The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Camelids => Topic started by: Orinoco on January 30, 2013, 04:14:24 pm
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Hi
We are just about to invest in some Alpaca's but we currently only have 4 acre's so we cannot work towards profits from breeding and I wanted to question our motives and options before we paid out for anything.
Our intentions are to use them as an attraction for the holiday lets, to use the fibre for crafts, possibly craft workshops (we will eventually have 4 holiday lets and live in walking distance from 3 decent sized caravan parks, so profiting from holiday makers could be possible), to guard the chickens and maybe sell one or two.
On this basis we are looking for friendly animals with good a good fleece.
Currently we are bringing in an income from other work which we hope to reduce /give up in the near future and this is why I am questioning our motives, we want alpaca's but can we make them at least pay for themselves.
I wondered if there was anyone out there making a profit or covering their costs or should these be considered a luxury animal (I am not bothered about the initial purchase price, just running costs so to speak).
I also realise there are alot of farmers who have strong opinions about these been a waste of time but I was interested to hear from anyone who had alpaca's.
All info/experiences/advice welcome
Thanks
K
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They are unpopular with farmers partly due to the 'waste of good land' view but also because they are very prone to catching TB and that is a massive issue esp as there are no movement controls and the tests aren't as predictive in camelids.
They have also been a bit of a pyramid sales scheme, with mostly the only people making money being those selling more breeding stock to others rather than from any end product market. With the economy as it is, the wheels start to come off the wagon.
I would get them if you love them and think they will help attract more customers to the cottages than they cost to keep, but not as a standalone profit base.
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would add .... dont bank on them to protect chickens - my nextdoor neighbour has them but has given up with poultry after 2 years of fox kill of their turkeys and chickens :-[ .. Also they are very flighty with anyone but their owners - so nice to look at for visitors, but not much scope for petting/interaction?
We stayed at a lovely yurt campsite once and there was a 'keep away from the alpacas' instruction (becasue they got stressed around strangers)!!! Be better off with pet lambs? Our visitors love petting our tame sheep (we''ve only the one who was raised on the bottle and loves a stroke, but she is fab and I'd deffo keep any pet lambs we end up rearing for that reason) and chickens. Good luck, Fi xx
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What about using them as "beasts of burden" and offer walking holidays? You could either rent them for circular day trips with picnic hamper or team up with others to design a walking holiday. Punters can walk with their packs on the Alpacas, stop for lunch and then turn up for evening meal at the next B&B or campsite.
Renting a donkey to carry packs is very popular just south of us. Walkers can skip a day of what they think will be difficult treks if you can shuttle them to the next site. Activities en route can be arranged and the evening meal with "free wine and beer" is always a good attraction for little cost ( How much wine will someone in hiking socks, singing " Val-deri,val-dera" drink ;D ).
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How about Angora goats instead? Fantastic fibre for crafts, can be tame and love to be hand fed, a definite curiosity feature (everyone thinks they're sheep). Much cheaper to buy and fairly easy to look after just need feet trimming regularly and shelter :goat: :) :goat:
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someone down here in cornwall is making alpaca sausages to great acclaim.
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someone down here in cornwall is making alpaca sausages to great acclaim.
And do you need to take out a second mortgage to afford them ( the sausages I mean?).....
Re original question: There are more interesting ways to squander money....
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well, it seems to be quite a successful buisness.
http://www.hendrafarmcottages.co.uk/hendrafarm/hand-reared-farm-produce.html (http://www.hendrafarmcottages.co.uk/hendrafarm/hand-reared-farm-produce.html)
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Prior to buying goats, we considered alpacas. I went to Moreton show and spoke to the Alpaca breeders there - they left me in no doubt that it wasn't for us. This is going back 3 years, things might have changed, but the feeling there was that the alpacas were more hobby than business and those involved were feeling quite despondent. If you can make lovely things out of the fleeces your self you might be in with a chance of making some money but they told me that the fleece didn't fetch much, the cost to keep far outweighed the benefits back and the alpacas themselves are not cheap! On top of all of this, in the time I stood chatting not one animal came over to be inquisitive or show any interest in humans. Not what I wanted. Maybe my experience is not truly reflective? I don't know. I bought goats and now have quite a successful income from a business attached to goats milk (plus goats that are really friendly and good pets too!)
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Hi
Thanks for that, I think I already know all this, but am trying to find a way as would love to have them, BUT we only have 4 acres and if we buy Alpaca's that will be the land used.
We have also considered goats for a similar reason for the milk, poss cheese and we have even thought about the meat (just not sure if we can bring ourselves to but I think it needs to be considered).
You say you are able to provide a decent income from just the milk, how many do you have and over what land size.
I am thinking of making things out of the fleece myself and I know the fleece is cheap (so in theory the sensible thing to do would be buy the fleece from other breeders)
Sometimes you know what the sensible thing to do is but need to hear it from others. Anyway not rushing into anything (I have costings and business plan to roughly put together first so we can seriously think about stepping back from work (the paid type).
Thanks
K
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I'm thinking of getting a couple of Alpacas for similar reasons. We've got a bit more land and the plan would be to graze them with sheep rotating around 3 paddocks(also hoping they'd keep foxes away). I thought they'd be a sort of attraction for holiday cottage guests too and was going to get ones that are halter trained, as much to make it easy to move them as anything else. I think they're beautiful to look at and would love to have a play around with the fleece. But even for gelded males, they're still expensive for an animal that has little commercial value. The required fencing is still low on our priority list so it'll be at least another couple of years before we get them and by then I'm hoping the value has dropped. My impression is that a lot of breeders have made a bundle out of them but there can only be so much demand for them. In short, I'm not expecting to make money out of them but will wait until we can afford expensive pets (OK, maybe not so much pets because they don't like to be petted) - either because their price drops or because we get richer (hmmm).
H
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Hi there,
We have kept alpacas for around 5 years now. We are breeders and our current herd stands at 40 of mixed huacaya and suri.
We have been very successful at selling our alpacas as pets and to other people wanting guardians or to have smaller breeding herds. We are also members of BAS.
There is most definately demand for alpacas in the UK for both the fibre industry and to people wanting pets / breeding business.
We also take small groups of alpacas to Care Homes, Schools and other events throughout the year and they are a major attraction at many events.
Personally, I could not be more positive about our experiences with an alpaca business as it has been a very positive venture for us.
I am more than happy for you to PM me with any questions that you may have about alpacas.
Kind Regards.
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And there's Glennshens reinforcing that the only way to make money out of alpacas is to breed and sell them.
No doubt sausages are a good sideline if you already have a business breeding and selling them.
I am thinking of making things out of the fleece myself and I know the fleece is cheap (so in theory the sensible thing to do would be buy the fleece from other breeders)
Sometimes you know what the sensible thing to do is but need to hear it from others.
:thumbsup:
Also, if you buy your fleece you can choose the colours, type, always buy fleece from a shearling, etc, etc. And if you do find you are making money with your craftwork, enough to cover the costs of owning a few - and you still want some - well, then you can always get into alpacas later once that business model is clear.
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Hello I am new to this website but have kept a few alpacas for a number of years. I am now looking to sell them as i don't have enough grazing and want to concentrate on sheep and pigs for the freezer. I have 2 wethers and 2 girls for sale. One boy in particular likes to be stroked and is very friendly. The other boy and youngest girl will also come up to you and feed from your hand and would with more handling become more friendly. If you are interested please let me know.
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Hi
If you could pm me with some photos and fleece details.
Ta
K
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Will pm after work today once I have worked out how to - I am new to forums :)
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I personally think that llamas make better guards for sheep and goats certainly, I am not sure that either will be much good at protecting chickens unless they live in the same area! You can also use llamas as pack animals for going on walks and picnics as well as being able to use their fiber *although it is not as soft as alpaca. Llamas are cheaper and most tourists will not be able to tell the difference anyway!
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Donkeys are also excellent at guarding sheep and poultry. They do NOT like strange dogs (or foxes) in their field. I have quite a job gathering the sheep when they are grazing the donkeys as the donkeys try and chase my sheepdog.
Also, donkeys are incredibly people friendly, and don't spit at those they don't like.
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One of my neighbours has spent a small fortune on them but is now practically giving them away. They are beautiful, I do not think I could take one to slaughter. Having kept a fair number of different types of animals I think pigs are easy, low cost and if you make a mistake you can eat it. I do fancy a water buffalo so if you know of anyone with some for sale.
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Hi
I have a clearer idea of what I want (although not clear enough to buy just yet), but the plan is to just get alpaca's as a tourist draw so only 3 and am looking/waiting for the right ones to come my way (I am aware that people are just starting to get out of alpaca's, the income isn't there for everyone, but cost of keeping them doesn't stop) I have a limited budget but need to make sure the ones I get have good fleeces (for me to use), have been handled alot and are the right temperment (hopefully halter trained), and I want 3 different colours.
So no rush, winter is on its way so I will only buy if the package is right for what I want long term, (they live along time).
It was suggested on this forum when I asked a while ago that goats would be a better option for milk, cheese and soap, although they require daily attention which I can't give just yet so another idea to ponder a while.
Love this site, soo much useful advice, where else would a new smallholder turn for advice and ideas.
K
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At least you're still on the same track. I've now abandoned the idea of alpacas all together. Latest plan is vineyard - south west facing, gently sloping chalk downland, good climate, hoping it makes more economic sense and is just as much a holiday cottage draw!
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Well if the wine is good ill come and try (my favourite pass time = wine).
K
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Just thought I would bump this.
Very sad. Went to Sedgemoor (Bridgewater) auctions on Thursday and they could barely give away both alpacas and llamas :( :( .
2012 born females with cria at foot went for 50 guineas and a 2009 white female for 20 guineas. Bought by farmers having a joke with each other. One man next to me said it was worth it just to cut them up and see what they were like :'(
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That's so sad to hear :'( . It was pretty obvious it was coming though. I had a subscription to Smallholding Magazine a few years ago. The classifieds had two columns of pigs, two of hens and a page and a half of Alpacas.
I'm sure those at the top of the pyramid did very well, and I'm sure others nearer the bottom have been very happy not to make a profit, but I imagine many ventures must end in tears.
I recently had a similar discussion with a friend about Zwartbles, and whether they might be similar. Now there's something to discuss!! :stir:
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I recently had a similar discussion with a friend about Zwartbles, and whether they might be similar. Now there's something to discuss!! :stir:
i remember when mangalitzas were £300 each.....not anymore. its just supply and demand.
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I always wanted to keep alpacas for their fibre and as pets - ended up with sheep as OH could see them on the table :yum: . I can cope with that now :relief: .
But having read more about the TB problems, we won't be getting any alpacas. We have 3 beef farmers surrounding us and I think we would become lepers ::) . And the badgers are down in the woods :innocent:
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someone down here in cornwall is making alpaca sausages to great acclaim.
Sorry Bramblecot to hi-jack your thread but have just spotted a dear friend, Deep in the Woods! Dave, where have you been and why a guest? Are you and Ellie alright? E-mail me.....lookfarpenny@hotmail.com
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Forgot to say, it's me, Sylvia
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Not my thread Sylvia ;D . No sign of DITW this year :-\ .
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Not my thread Sylvia ;D . No sign of DITW this year :-\ .
He's still alive and kicking, just not on here any longer. Try Facebook...
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Sorry, Bramblecot. Thank you, Dan. Don't do facebook but I dare say things will work out