one mind as it will consist of about 3 or 4 sheep to start with! plan is to buy in 3 or 4 lambs just after being weened off and then raise them up for slaughter and sell the meat, do this for a year or two and then go proper and start breeding and lambing :D to sell the lambs at market for meat
I am looking at various breeds and have seen positives and negatives of them all! I am looking mainly at Lleyn or easy care
the Lleyn as I have been working with them lambing recently and they get a good percentage fertility wise and are very friendly
the easy care as they are hardy and less susceptible to disease
considered romney but not too keen as i believe they aren't AS good meat as various others?
not really sure why i haven't got my heart set of Lleyn apart from the hardiness of easy care
and i hear easy care have a rather variable temperament?
any thing else i should be aware of with either of these breeds? good or bad?
any other breeds i should look at/consider?
Cheers Ed
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Do you plan to sell the meat by the kilo or by the half lamb? If the former, then you want a breed that has a good carcase - plenty of meat and not too much fat. If selling by the half lamb then it needs to be superb meat, and a reason for people to buy it - so the local breed is usually popular ;)
Whereabouts are you? In Wales near the Lleyn Peninsular, perhaps?
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Do you plan to sell the meat by the kilo or by the half lamb? If the former, then you want a breed that has a good carcase - plenty of meat and not too much fat. If selling by the half lamb then it needs to be superb meat, and a reason for people to buy it - so the local breed is usually popular ;)
Whereabouts are you? In Wales near the Lleyn Peninsular, perhaps?
probably looking at selling by the half and whole pig (experience of pig keeping coming in here but no one sells a quarter lamb do they?)
no where near the origin of the Lleyn I am down in Kent, England! I would source the Lleyn lambs from the man i have been working for
Cheers Ed
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You won't go far wrong if you get Lleyn. They milk like dairy cattle and lamb easy.Good strong, up on their feet lambs that grow on well.
Finish on grass without supplements.
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If you've a local source and you like them, then why not. Not the most muscley of carcases, but perfectly acceptable. Go for it!
Otherwise, your local(ish) breeds would I guess be Southdown and Romney Marsh? Both perfectly acceptable for eating :)
And all three breeds can have nice fleeces, if you fancied clipping them before sending them away, and selling the fleeces to handspinners ... ;) :spin: :knit: Romney would probably be the best for that; as a longwool, even a 6-month old lamb would have enough length of fleece to make a good spin. Southdown and Lleyn may be a bit short still at that age - but if they're nice, and at least 2" stretched, you'd still get handspinners interested.
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I'm spinning Romney at the moment and it's lovely :spin: :thumbsup:
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I love Romney. It's not as soft and lustrous as some longwools, but there's just something about its character, you want to comb it and spin it. :) :spin:
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Selling a 1/4 lamb? I have. You need to work out how you intend to sell the meat.
It is easiest to sell by the half but if it is to family/friends, some of them may not want whole leg/shoulder joints and you can have them halved by the butcher. Bear in mind that the supermarkets at Easter had their lamb joints knocked down to around £4 a kilo >:( . If you want to sell direct, try and get yourself a little niche market and promote your meat as local/low food miles/ high welfare etc and present it nicely when you deliver. Good luck :thumbsup:
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Southdown and Portland vie for the title of breed giving the sweetest-tasting lamb. If you're close to the South Downs National Park there's a marketing scheme spefically for SD's.
My own experience with 20 Lleyns left me very unimpressed and with two huge bills - one for the vet and one for the knackerman!
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:wave: easycare and lleyn are not that different with there wool of . if you plan on selling killing lambs live you will get less for pure easycares i am afraid . they just look smaller as there is 4 - 6 inch less of wool. they still do ok but will never top the sale. but you can have pure easycare ewes and put to a more meat tup . i put some to the beltex this year look good so far .going to try a newzeland suffolk this year or perhaps a hampshire down . on the meat side i rekon the charollais takes a bit of beating . decent carcass and really sweet lamb . soay and soay mutton is great almost gamey. you can pick them up for penuts but its a far smaller carcass costs the same as a sheep double the weight to kill/ butcher . but if you have a low buying cost might work out much same :-\ gave my mate the leg of an 8 year old soay ewe a couple of months ago rekons was the "best lamb he ever had but a little tough"and he moans for fun . if only he knew eh :-J
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Romney lamb is seriously yummy!! I slaughter mine at around 8 months old, grass kept all the way, loads of compliments on how tasty the lamb is. Romney ewes are very easy lambers, never had to assist, very good mothers.
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thanks all for the replies! looks like i am looking mainly at romney then as my mum knows a few knitters and spinners and enjoy such activities my self so could spin a bit at least on a spindle to sell as ready wool
how do romney and lleyn compare in how much you can charge for the meat? and size/weight of 6-8 month lamb dead and butchered?
Cheers Ed
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a quick google search suggests romney have a nice quiet temperament, can any one confirm this?
if so then they would appear to fit the bill nicely so long as they product plenty of meat, at least as much as a dead lleyn
Cheers Ed
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Romneys have fab temperaments, even my ram is a pussy cat. I have no idea what weight my lambs are at slaughter, but at around 8 months they are perfect condition for slaughter, pretty much the same size as their mums, i sell them at £130 per whole lamb butchered. Mine dont tend to be as tall as some of my other lambs but once they are slaughter and the feet etc are chopped off the carcases are the same :innocent:
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Romneys have fab temperaments, even my ram is a pussy cat. I have no idea what weight my lambs are at slaughter, but at around 8 months they are perfect condition for slaughter, pretty much the same size as their mums, i sell them at £130 per whole lamb butchered. Mine dont tend to be as tall as some of my other lambs but once they are slaughter and the feet etc are chopped off the carcases are the same :innocent:
thanks, a great help! considering the ease of lambing the yuminess of the meat and the yield of meat and the nice wool and the pet rams! i think romney might be the one for me :D
thanks all, goes and looks up romney breeders near me
Cheers Ed
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If you are selling fat lambs through market you need to rear what sells well so probably more of a commercial breed, Texel, Lleyn Charolais etc. Go to your local market and see what breeds are there, most will be crosses but there's no point breeding fat lambs if they are not popular at your local market.
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If you are selling fat lambs through market you need to rear what sells well so probably more of a commercial breed, Texel, Lleyn Charolais etc. Go to your local market and see what breeds are there, most will be crosses but there's no point breeding fat lambs if they are not popular at your local market.
selling to private buyers already dead and butchered namely friends and family
Cheers Ed
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sorry back again!
the different specimens of these things :sheep: still confuse me! not sure to get the romney or the lleyn? for 3 lambs would it be worth getting a shearer in just before slaughter in autum/early winter(before any chance of snow or even frost hopefully) would they have enough fleece on them? this is if i were to get romney.
when i get them slaughtered do i get the skin with fleece on back as standard or do i have to pay extra for this?
Cheers Ed
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Why would you want to shear autumn/early winter?
When mine are home slaughtered i can keep whatever skins i want, Romney skins make amazing sheepskin rugs. My slaughterman only gets £1 per skin from whoever he sells to so he is not bothered either way. I keep the good skins with decent fleece on and let him take the rubbish ones away!
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Why would you want to shear autumn/early winter?
When mine are home slaughtered i can keep whatever skins i want, Romney skins make amazing sheepskin rugs. My slaughterman only gets £1 per skin from whoever he sells to so he is not bothered either way. I keep the good skins with decent fleece on and let him take the rubbish ones away!
it would be as i would be buying the lambs in in spring and then slaughtering autumn or early winter when i slaughter them
as i would be taking them to an abattoir i will just make make sure i get the skins back as we love sheep skins here and can probably sell at least one
do you tan them yourself? or who does this for you?
Cheers Ed
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I sent mine to Devonia Products. They are in North Devon but the closest to me in Hampshire, i think they are the only tannery in the south of England, unless anyone else on here knows of somewhere!? I think it is about £26 per skin, plus postage. The postage is the costly bit as they are so heavy when you send them. You have to salt them before they are sent. My house is full of sheepskin rugs, I sell a few, and also use them as wedding presents etc!!
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Normally the abattoir take the skins so you would need to ask if you can have them back, it's almost an unwritten rule that the abattoir keep the skins, we are never asked if we want ours back. If you want to tan the skins I think lambs have to be slaughtered by a certain date- down breeds by middle of oct latest and hill breeds by 1st Nov in the year that they were lambed so that is something to bare in mind if you're buying primitives.
Trish did you just ask your abattoir for the skins back? I'd quite like to get some of ours done but never know where to start.
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Normally the abattoir take the skins so you would need to ask if you can have them back, it's almost an unwritten rule that the abattoir keep the skins, we are never asked if we want ours back. If you want to tan the skins I think lambs have to be slaughtered by a certain date- down breeds by middle of oct latest and hill breeds by 1st Nov in the year that they were lambed so that is something to bare in mind if you're buying primitives.
the slaughter dates and the fact it would probably be a hassle to get my skins back and then i would probably have to send the skins off and pay to have them tanned properly etc means it's hardly worth getting romney for the sake of the wool :(
well actually lets do some maths :) how much could i charge for a romney skin with wool on obviously? and how much does it cost to send skins off for tanning? rough figures is all i'm after?
so far as i have heard romney meat is as good as lleyn and vice versa?
Cheers Ed
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I have mine home slaughtered so i wouldnt know about an abattoir, i do know that the skins are only worth about a pound though, so an abattoir should let you have them.
Mine normally get slaughtered sept - oct time. I have had skins tanned from jan slaughtering, they were fine, but tried an older ewe and that was rejected as the wool was too loose in the skin, that was a january one.
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You are not going to make your fortune selling a few sheepskin rugs unfortunately!!! It costs approx £40 including postage both ways to get my skins tanned. If i am lucky, and the rug is gorgeous, i can sell it for £60. However, there are smaller, inferior sheepskin rugs for sale everywhere for around £30!! I just look at it as an added £10 to £20 bonus on top of the lamb. Also lovely to keep and to give as presents.
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How do you know which to select to send for tanning? I presume they can't have any marker spray on? I might ask the abattoir next when I book some in if I can keep a couple of the skins, do you need to book them in with Devonia? I'd like to make some rugs/throws :)
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I think the marker spray comes out in the tanning process but dont quote me on that!! I go for the largest skins, which have a nice shape, no bald patches and a good even covering of wool. If you are getting late into the season (winter!) give the wool a good tug, if it comes away from the skin then its no good. Check the underside of the skin, if there has been any flystrike or the lamb has been injured in anyway you will see damage to the skin, that is no good. Also, take care when handling at slaughter, the same goes for the meat quality, lambs handled by pulling on the wool not only damages the meat but also the skin.
Just give Devonia a ring, you can either deliver to them or post, depending on where you are!! I just ring up and tell them i have posted for example 4 skins, 2 black and 2 white. I always try and vacumn pack the skins in a bin liner, pushing out as much air so they get smaller and smaller! then double bag them again in bin liners, then put in a postage plastic bag.
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Ed,
Our abattoir charges £5 each for the skins and they need to know beforehand that you want them for the tannery. The salt needs to go on asap (within the hour preferably). There is a bit of a technique to it, Devonia advised me at least 1kg per skin.
The best time to send on the lambs or hoggets is in the autumn when the fleece is not matted and no more than about 4-5" long (it jams in the machines). When I collected my last lot Devonia said a large % of the skins submitted after Xmas were being rejected. It is really galling to lose them after all the hard work and waiting :( so pick your time.
Very happy with my last lot which I have recently received from Devonia, waiting time of approx 20 weeks. I sell for £45 -75, the quality and size varies, so not a lot of profit but great for presents. At our local ag. show they were selling beautiful skins for £45 but they are tanned in Poland.
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Ed, you would quite possibly be able to sell the fleece from Romney lambs clipped before slaughter. Handspinners would be your target market. Good Teeswater lambs' fleece sells for around £10-£15/kilo, so I don't see why nice Romney wouldn't fetch maybe £8-12/kilo. I paid £30 for a lovely Teeswater lamb's fleece last year from a very reputable seller and would be happy to pay £20-£25ish for an equally nice Romney lamb's fleece.
You'd need to be good at selecting the ones that were worth selling, and skirting them well so that handspinners got - and paid for - only lovely fibre. You would soon get a reputation if you did this well.
Lleyns wouldn't have enough staple length as lambs, I would have thought, but the Romney being a longwool there should be enough to make it worthwhile clipping.
Having said which, I had BH hand-shear my - wait for it - Shetland x Charollais x Beltex x Blue-faced Leicester x Swaledale tup lamb at 9 months old as he went for slaughter, and the fleece is just lovely. :excited: :spin: :knit: