The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Community => Coffee Lounge => Topic started by: Carolinajim on May 20, 2009, 12:16:26 am
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Looks like they want to install a national health system here in the US. What do you folks like or dislike about your system?
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Depends what you mean by a national health system. Most of our regulations come from Defra, but they don't apply to all people producing food. If we grow our own veg they don't apply, nor eggs if you have a very small flock - don't remember the number offhand. Bigger animals are covered. Defra have a reputation for being pedantic to say the least.
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Live in France, where 1/3rd of income is paid into the system. There is a top up insurance as the mandatory payment does not cover all the costs. However, everyone I know who has used the system has found it superb. You do have to pay pay pay for a good system though.
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I love it!! Rarely use it, but love the fact that the system is there for everyone who needs it
Ok, it has its faults and some of the waiting lists are excessive, but in an emergency situation it provides the immediate safety net that's needed
having watched sicko, i'd hate to live in America and rely on being in good health
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I grew up as a military kid and then went on to serve in the US military for quite a while...decades. So, I don't know much about our current system except that I pay a small premium each month to supplement my government retirement medical plan.
I kind of think I have been using a system similar to the programs in the UK and France for all my life.
I heard there were lotteries for certain kinds of health care. Wait lists were mentioned. What does that mean? Are you prohibited from going to a doctor who can provide the service needed?
What about the wealthy? What kind of rules apply to them?
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Just like in the US, money talks over here, there are several private health providers
basically you pay an insurance premium and should you need any treatment they will sort it out for you. Usually without the wait and using the latest/greatest methods and medicines
though there are plenty cases where the wealthy with medical insurance just get pointed in the direction of the NHS (National health Service) for their treatment
the main advantage of going private is that not all treatments are available on the NHS - elective treatments aren't covered - such as plastic surgery. Though some plastic surgery will be treated - i.e. if you've been in an accident. Some patients will get it if they can convince their doctor that they need it because it is causing them emotional or mental problems.
the other main advantage is that you can get treated much quicker
you get instances of oap's waiting years for a cataract operation or hip replacement. In some cases you won't get a cataract treatment on a single eye, they'll wait until both are affected and do them at the same time - which is damn inconvenient.
i'm sure there are loads of other cases where operations take months/years to get sorted (my partners father has to wait 2 years for treatment on a problem he is having with his ankle - though that is in ireland, not the UK)
my own advice is - if you can afford it, get private coverage - as you really don't want to mess about with your health or wait until something gets so bad you need emergency treatment or it affects your quality of life.
the NHS is great for emergencies but i wouldn't want to trust my overall well being and comfort in their service.
And i don't mind paying for it - i'm in good health now and rarely use it, but there are lots of folk less fortunate than me - and one day, i'll be old and i'll be in the hospital every other week needing some part of me fixed up!!
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I unashamedly have Private Medical Insurance. I am self employed and could not afford to be off work for months and months waiting for an operation through the NHS. Last year I ripped my Achilles tendon and treatment and surgery was instant, I could not fault their service. I also think that so long as I can afford to pay for this I am making the NHS queues just that wee bit shorter for others. The NHS do a tremendous service but sadly due to lack of funds (or mis spent budgets) their hands are tied.
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Sorry, I mis-read that first post - thought you meant health issues as regards small holding - animals, food etc. My apologies. duh!
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Doganjo, for food, as I understand it we have a similar system. Personal consumption is ok selling to the public is not without inspection...I believe.
Thanks all for the comments from everyone on the UK system.
How much of UK tax revenue is consumed for health care?
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http://www.britishcouncil.org/eumobility-living-in-uk-healthcare-nhs.htm
theres a wee bit of propoganda about the NHS for you
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Hi Jim, the best and most important aspect of our NHS is the fact that if you are involved in an accident anywhere in the country you will receive hospital treatment if required without any questions about having medical insurance.
JD
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My wife is an american and she always complains how expensive the NHS is with our national insurance as a small percentage of her wage. Although I do tell her that some of it also goes towards her pension she still rails on about how cheap taxes are over in the us.
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Ha! She should try working over here. Literally 1/3rd of salary goes on Health Cover.
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I think, on the whole, it's pretty good. In an emergency, at least you don't have to worry about bills. It's not perfect - it's run by people and they're not all "Angels" but it's OK.
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I work for the NHS. I think you can be guaranteed that the care that you get from us nurses is the very best we can offer at any given time, given the short staffing, the conditions we have to work in, the shoddy equipment etc etc. We aint in it for fame and glory, or for the money either, so the only thing that could be motivating us is the desire to do the job and help people.
Emma x
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Thankfully I have only rarely had to use the NHS facilities, but I can honestly say that I have certainly had my money's worth. Also when John was taken to the HD unit after falling 1000 feet, and subsequently was on life support till the end, all the staff, cleaners, attendants, porters, nurses and doctors, every one of them showed us total dedication and consideration. I think we have a good system, and we should encourage Government to invest more money in it.(instead of their second homes!)
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I work for the NHS. I think you can be guaranteed that the care that you get from us nurses is the very best we can offer at any given time, given the short staffing, the conditions we have to work in, the shoddy equipment etc etc. We aint in it for fame and glory, or for the money either, so the only thing that could be motivating us is the desire to do the job and help people.
Emma x
Hi Emma, What do you think think the impact of the NHS on the recruitment of nurses? Nurses are in high demand here in the US already. Would you expect our nurses would be better paid and have better work hours if we adopt a similar health scheme over here in the US?
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Thankfully I have only rarely had to use the NHS facilities, but I can honestly say that I have certainly had my money's worth. Also when John was taken to the HD unit after falling 1000 feet, and subsequently was on life support till the end, all the staff, cleaners, attendants, porters, nurses and doctors, every one of them showed us total dedication and consideration. I think we have a good system, and we should encourage Government to invest more money in it.(instead of their second homes!)
Sorry to hear about your loss. In the military medical system which I have been in all my life I guess the care is very good (I only say this with a bit of equivocation since it is all I know).
For example, my wife had pancreatitis due to complications from gall stones while pregnant. Then our youngest was born two months premature. The health system took care of everything: neonatal care, subsequent gall bladder surgery and drugs. There was no cost for us. That was one reason I stayed in the military...the superb medical treatment which my wife and daughter received.
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Well I am a nurse and worked in the NHS for 10 years and then moved into NHS management for 10 years - Emergency - that makes me feel old!! I have now moved to Ireland and am shocked at the health system over here, so much that I moved out of it as I wasn't even happy to tell people I worked in it. I now work for a private American Healthcare provider in Ireland and feel a great deal more confident. Yes they are constantly looking at costs, but the technology is excellent and the care very good.
While in the UK I would have really complained about the NHS and provision of elective care (operations etc) but now looking from the outside in they have had over 50 years of trying to sort it and do quite well. The emergency care can't be faulted. In Ireland you can still wait up to 24 hours to be seen in A&E and that is if you get there as the ambulance service isn't that great either.
I personally think there should be a mix of public and private healthcare - if you can aford private care then have it and that takes the pressure off the public sector
Well those are my thoughts!
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Well the new health care system is on the horizon.
My Grandmother recently passed away. During here illness she desired to move from one nursing home to another. We were able to grant her wish and move her to a better home which gave her access to a better hospital. My parents made the decision with health care providers.
I wonder if I saw the passing of more than a great lady but the passing of a era where a person can say...I want to go to this hospital because I like it? In the next decade or so our hospitals will likely become decision points much as our public schools are today.
Here in the US the common people choose a home based on the perceived quality of schools...will health care become the same type of measuring stick...for example: we can't buy a home there because the health care is so bad? Or, we are not allowed to move to that town because there is no health care available?
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The NHS is the best in the world for emergency medical care. We have access to top doctors 24/7 however for elective surgery I say that private medical services are better. Now on the NHS we have patient choice so that with elective surgery we can choose to go into a private hospital and the NHS pays for it.
Large teaching hospitals tend to be dirty and understaffed and hospital born infections are on the increase which has resulted in deaths.
Some areas of health are underfunded and not 'glamorous' such as geriatrics and I would NEVER leave my mother in an NHS hospital.
The NHS coalface is vastly underfunded, with too much cash and resources going to upper and middle management plus all the quangos.
To save cash N.I.C.E is limiting too many drugs because they are too close to the NHS and hospitals, it should be more independent if we have to have it al all. People are dying because of this.
There should be a system put in place wherebye patients can buy the drugs they need and still use the NHS for the rest of their treatment. This saves the NHS cash in the long term
So to answer your question succinctly; the NHS is/would be great IF it is taken out of the political arena.
PS I was a BSc (hons) RGN
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I think that the NHS i a great thing but nowadays i do worry about the cleanliness of the hospitals, my mum was n the wards may years ago when there were proper ward maids and cleanliness came before anything else, i m not saying that all hospitals are dirty, s they arent but i do wiss that they would go back to the old ways rather than looking for the cheapest cleaning contracts around. Of course they have to budget for these things but if there were more measures taken there would be less cases of infection, ie MRSA (which i am aware we all carry) and the likes. and then perhaps more money would go to the the actual job at hand.
Another issue that bugs me is the layers of management that have been installed in the service, which to me is money for old rope, it is a fact that there are more pen pushers than beds in this country and that is wrong.
If anyone want to see the difference between the different set ups, Michael Moores "Sicko" is well worth a look :)
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It's time I joined in this and I don't want any clever bugger correcting me because I know its happened to me and my family.If the ambulance service had a doctor on board our son may well still be alive The paramedics that attended the accident claimed he was poorly but they didn't need the helicopter.Mistake 1 If they knew what they were doing they would have seen his eyes were filling with blood.Why? they didn't even see it .When he arrived at the County he got off the ambulance Why? He got to see the head(his ) specialist far to late because the paramedics had not reported any thing suspiciously wrong ??? So he died.
Now a different tale all together I have been winging lately about nurses wi needles like fencing stakes and sticking them in my wrist to find an artery (9 attempts last time but one) and I stopped him we discussed any alternative methods and by this time I was much better settled I said lets have one more go and he found it straight away.The analysis proved extremely negative and another meeting set up for last Tuesday Same nurse Ian we are not going to have the last meetings performance are we?I jolly well hope not lets have a go So I puts my arm on the pillow higher than my shoulder and stab.The syringe starts to fill with blood first go He went to the machine that analyses the blood came back and said right lets sit quietly and I will plug you into the hospital main Oxy line so we sat for half an hour and he had another go straight away first go Whats your sats George don't know you haven't given me a wrist watch to see Oh dear here you are then and I was up to 90 with a heart rate of 98 So lets go for a 8 minute walk nice and slowly after 4 minutes we went back to his office and he took yet another sample first go straight away Off he went to his analyser and came back .I'm sorry George you will have to have a home Oxygenerator you are way below 6 I will arrange for one to be delivered tomorrow.Of course we stayed home I dare not go out for fear of not hearing the bell.Nothing all day.Come Thursday at 4:pm I rang the hospital and was informed I would not be getting the machine until Friday.Words were said a synopsis of which was Is it to much bother for you to ring me and say don't stay about until Friday afternoon the unit isn't available.No I suppose not that means some one would have to think and tell you to do it wouldn't it?.Friday at 4:pm and the door bell rings a young chap brings it in and sets it up and shows me the ins and outs.Off he goes.So I spent last night learning myself to sleep with a cannula up both nostrils Dammed awkward I'll tell you .But the problem on this occasion was the right hand didn't know what the left one was doing.I used the Freedom 400 to go shopping this morning as usual and I am connected to the generator now.Talk about frustration ???
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I have nothing but praise for our health system in previous years. When my Mum was dying of lung cancer in 1994 she had better care in Aberdeen Royal Infirmary than she did in the Hospice run by a Trust - Macmillan Nurses - they couldn't give a damn! But nowadays it is all political and the NHS is short of money. My GP son-in-law works all the hours God gives him to make a reasonable life for his family.
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And my son Alexander who is dying from a terminal cancer in his spine has nothing but praise for the Grimsby Mc Millan Nurses The terrific salarys paid to GP's does not help either.There are some I would not pay in rusty washers ??? :farmer:
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And my son Alexander who is dying from a terminal cancer in his spine has nothing but praise for the Grimsby Mc Millan Nurses The terrific salarys paid to GP's does not help either.There are some I would not pay in rusty washers ??? :farmer:
Well I don't know what planet your GPs are on, because Duncan earns every penny he gets!
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Theres good and bad everywhere, be it nurses, doctors, care and some people are there just to earn they money some are there cos they believe in what they doing and making a difference. :)
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Go to your search engine box (I use Google) and type in "Current GP's salarys?"and try some of the answers :farmer:
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Just this week I have had occasion to be thankful for the NHS.My husband went to the g.p at 11am with chest pains. By 12.30 he was in a hospital bed. ( don't forget we live in the middle of nowhere and we only have a "cottage" hospital.) We had to wait awhile for the blood tests to be sent to Grimsby but they eventually came back. My husband has nothing wrong with his heart so his pain must be muscular. Never the less he is to go back to hospital next week for a go on the treadmill.My sister recently had the same thing in America whilst visiting her son. It cost Thousands!
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Yes Shiela DPWH is great isn't it Its what some of them do to me uhggg.Best hospital service in the UK.But when he sticks a broken off fence post in my wrist(well thats what it feels like) I have a different story ah ah!) Tell you some thing else If they dont know they know a man that does and not long getting him involved either.So Dr says I want you to go for an Xray Mr Baker.When.Can you go this morning?Go now if you wish.Get off then Report to Xray Desk.I did wait in C Mr Baker 4 mins later I was called Xrayed and asked to wait again 5 mins later nurse said you can go so I did.Home to Doctors 10 mins Him seeing me 5mins back home 10mins Get the car out go to DPWH park go to Xray be seen come home so all well under the hour what could you want better 8) :D :farmer:
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I've read with interest all the comments on the NHS. I admit to a bias - I've been employed by NHSScotland all my working life (37 years so far), as has my wife, my parents (who got "nationalised in 1948 when their hospital was absorbed into the NHS) & two of my daughters.
The NHS in the UK costs about 60% of the amount spent in France & Germany, and up to a point you get what you pay for, but I think that it is good value for money. What nobody has mentioned is that the NHS in England is a different entity from the NHS in Scotland - they were formed on the same day in 1948 (although Scotland had a previous system that was incorporated), but due to the different legal systems between the two countries, they are different NHS's. As an example, Scotland has no Trusts - they were disbanded several years ago when a direct Health Board system was established. Scotland also spends slightly more per head of population on health than England, and has slightly more doctors relative to the population as a result.
It will never be a perfect system, since it will never meet the hopes & expectations of everyone, but in general I genuinely think it is one of the best in the world, especially in an emergency situation.
Just my opinions,
John
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I'm with you John.Little story before NHS in the Newark area where I was dragged up rate wi me Dad.He did is best e' allust sed.Mother paid 2/6 a week to a Newark Hospital Health Club.This entitled Mother Father Me and young Billy to Free health care by free we did not have to pay if we went to the doctors.It was free in that respect We had paid by the half crowns every week.NHS was better for us we didn't have to pay us 2/6 each week.Like stopping smoking Mother could not show you the £6:10 shillings she had not spent on this care club.Just like Anne cannot show you the £540:80p she didn't spend on cigs; last year because she stopped smoking.David claimed she is a secret smoker like that secret lemonade drinker advert of yesteryear ??? ;D :wave: :farmer: