The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Community => Coffee Lounge => Topic started by: RUSTYME on February 23, 2013, 07:26:56 pm
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I am 55 , 5' 9" and about 11-12 stone , don't have scales .
I don't think i need to lose any weight , quite happy as i am anway . But , i want to eat as healthily as i can .
I basically grow my own veg and i don't eat too much crap food .
I am not a veggie , but can't afford proper meat , so basically buy mince etc .
The latest food debacle has prompted me to make the move to rear my own meat again , ie chicken , quail , sheep , beef , pork .
Although i have worked in an abattoir , i do have problems with the killing side of things , gone soft !
Anyway , that can be sorted ok .
The meat from any stock will feed me , my family , and my dogs , so there will be no waste . The skins , hides etc will be cured and tanned so again no waste .
The manure from the stock will provide the fertilizer for the grass and the veg , and waste veg , trimmings etc , will do the same , so all veg and stock will be as healthy and free of chemicals as possible . Thus , my food will be 'clean' .
My only problem will then be arriving at a correct balance of nutrients and calories to suit my lifestyle , which is relatively an active one .
I can supply all my own veg , meat , dairy , even all my grain needs , ie , wheat , barley , oats , rye , millet etc , although i will still need to buy in haylage (organic) for the horses and any other stock that needs it .
Halfway there on the whole thing , just need the final jump .
Got to get some durum wheat seed for pasta too ! , and some more rice , the horses ate the last lot just as it started to form seed , sods !
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My only problem will then be arriving at a correct balance of nutrients and calories to suit my lifestyle , which is relatively an active one .
There is some really interesting info in the book "Nourishing Traditions" by Sally Fallon about what we need, particularly our need for animal fats. If you can get a milking goat then that would provide a lot of what you require.
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The need for animals is more for the milk/cheese, hides and wool for clothing plus manure. So it is not so iportant to have many animals for food, especially if you only slaughter with reluctance. When not eating much meat which supplies Homo Sapiens with the correct amino acids in balance ;D it is important to provide this balance by a varied diet. Milk, seeds, grain and beans/peas/peanuts and nuts. So, your vegetable garden along with goats, sheep, hens (eggs) Hazel nuts, sunflower seeds and linseed, fruit and you are king of the castle.
I make my pasta from ordinary flour, works fine but then again I eat to live, not live to eat .
you mentioned how many sheep you would need in an earlier thread and I never got round to replying. Work out how much clothing you will require and take it from there . I am sure you can repair cloths. Animals take a lot of caring for so keep as few as is necessary. (Says me who has 100 sheep) :innocent:
Good luck with your plans.
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Interesting that we/I know a little about dogs requirements, well sort of, but not about humans, they tell us how many calories but I suppose what you need is some dietitian to break down the food groups etc, is it possible to grow enough meat cheaply enough? I am only saying as its often cheaper to buy meat, now I can understand why that would be of concern, do you ever think of hunting? we got game from beating with the hunt, a good day out and a bonus of the meat.
I know I over eat, not too much meat though, and I, like many others react badly to wheat and milk products, still eat them though :innocent:
I often mention my brother but he has been on a low budget for donkies and often tells me the best way to get his protein, he eats whatever he finds the cheapest, often things like cottage cheese or eggs and different varieties of cheap cheese of course. Fish is also fantastic but now Mackerel appears to be getting a bad press!!!
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Just to throw this in here and I know off topic but isn't the cheap cheese just fat?
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I think that would be a good idea Rustyme. I bring on a couple of lambs and pigs for our freezer just so I know there are no chemicals but it is not a cheap way to get meat. A simple blood test at the doctors would tell you if you were lacking in anything. Your diet sounds good and your thoughts on your way to live even better. Private slaughter is getting harder though so may be a problem for you.
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Mackerel has always had bad press - they are scavengers - they'll eat anything ::) But boy do they taste good :excited:
You could dig a pond Russ, and breed carp :excited:
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As a rough guide, your plateful for your main meal should be half vegetables, quarter carbohydrate - potato, rice, pasta, etc - and quarter protein - meat, cheese, eggs, pulses, beans, etc.
When I had a largish flock of hens (20+) and a disinclination to kill them, I would take four live hens to a friend who would slaughter, pluck and dress them then give me two back. It suited us both.
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As a rough guide, your plateful for your main meal should be half vegetables, quarter carbohydrate - potato, rice, pasta, etc - and quarter protein - meat, cheese, eggs, pulses, beans, etc.
:thumbsup: you learn something new every day, I think my problem is big plates :innocent:
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Same here I think :innocent:
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Cheers all .
Will check the book out cc .
I am not a 'foodie' at all , just eat to live too . What i have to eat i want as 'clean' as possible though .
I won't really need that much of anything for myself , but i don't mind rearing and growing more for the family etc .
I will be growing more sunflower , hemp , linseed , poppy , amaranthus etc, for a mix of the seed , oil , fibre .
Tons of hazle here , just have to beat the fluffy tailed tree rats .
As for wool , i went for cotswolds because i have kept them before and you get loads of wool !
I won't need all i get from say 5 or 6 for jumpers and cloth but as things get tighter in times to come , the family will welcome any excess .
Sheep will also even up the grass after the horses , and help reduce the worm burden .
I worked on a farm that produced all the food to feed the pigs , sheep , cattle and chickens .
In fact grinding the barley and oats to feed them was how i got farmers lung ! lol .
I would go the barter route for my meat , but nearly everyone i know buys in their pig feed or sheep nuts etc , and i don't want to eat that crap anymore .
I can grow enough food to feed a couple of pigs , a few sheep , even a couple of cows with the extra haylage , plus rear the young .
The whole lot only comes to about 10 animals plus the chickens , and the young .
Enough to provide all my needs and keep me busy enough , as well as some for the family .
I may dig a couple of fish ponds , but i am sick of digging lol , but i would probably go for trout , carp are a bit yuk for me . I have reared both before , carp were easier , but trout tasted better .
Got plenty of wild roses for hip syrup , millions of blackberries , plus my rasberries , strawberries , blueberries , black/white/red and pink currants , will be getting black and white grapes plus some hops , then apple , pear , plum , apricot , gage , mulberry , cherry trees , so i should have most things covered , even going to grow my own tea ! Speaking of which , time for a cuppa .
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Wondering how you would make haylage?. Bees might be an idea. You would'nt get such a big surplus as yhey would need a lot of their own honey to keep them through the winter. But then again, you don't have 7 months winter ::)
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and I, like many others react badly to wheat
Have you tried making a habit of using a sour dough starter? With many people it is not the gluten but the enzymes in wheat that need a going over (Can't think of the word in English and I refuse to Google translate into my native language :huff:) factory white bread should have a health warning on it like cigarettes.
I am lucky, I can fish in my neighbour's pond. Now it is ice fishing - bore a hole through the foot of ice and the fish nearly jump into your lap.
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As a rough guide, your plateful for your main meal should be half vegetables, quarter carbohydrate - potato, rice, pasta, etc - and quarter protein - meat, cheese, eggs, pulses, beans, etc.
:thumbsup: you learn something new every day, I think my problem is big plates :innocent:
The first thing all the Slimming clubs tell you is to use a smaller plate than usual. It's a 'mind' thing ::) I always use a fish plate now - never a full size dinner plate
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This is a good post, I'm going to take a leaf out of your book Rustyme and I like that diagram plate thingy - going to draw that one out and pin it up in the kitchen to remind me.
We have black slate tiles behind the aga which we use for drawing with chalk our 5 a day chart - kids like it - its a good reminded if you haven't eaten your 5 a day for 2 or 3 days, it's easy to forget what you've eaten a couple of days ago and you can easily cheat yourself into thinking you are eating healthy. Must start that up again. Good time to start it in spring.
Thanks for the reminder Rustyme, we 50plus have to take a bit extra care. :wave:
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Renee , haylage is just cut grass wrapped in plastic and fermented , sort of halfway between hay and silage .
I wouldn't be able to make it as i don't have the wrapper or big baler .
I buy mine in @ £25 per bale delivered , a bale lasts 9 days approx .
The stuff i get can vary in type , depending on the field it was cut from , time of year and moisture content . It can be like meadow hay to almost silage , moisture can vary too , the horses cope fine with all types though .
I have had bees . Lost some due to varoa mites and others to colony collapse . Will be cleaning out the hives again this spring .
I still have a jar or two of home made honey and some wax .
I will also be growing more sugar beet this year , enough to supply all my sugar needs , the waste pulp being animal feed .
I grew a few last year and got a few lbs of sugar , saved a few quid .
I didn't weigh it , but i got about 4lb-5lb of sugar and a a few buckets of pulp from a 15' row of s/beet . The pulp i mixed with the last of my home grown barley and oats . I lost nearly all last years grain due to weather , it got flattened by rain .
I only have 3lb of my old variety wheat for sowing now , will sow that in the autumn and hope !
Will have to buy some oats , barley and rye as i used the last of the seed on the failed crop .
I do have a small packet of oats from a few plants that survived last year , 200+ seeds , so may get a couple of pound from them ?
Just had home made honey on toast , made from the last of my home grown wheat , ( square heads master , 2011 ) .
I do cheat and use packet yeast and a breadmaker
though .
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In BH's younger days they used to make haylage in plastic bags - just fill them really full, seal, and there you go.
On one of the Victorian or Edwardian Farm programmes, they showed them making a silage clamp - digging a flat-bottomed trench, filling it with cut grass, covering it with sticks, straw and earth to seal it. We've never managed to catch the episode - if there is one - where they open it up and use it. We'd love to try it if it works.
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just to clarify, mackerel are a pelagic species, they are one of the most agressive species and are hunters not scavangers.
now cod, they WILL eat anything. true scavangers like mullet.
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Renee , haylage is just cut grass wrapped in plastic and fermented , sort of halfway between hay and silage .
I wouldn't be able to make it as i don't have the wrapper or big baler .
Thank you for being so patient with me ;)
I have haylage- this year mine is halfway between silage and concrete because it is frozen solid. I am using a pick axe to split it. Rambo would admire my muscles. No, I was meaning in the future when you have even less money. Stuffing it in plastic bags very rarely works :-\
Up here the older farmers still use the rack drieing sysem, I believe they do also in Wales.
THis hay is my fiend Anders'. He is 85 and this is his last hay harvest. There was no sun this summer-his hay turned mouldy so he has sold his sheep :'(
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-iJzpfXs5Tco/TjB0ZAo8rkI/AAAAAAAAHwE/ZtFcS6T_kuY/s576/IMG_3675.JPG?gl=SE)
I forgot you had sugar. I swop eggs for honey but will have my own bees. Here in Jämtland we do not have the V.virus. The E.U says we cannot refuse to import foreign bees but no-one will so we only have our own strain of Jämtlandske bees. second hand equipment from out of the county is also a nasty word for the same reason.
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In BH's younger days they used to make haylage in plastic bags - just fill them really full, seal, and there you go.
We silaged our fodder maize in Denmark. The animals loved it. Chopped straw in a trench, maize, more straw, blach plastic then drive over it with the tractor to get all the air out. The biggest problem was the crows -ey loved it as well-
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just to clarify, mackerel are a pelagic species, they are one of the most agressive species and are hunters not scavangers.
now cod, they WILL eat anything. true scavangers like mullet.
Thanks for the correction, DITW - I was told they were scavengers by an old fisherman on Loch Long - he told us as teenagers that they'd eat poop that was washed into the Loch. He must have been wrong, either that or scaring us off so there was more for him. I don't think there's much cod or mullet in Loch Long. :eyelashes:
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Sorry renee , misread your question .
I will always have some money and i can do a few hours work to get the money for haylage if need be .
I have tried the plastic bag method of making haylage , made good compost !
Last time i looked , the bags cost £2 + each , so forget that !
I do want to avoid using any plastic , but wrap on big bales is unavoidable atm . Hay is way to dear , if you can find it .
I have nearly a 2 acre field that grows good hay , and enough of it to get me through . But taking that field out of the summer feeding means i need more haylage to get through ! Bit of a catch 22 really , as i can't guarantee one cut of hay let alone two . Plus the horses jump the fence to get at it just when it is ready to cut !
They have also eaten 1500 willow plants , 2 apple trees , 2 pear , 2 plum and 2 cherry trees , they like expensive food lol . I'm thinking about selling burgers !
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Sally - it must have been Edwardian Farm, we've just watched the dvd of Victorian Farm as we don't have regular telly and I didn't see that on it (unless I was putting the kettle on at that time).
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I want to grow veggies, but I cant until the boys are fenced in properly. Hopefully we can get it done this spring/summer and get growing next year. OH has promised me a greenhouse so that I can do all my salad stuff. Ive tried doing tomatoes outdoors twice, and each time, they have been attacked with blight. I also want to do runner beans as you dont really get them over here. The boys would be in heaven if I tried to do them without fencing them in first.
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From a nutritional point of view, the flat bread they make here from barley and pea flour is very useful. I love it with soup.
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I tried to make bread with dried beans but found it very difficult to grind them. Any suggestions?
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Ha, you have got me there. I can buy the flour at a small local mill. It is on an island in the big lake. A ferry in the summer, an ICE road now!!!Chick pea flour is sold at the Ethnic? shop in town. (80 miles away) So my suppliers are local :roflanim:
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Great thread thanks Rusty - making me think about growing some suagr beet. I switched away from layers pellets this year and make own grain mix...... but the thought of growing that grain is mind blowing! Getting pigs again in a few weeks and would love to avoid pellets. same with the sheep. I dont trust the so and sos - we cant even trust whats in our food chain let alone animal food.
On a slightly different notel - the 5:2 'diet' (though it is more a way of eating) is having a dramatic effect on my food bill, weight and overall health - and the more I read about it, the more I believe that it is the way our bodies have evolved to be fueled (not the constant grazing (and accociated disasterous effect on insulin and cholesterol) that has that has become a norm for many of us :innocent: - if you have good enough braodband Rusty, you might be interested in the Horizon programme on intermittent fasting and its (positive) effects on the body http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xvdbtt_eat-fast-live-longer-hd_shortfilms?fb_action_ids=10151258734623195&fb_action_types=og.likes&fb_ref=.UPwG9-IqE3Q.like&fb_source=aggregation&fb_aggregation_id=288381481237582#.UQK-UvImbTp (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xvdbtt_eat-fast-live-longer-hd_shortfilms?fb_action_ids=10151258734623195&fb_action_types=og.likes&fb_ref=.UPwG9-IqE3Q.like&fb_source=aggregation&fb_aggregation_id=288381481237582#.UQK-UvImbTp) .
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No bb here now , almost off the system , so only got the mobile to get on the net with .
All depends how much grain needed , but oats , barley , wheat and rye are grasses and grow as easy , although they do get flattened by rain etc lol .
You can get 1lb-2lb per sq yd , even more from millets and amaranth .
Mangels , fodder beet even sugar beet , basically all the same thing , produce huge amounts of food for stock .
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FiB can you possibly give us the video in a few sentences, don't have time to watch that but sounds really interesting, I tend to graze and starve, graze and starve, forget to eat sometimes when I'm outside busy, should probably have more structure really.
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I shall watch it later too, I do notice I have a lot of food intollerances, I think 2 of my 3 girls do as well.
Once I get some order back in my life (and some money) I will go back onto my diet, I did used to fast years and years ago, I know I certainly eat far too much!
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Very interesting thread .... especially as we just starting up with smallholding and are both wrong side of 50 with all the additional aches and pains which seem to arrive with that birthday! Inspired to think more about what we rear/ grow for ourselves ..... but with all this talk of food I'll just have to go for a snack first!
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Re the clamp - it was Wartime Farm that did the silage in a clamp of corrugated tin/scraps, heavily promoted by the government.
Rustyme, wouls something other than hay work (mangels etc) or do you need the pasture for grazing as well as grass?
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Backinwellies, I notice more and more how food effects me, more aches and pains if/when i eat certain things, one example is, we were going on a dog walk and I went to the shop to buy some milk and saw some spring rolls reduced so, I bought them, I ate 2 and started walking, within 10 min I could hardly breath, kept burrrping (squeeze me) and my legs went like jelly and I actually thought seriously about staying where I was on our walk and being carried back to the car, :roflanim: however, after a few more burrrrrrrps, I began to recover and after around 40 mins was as OK, I know the same happens with milk products, I often feel faint after milk, same with too much grain, some foods make me ache so badly in the morning and coffee gives me very bad migraine if I drink more than a cup, same with chocolate, I hate faddy eaters but at least understand how some of us cannot eat certain things, I know I am best eating veg meat and fish.. I can drink wine and whiskey however :innocent:
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FiB can you possibly give us the video in a few sentences, don't have time to watch that but sounds really interesting, I tend to graze and starve, graze and starve, forget to eat sometimes when I'm outside busy, should probably have more structure really.
I'll try.... :thinking:
Michael Mosely (a doctor and science journalist for the BBC) goes on a quest to look at all the research on living longer... and it seemed to him that calorie restriction was where it was at - (now this bit is like the childrens book 'Dear Zoo'!!) He looked at 'CRONies' (calories restriction for optimal nutrition - it was too hard and boring, he looked at fasting (thats proper fasting) for 4-5 day periods - too hard.... he tried alternate day calorie restriction - also worked, but couldnt see himself doing it for life... and then decide to try 5:2 (Calorie restriction 600/500 cals man/woman 2 days and eat normally other 5) .... and it was JUUUST right!!! He was not very overweight but carrying an extra stone or 2, a few inches around the waist.....found to be a tofi (thin outside, fat inside) with lots of fat around organs and middle and dangerous fasting glucose, bad cholesterol and IGC1 (growth hormone - high levels in adults may be a factor in cancer). He was about to go onto medication... End of story, post 6 weeks of 5:2 all bloods normal, Wife GP amazed, all happy!!! He was particularly motivated because of family history of Stroke, Diabetes Prostate cancer and Dementia (studies on mice also seem to point to this as a dementia preventer) If you want more science MMs book has it or this nurse has just written one... http://www.amazon.co.uk/Fasting-Fitness-Science-Laymans-ebook/dp/B00BJGI0GK/ref=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1361985707&sr=1-1 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Fasting-Fitness-Science-Laymans-ebook/dp/B00BJGI0GK/ref=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1361985707&sr=1-1) . I dont have blood tests to go on but am saving a fortune and can finally (after 10 years) get into pre-preg jeans ;D ;D ;D Trying to Lure OH onto it as he is just on the edge of medication like MM lost his dad early to heart failure and has a mum with Diabetes and strokes..... A bit of a thread diversion, but inkeeping with the idea of eating for optimum health?
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Thanks FiB, so it's 2 'rest' days for your digestion sounds like and then eat normall (not making up for the 2 days of course :innocent: ). It sounds do-able. So say you could not eat much on a Wednesday and Thursday and eat normmaly the rest of the week, or not eat much say Tuesday and Thursday to split it up so you don't get hungry.. hmm, think that may be a plan. Thanks FiB.
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Thanks FiB, so it's 2 'rest' days for your digestion sounds like and then eat normall (not making up for the 2 days of course :innocent: ). It sounds do-able. So say you could not eat much on a Wednesday and Thursday and eat normmaly the rest of the week, or not eat much say Tuesday and Thursday to split it up so you don't get hungry.. hmm, think that may be a plan. Thanks FiB.
You got it. (2 days in a row might be a bit hardcore - the mantra for this way of eating is 'I can have it tomorrow!!') Yep really working for me, my pants started falling down today (under several layers of trousers and waterproofs of course, so not easy to hitch up)!!! If you are on Facebook there is a group with lots of food ideas for those 500 cal days http://www.facebook.com/#!/groups/the52diet/ (http://www.facebook.com/#!/groups/the52diet/)
Right not going to mention it again else people will think I am a nutter. Good Luck Goosepimple.