The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Smallholding => Equipment => Topic started by: mab on April 25, 2012, 12:00:12 am
-
I need to get a/some new vehicles now that I've got a real smallholding but I'm having trouble deciding what. I could use some other peoples thoughts. Bear in mind I'm on a limited budget and low running costs are required. Also bear in mind I'm quite new to running a holding of this size and have a rather vague idea what I'll need.
For on road:-
I currently have an Astra estate 1.7 diesel - nice & economical and OK for work and general road use.
Occasionally I'm going to need to tow a decent sized livestock trailer (also need a livestock trailer); and as I'm in the Welsh hills, 4x4 would be useful in the winter. Was thinking my options are:
1. stick with astra, get snow chains, and a trailer that is within the 1400Kg towing limit.
2. Get an old landy (Tax exempt) with restricted mileage insurance (so annual running costs are low) and use only when needed (have previous experience of keeping these).
3. Trade in astra for newer 4x4 , but then I have to buy fuel for gas-guzzler all year round.
no. 2 is my favorite ATM but that may be 'cos I want an excuse to get a S2A landy. ;D
For work around the holding:-
would like something for general lugging stuff around (an on-road 4x4 could do this in some places).
Ideally could do with something I can attach a topper/flail to for pasture maintenance and overgrown land clearance (and poss.a post-hole borer).
As the land is steep (and boggy at the bottom) I would need 4x4 and very stable - are miniature tractors any more/less stable than full-size?
My feeling is that a miniature tractor would be best as the limited amount of land that's not too steep to drive on would limit the usefulness of a full-size.
in the pic the two green pastures on the left are mine (and the foreground) - and are probably driveable - the land goes down to the bottom of the valley (def' not driveable).
Any thoughts ideas welcome.
mab
-
Hi mab,
I'm no expert (although I do love dreaming about what vehicles to get next) but I would be tempted to keep the astra, and getting an old full size tractor and use that to tow your livestock trailer. But don't listen to me, as I don't really know what I'm on about :)
sb
-
Landy would be good but beware the prices for oldies have shot right up. even my 2001LWB is worth the same today or more than what I paid for it 5 years back! and worse with the older ones. Mainly I think because the Landy as we know it cant be made anymore from 2013 due to EU safety rules :-(
Makes me wonder if the series 2 we converted to a mobile water bowser might get converted back at some point!
-
land rovers are brilliant to the point you don't give a stuff about there problems you have to really buy a bag of nails or are not cut out for landies to hate them
old ones are more likely to be shot with rust and assembled from a thousand Donner's not all ligite so vosa and plod take a keen interest in them they are just big meccano kits and can give hours of satisfaction stripping and rebuilding fuel consumption was never there selling point so disregard that part the newer ones fitted with electronics are the cheapest and give the most problems depends on your mechanical aptitude get a freelander or two with a knackered 1.8 petrol engine (the heads go on them but i think you can get replacement engines) and a decent set of tyres you can go out in your fields as well e bay is littered with good freelanders with knackered engines also check that the drive is connected to the rear axle the cheap fix is disconnect it and you will get over 30 mpg and a lot quieter than an old leafer
tractors well depends on your budget your cheapest entry is a traditional tractor an international they are the cheapest to start with and progress from there but depends on your budget :farmer:
-
Hi mab,
I'm no expert (although I do love dreaming about what vehicles to get next) but I would be tempted to keep the astra, and getting an old full size tractor and use that to tow your livestock trailer. But don't listen to me, as I don't really know what I'm on about :)
sb
I never even thought of running the tractor on the road - presumably it would need to be taxed, tested and insured though - wonder how mush that costs...
Landy would be good but beware the prices for oldies have shot right up. even my 2001LWB is worth the same today or more than what I paid for it 5 years back! and worse with the older ones. Mainly I think because the Landy as we know it cant be made anymore from 2013 due to EU safety rules :-(
Makes me wonder if the series 2 we converted to a mobile water bowser might get converted back at some point!
Yes,that's the downside >:( - esp the LWB ones - then again I could look at it as an investment - probably better than money in the bank right now.
I did note all the freeloaders on ebay - but they don't have the 3500Kg towing capacity of a landy. (I also noted the cheap (and rotten) discos. I know I can weld series-landy chassis, but wasn't sure about thin disco bodywork (or reparing their modern engines).
tractors well depends on your budget your cheapest entry is a traditional tractor an international they are the cheapest to start with and progress from there but depends on your budget
I wasn't sure if I'd manage with a 2wd though - there is a 2wd zetor for sale nearby for 1800,but for a bit more than that I could get a 4wd Kubota 6000?
I am mechanically able - I was looking at getting a non-runner landy, if I can arrange transport out to here. And could do the same for a tractor - though I don't have heavy lifting equipment for moving full-size tractor parts, and I don't know about price & availability of parts for the various tractor makes.
I also read in another post that implements are cheaper for full size tractors which is a factor to consider
-
tractors on the road tax nil insurance depends on the value and the company you get insurance from running it on the road is a bit of a grey area tacho derv and record of drivers hours is the worst no testing at present for tractors
land rover is about the only bunch of vehicles that can tow 3.5 tons with the exception of the freelander and the evoque
series motors 90 and 110 all hold there value when rotten piles of flaky rust they are rebuilt rangies and discos nobody wants to know them you can get new galvanised chassis for them like the others but it is the A B and C pillars plus the tailgate that rots
even zetors are rising in value but are they changing hands at that price e bay is full of tractors that you would need to have your head buttoned up the back to buy them at the asking price either that or i am to old remembering when you could get a new tractor for a grand
when you start to buy parts and machining services that is when your money runs away i have been there :farmer:
-
Hmm.. so using the tractor on road might well be the cheapest option - good thinking Shropshire Blue :thumbsup: - though it's a few miles to market, and I hate to think what a new set of tractor tyres would cost.
Well perhaps I should get a tractor first and see if I can do without the landy.
Am I being reasonable in thinking it's worth the extra for a 4wd tractor? - I know the older 2wd models are cheaper, but...
Thanks for the input folks!
mab
-
Last week we bought a lovely old 4WD Landy pickup fully taxed and MOT'd on eBay for less than £2K. There were only two bids and ours was the winning one. Owner was spitting tacks at the price as we (and presumably - he) had seen similar Landy's in the south east and midlands going for 4-5K
We waited a few weeks for the right one to come along and my husband is a bit of an eBay and second hand car ninja. This one didn't sell because it was in Cornwall and it wasn't optimally listed so would have been missed on a superficial eBay search.
He drove the beast (nicknamed Shrek) from Cornwall to mid-Wales without missing a beat.
The bargains are out there if you know where to look but it takes time and can be frustrating.
Apart from DH's "project" cars we now have an economic runaround each, the Landy pickup and a large van. It's taken us three years of trial and error to get to that combination but I think we've hit the right spot now except that we could do with an alpine tractor plus all the trimmings but that's lottery win territory!!
Good luck and take yr time to find the right vehicles for your particular needs.
-
Bear in mind that if you only use the tractor on the farm you can have a red diesel tank and use that, but if you use it on the roads you will be done for it.
I would find a Landy for the road and get a oldie tractor for on the farm. Tractors suitable for road work are really the newer faster ones, the old ones would take for ever and ever to get anywhere more than half a mile away.
We also found our Landy on eBay, we didnt mind it being an ex utility white, slightly battered one with solid sides.
NB if it is solid sided, the tax is a lot less, about £280 for the year as it is classed as light commercial and not PLG.
-
We have just got a seccond hand Subaru forester , it will pull a small trailer over a damp field and a twin axle on the road with 54 small bales of hay without any problems. we find it a good compromise. but still need a tractor.
-
We went for a 4x4 pickup (cheap quite knackered mitsi L200) and a 4x4 compact tractor (kubota). Combo works for us, but being in the fens the hills aren't a problem!
-
The vehicles we have found most suited to our needs are: a Siromer 4wd tractor (flat pack and cheap - does everything except the baler), a David Brown which was a gift and does the baler, two Landies - a 1951 80" and a later LWB series 3 and a Subaru for the road.
The 80" we imported from NZ - sounds ridiculous but there are plenty out there, they don't use salt on the road and importing it cost less than trying to find a rust free one here - it was also quite fun doing the import (you can see it on our website). We use it for all the little runaround jobs in the fields and for local trips such as towing the trailer to the abattoir, but wouldn't want to do more than about 50 miles in it. The series 3 does all the feed fetching and carrying, bringing in things like fencing supplies. Both can be used to take a sheep down to the vet in the back, that sort of thing, and both can tow a trailer but we don't have a huge livestock one.
The tractors are used at haymaking and general cultivations, and at the moment the Siromer is being used, or its front loader, to lift heavy beams into place on a building we are putting up.
In reality we can't justify having two Landies, but they are his and hers ;D nor if we were buying both could we justify the two tractors, but as the DB was given to us it doesn't cost us anything.
-
Bear in mind that if you only use the tractor on the farm you can have a red diesel tank and use that, but if you use it on the roads you will be done for it.
excellent point - back to landy & tractor.
I've seen a working Zetor 5545 4wd for less than £2K not too far away...
The 80" we imported from NZ - sounds ridiculous but there are plenty out there, they don't use salt on the road and importing it cost less than trying to find a rust free one here
Interesting - I'll look into that..
-
Regarding LandRovers. If you're going to do any even semi serious road mileage steer clear of old leaf sprung series jobs. Even a coil sprung defender is pretty spartan if you're used to cars. Best compromise is an older diesel engined discovery. Does everything a so called "proper" landy can do, including towing up to a 3500kg trailer, will go anywhere with a set of decent tyres, and above all is comfy, cheap as chips to buy and a piece of piss to fix if it goes wrong. When the rust finally gets it it'll be worth as much for spares as you paid for it in the first place. You can't go wrong.
-
Regarding LandRovers. If you're going to do any even semi serious road mileage steer clear of old leaf sprung series jobs. Even a coil sprung defender is pretty spartan if you're used to cars. Best compromise is an older diesel engined discovery. Does everything a so called "proper" landy can do, including towing up to a 3500kg trailer, will go anywhere with a set of decent tyres, and above all is comfy, cheap as chips to buy and a piece of piss to fix if it goes wrong. When the rust finally gets it it'll be worth as much for spares as you paid for it in the first place. You can't go wrong.
I used to have a 1972 Series 2A - did 30,000 miles in it - so I know what i'm getting into ;D Disco's are certainly cheap to buy, but the road tax will offset the purchase cost of a series after a few years, and, as I'm better at welding thick metal than thin, I'd rather weld a series chassis than disco seatbelt points.
Good news - I talked to my Farmer neighbour and he's happy to collect a tractor/landy on a trailer for me :) :) :) so I can get an mot fail landy.
-
We have an 8yo Ford Galaxy which does nearly 40mpg, carries people and bales of whatever and is pleasant to drive distances on road
The 9yo Nissan Terrano does 28mpg around town and is much more expensive to insure and maintain but it can tow our Ifor Williams 510 horse trailer which we occasionally use for horses but mostly for carrying stuff because of its cavernous interior. The Nissan tows 3t - two hunters with water and fodder in a 510 weigh about 2.5t. Most of the crossover 4wds tow only 1.8t, some just over 2t which is limiting.
We also have a Ifor Williams 750kg unbraked sheep trailer which is a splendidly versatile thing cos the top comes off pretty easily and anything tows it. The trailers are hitch-locked and Datatagged and kept out of site behind locked gates
We had a grey petrol Fergie which is was fun but tricky as a tractor because of its PTO arrangements. Changed that for a MF575 which was good value but too big and its 2wd R1 tyres churned up the ground. Then bought a Kubota 4wd 35hp with grass tyres and a loader which was a swine to remove. The lousy turning circle and irremovable bucket made it tricky in our very small yard so sold it and got an MF branded 4wd Iseki. Turning circle is as good as the Fergie, loader bucket is quick release and it is totally reliable.
Grass tyres probably work on golf courses but not on wet grass on even a gentle incline. R1 (tractor tyres) leave a mark even on fairly dry ground. R4 tyres are used on construction machines and damage the ground less because they grip less, but are great for a 4wd light tractor.
People seem to love or loathe the Chinese tractors, and they're certainly much cheaper than the Japanese models, but the Japanese ones hold their value. We sold our 12yo Kubota on ebay for well over £6k (it cost us £5k) to a German who put it on a trailer and took it home. The underbidders were from Slovakia...
-
The more equipment one has, the more time one spends looking after it all .
The longest time served vehicle I have is the SWB Land Rover, pre 1973, Nill Road Tax and low insurance. I very reliable, been around Scotland , Devon and to Kent. Love it, will do anything and turns on a six pence. Fuel is now silly, hence the Combo van with the Isuzu diesel engine. Good work horse, payload, steel and mpg.
Finally the David Brown. Lives outside, reliable, red diesel in tank, allowed 6 miles from farm/ land ? on Red.
Tractors need implements, trailer, transport box, etc etc.
It all takes time to acquire and all needs servicing.
Keep your Vauxhall 1.7. and build from that. :thumbsup:
-
Interesting discussion :thumbsup:
I have a horribly expensive Nissan X-Trail (love it, brilliantly reliable, just not the price or the fuel consumption) that gets me out of the dale in any weather and pulls my small trailer. Then I have a big quad bike and assorted self-powered/ground driven things it pulls.
I would probably be better off with an economical car, an old Landy for the snowy days and pulling trailers, and a Chinese tractor with cheaper PTO driven stuff for it.
It's how you get from where I am (not all my choices) to where I'd like to be. Also mechanically inept and the Landy would be bound to break down the days I really needed it......could I learn to fix a car? It would be nice not to be so helpless.
-
could I learn to fix a car? It would be nice not to be so helpless.
My old local college used to run "blokey" courses for the ladies - DIY, basic bricklaying, basic car work....anything similar near you?
-
You can learn to fettle an old car but not a new one. There far less to go wrong on an old 'un but it will go wrong so you need to understand it, and love it a little.
I cut my teeth on a trio of series 3 diesel lwb safaris and a 6cyl petrol in the seventies. The diesels were horrible to drive and to maintain. You had to jump start them off the petrol one in winter. They'd just introduced a rolling road brake test in the MOT and the only way of passing was to use both feet on the pedal while bracing against the seat and steering wheel.
The petrol one had a proper brake servo, averaged 10-12mpg but was lovely.
-
Enjoying dreaming whilst following this thread.....!! We have an old citroen berlingo and a fiat scudo van and they are fine off road on the fields as long as it's not too wet - Got the scudo stuck last year in the wet, so have banned ourselves from using it untill drier - but we still can use it on the fields 6 months a year ;D. Really got laughed at during haymaking last year - but it worked - we can get about 15 bales in it so only 20 trips to pollytunels!!! WOuld love a quad or something, but not to be. Me and my wheelbarrow are the horsepower on this 12 acres. Good exercise and OK as I am cash poor and time rich! ON the plus side it costs VERy little to have a local contractor come and do the things we cant - £10 to spread fertiliser, around £200 to make hay and I can do all road stuff with our vehicles. We went to look at a golf buggy with a tipping trailer for £1000 but decided it was too risky with our hills, so will keep dreaming....
-
tractors on the road tax nil insurance depends on the value and the company you get insurance from running it on the road is a bit of a grey area tacho derv and record of drivers hours is the worst no testing at present for tractors
land rover is about the only bunch of vehicles that can tow 3.5 tons with the exception of the freelander and the evoque
series motors 90 and 110 all hold there value when rotten piles of flaky rust they are rebuilt rangies and discos nobody wants to know them you can get new galvanised chassis for them like the others but it is the A B and C pillars plus the tailgate that rots
even zetors are rising in value but are they changing hands at that price e bay is full of tractors that you would need to have your head buttoned up the back to buy them at the asking price either that or i am to old remembering when you could get a new tractor for a grand
when you start to buy parts and machining services that is when your money runs away i have been there :farmer:
??? Dont know where you got that bit from? For agricultural use no tacho required, red diesel is fine on the highway as long as the activity is for agricultural purposes and no requirement to record drivers hours.
As far as buying a small tractor - for £6000 you could get a 80-90 hp 4wd big tractor (Ford 6610, 6810,7610) in reasonable order - adjust the wheels to a good wide track setting and it will everywhere your siromer, kubota etc will and a darn site more safely. These small tractors are overpriced for what they are. £3000 would still get you a MF 590 4wd or similar with loads of work left in it. Go to a few farm sales instead of looking on ebay.
Regards
-
old ploughman you must have lived a sheltered life
agriculture horticulture and forestry you can use red diesel but there are situations within these paramiters that you do need to run derv and be compliant with other haulage vehicles
:farmer:
-
This is great :thumbsup:
For agricultural use no tacho required, red diesel is fine on the highway as long as the activity is for agricultural purposes and no requirement to record drivers hours.
Would that include a 12mile round trip to the livestock market?
£3000 would still get you a MF 590 4wd or similar with loads of work left in it. Go to a few farm sales instead of looking on ebay.
I've been googling auctionhouses in this area but only found one that seems to do farm-sales and they didn't have anything in the offing (in Suffolk farm sales seemed to be handled by the auctionhouses) - does anyone know a good way of finding info on farm sales in south wales?
I need to be patient and wait for the right tractor at the right price, I know, but I just want to get on and DO things! :D
could I learn to fix a car?.
If you learn to fix a car an old landy is certainly better than a modern car - simple mechanicals and no electronics. The only downside is that you will spend a lot of time maintaining it (I've lost count of the number of bits you need to top up with EP90 oil on a series landy).
Thx
mab
-
a very good example mab you take your livestock to the market with your tractor and ifor williams your Friend buys some sheep and asks if you could run them home accompanied with the e aml your name and vehicle reg is on the paper doc and stored for life in the computer
your journey to the market is legal as long as you are legal with the vehicle and can run on red
your return with somebody Else's stock is not legal on red and without all the legality's that go with running a transport business o and the e aml you are committed for life that you have broken the law and if caught say years from now for running red and doing favours they simply look into your past history on movements and finned and charged accordingly
in the days before fasttracks there was unimogs every owner in central Scotland has a tale to tell on plods endeavour to get them of the road one of them coming back from market collected cement he was done for haulage
maybe down in Shropshire they are not as clued up as the rest of the country ;) :farmer:
-
maybe down in Shropshire they are not as clued up as the rest of the country ;) :farmer:
Since I moved to Shropshire 4 years ago I've only seen a policeman 4 times. It was the same one each time at our village fair each year!
-
Get your self a Toyota RAV 4.
Not a new type. Mines a P reg and it goes anywhere. I have a spare set of wheels with ice tyres on for the winter. (ice tyres not mud tyres or aggressive treds).
It's got enough power to tug a trailer and comfortable enough to use anywhere.
Parts are cheap and easy to find.
-
Robert Waddell - a sheltered life I have not lead! I stand by what I said. When travelling to market with own produce - agricultural activity. When travelling home with neighbours sheep - haulage/non-agricultural. As an agricultural contractor of over 20 years and operating a fastrac across the whole of the British Isles I reckon I know a bit about tractors on roads and what you can and cannot get away with ;)
So, where do you come up with using derv, having a tacho and recording drivers hours for agricultural use?
-
you did not operate a 16G at dunbar did you he was a shropshire lad ;) :farmer:
-
On this occasion you are right - it wasn't me :)
-
it is well documented on the use of tractors and what you should comply with
if a contractor cuts rows up silage and chops then carts that grass to the pit that is an allowed activity
if the farmer cuts it and rows it up and the contractor chops and carts it that is considered haulage and as such requires derv tacho and drivers log :farmer:
-
WRONG! Chopping the grass (though it is irrelevant) is an agricultural operation and the subsequent haulage to clamp is legal on red diesel and no tacho or drivers hours needed. In fact, any operation where the hauled product is taken to store is allowed on red diesel, no tacho, no hours required. An example - it is common for contractors to supply tractor and driver only to haul farmers own trailers when potatoes are harvested by the farmers own harvester (same applies to combining). This activity is entirely legal and can be carried out on red diesel, no tacho or drivers hours. However, that same contractor cannot legally transport the same potatoes (or grain) when transported from store to market/processor - that is haulage and derv must be used. There is however no requirement for an agricultural tractor to have a tacho fitted or the driver to record hours for this operation as long as it travels under the restrictions of an agricultural tractor. The farmer however can transport the same goods to the market/processor legally on red as it is his own produce.
Before you start accusing people of leading a sheltered life or not being clued up, perhaps you should check your 'facts'
-
what i was quoting was from articles in the farmers weekly it has been printed twice now
it is the whole operation that counts
but you did agree with me on the market scenario
even landrovers require tachos for certain situations
and again landrovers can legally run on red in certain situations :farmer:
-
and the point of the quote is :farmer:
-
There's two points here - use of red diesel and operator licensing - and they have nothing to do with each other except that when you take the 12,000 pages of tax legislation and overlay it with Defra's liking for complexity and all the fun of operator licensing you're going to produce authentic frontier gibberish which no-one can understand.
In Jan 2008 HMRC published the results of a year's work with the NFU etc working out which of the things that people did with tractors could be done using red diesel. They came up with a Memorandum of Agreement which is how the various pieces of legislation should be interpreted by HMRC or the old Bill when you get pulled over.
See http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsPortalWebApp/channelsPortalWebApp.portal?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=pageExcise_ShowContent&propertyType=document&id=HMCE_CL_000164#P36_1845 (http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsPortalWebApp/channelsPortalWebApp.portal?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=pageExcise_ShowContent&propertyType=document&id=HMCE_CL_000164#P36_1845) for the whole shebang, in particular the Appendix in section 10 for the Memorandum of Agreement.
Cutting to the chase you can take animals to market using red diesel but you can't then transport them once sold unless you use taxed fuel. The relevant bit says
QUOTE
Movement of produce and livestock
Transportation of agricultural, horticultural or forestry produce within or between different areas of land occupied by the same person.
Transportation of livestock within or between different areas of land occupied by the same person.
Transport of agricultural, horticultural or forestry produce from the place of production or temporary storage.
Transport of livestock to a place where the produce is to be sold or slaughtered.
The transportation of produce must be incidental to an agricultural, horticultural or forestry operation being performed on the land. The onus is on the person transporting the load to demonstrate that this is the case.
Transportation of produce which requires an Operator’s Licence may not be accepted as being incidental.
Transportation on public roads of produce or livestock by a contractor employed solely for that purpose is not included within this agreement.
UNQUOTE
The issue of tachographs is entirely separate and falls under operator licensing legislation. On which point it is technically possible for a Range Rover or Toyota Landcruiser to need a tacho in very extreme circumstances when towing for profit but that's because of their ludicrous weight. I don't think any of the Land Rovers is quite heavy enough yet.
-
and the point is - I was researching my answers, something you have not!
Tachos on landrovers - yes, but not the point at issue
Market scenario - the scenario is correct because the return journey was for hire or reward (whether paid or not) and the agricultural exemption no longer applies - but irrelevant in this context - you said that tractors needed derv, tachos and drivers hours - incorrect because as soon as it is outside the exemption it is a goods vehicle not a tractor.
Has bugger all to do with the whole operation - VOSA are quite clear on what constitutes the terms of the exemption.
Printed in the Farmers Weekly - I know which I would believe, Farmers Weekly or VOSA? Only one of them would be prosecuting you.
The VOSA document here should help - http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsPortalWebApp/channelsPortalWebApp.portal?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=pageExcise_ShowContent&id=HMCE_CL_000164&propertyType=document#P312_31283 (http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsPortalWebApp/channelsPortalWebApp.portal?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=pageExcise_ShowContent&id=HMCE_CL_000164&propertyType=document#P312_31283) - especially the appendix where the acceptable activities are listed.
'
After all that, I can tell you that I have only ever seen 2 fastracs fitted with tachos and both were specifically for non-ag uses and were not classed as agricutural tractors.
The fact that you would struggle to find an agricultural tractor with a tacho fitted would suggest that your claim is false. With the number of VOSA inspections being carried out on agricultural tractors nowadays, it would be fair to assume that there would be a good list of prosecutions for non-fitment of tachos, illegal use of red diesel and lack of drivers records, but, there are not because they are not required for an agricultural tractor! You may have tried to belittle me by suggesting that I didnt know what I was talking about and you can try to worm your way out by bringing up non-agricultural operations as an example of fitting tachos etc, but you are still wrong in what you originally said.
Regards
-
i think you came on here looking for an argument and not really trying to help or assist the poster in there asking the point in the first place
the next time the farmers weekly run an article on transport with tractors i will refer them to you the font of knowledge n the subject
at least you agree with the market scenario but fall on your sword with the tractor becoming a goods vehicle if it becomes a goods vehicle then it has to comply with there standards FEUL/ TACHO DRIVERS LOG AND HOURS
you must have a complex i have not tried to belittle you you are doing an excellent job of that yourself :farmer:
-
So! What do you think of the RAV 4 idea ;)
-
OP, do you not get the farmers weekly, it will be due to have the same info in it soon as it has does for the last couple of years regarding do's and don'ts of contracting, you need to chill out and be more helpful on this forum and stop getting into debates with other forum users, you are very nasty in some of you replies to RW who has a tremendous amount of knowledge on ALL aspect of life, I dare say you have also but you both need to be nicer to each other when posting your replies, someone needs to tell you both off, FFS behave yourselves and agree to disagree. Yes a good debate is fine but it goes too far sometimes. This is a good going debate but it getting too serious. OP you think your version is correct, RW you think your version is correct, ok both of you, why don't you both just leave it at that.
-
rav 4 what is the towing limit with it :farmer:
-
So! What do you think of the RAV 4 idea ;)
Alas: for on road use: Rav4's are not tax exempt/cheap to insure for occasional use and have a towing limit of 1500Kg not 3500Kg, so I still think the series landy is the better option.
for off road use - well, maybe - can you fit a PTO to one? ;D ;D
I hope I've not stirred up any trouble with my enquiries ;) - I think everyone's trying to give the facts to the best of their knowledge as to what you can and cannot do with a tractor on red diesel. Given the murky and over-legislated world of tax law and defra rules it would be a miracle if everyone knew what's right ::)
But I think my question has been answered:- I CAN use a tractor on red to take my produce to market :thumbsup: , but CANNOT then do a buyer the favor of delivering the same livestock to their place - at least not for money. Which means I can manage without a 4x4 for now (though I suspect I cannot use to tractor on red to go to the shops in the snow - I'll have to read up on those links to answer that ::) ).
Thanks for sharing your hard-won expertise on this - I guess I ahould do my own research for more details, but I can now focus on tractors and leave the landy for when the right one comes along.
mab
-
If the BMW X5 is a chelsea tractor then the RAV4 is a chelsea lawnmower. Neither was designed to get muddy.
There's nothing wrong with the RAV4: it's light and far cheaper to run than a conventional 4wd but it won't tow anything meaty and it won't have the off-road capability of the real thing.
-
The bonus about going to the shops in the snow with red diesel in the tractor is that The Plod won't be out on their tractors to catch you.
Wish I could find the photo of our staff car park one very snowy day. There was me in my then Nissan pickup, someone in a Defender, a couple of staff had walked in and the Tech teacher (another part time farmer) had come on his John Deere - I thought that was pretty dedicated :thumbsup:
-
don't post it there will be somebody waiting to dob him in it is a bit like a landrover site one of the founders sons extolling this particular gentleman that ran his landie on parafin one thing blagging your way out of a situation it is just wrong to hand somebodies arse on a plate to them :farmer:
-
He'll have had the snowplough on the JD. That's OK as of January.
-
So! What do you think of the RAV 4 idea ;)
Alas: for on road use: Rav4's are not tax exempt/cheap to insure for occasional use and have a towing limit of 1500Kg not 3500Kg, so I still think the series landy is the better option.
Sadly a series landy cannot legally tow 3500kg either, only defenders, discos and range rovers.
-
So! What do you think of the RAV 4 idea ;)
Alas: for on road use: Rav4's are not tax exempt/cheap to insure for occasional use and have a towing limit of 1500Kg not 3500Kg, so I still think the series landy is the better option.
Sadly a series landy cannot legally tow 3500kg either, only defenders, discos and range rovers.
Really? I know they're not plated with towing capacities, but I thought they predated the restrictions (bit like my being able to drive a 7.5ton lorry 'cos I took my test in' 88).
m
-
All manufacturers publish recommended maximum towing weights, braked and unbaked, for their vehicles though I don't believe there's any agreed methodology for arriving at them. Different engines and transmissions can make a lot of difference within the same range - from 1800kg to 2500kg on one current car
The gross vehicle weight and the gross train weight, vehicle plus trailer, will be on the VIN plate.
It is very unclear to me which law(s) you break by exceeding manufacturers recommendation but if you have an accident it will be persuasive with both the old bill and your insurer as to whether they cuff you or cough up.
For decades the caravan club has suggested cars should not to tow above 85% of their weight, and definitely not more than 100%. There's no law behind this but single axle trailers are susceptible to snaking while I defy anyone to provoke that with a twin axle Ifor Williams
-
small farmer take a landrover 90 that can legally tow 3.5 tons but does not weigh more than that
tractors they all have plates indicating weight that can be towed some are up to 32 tons but the legal limit is a gross weight for 24 tons approx a big disparity
single axle trailers are no more prone to snaking that twin axle ones a single axle trailer with the axle at the rear will not snake an ifor williams DP 120 g correctly loaded with a small noseweight will snake at below the legal speed limit for towing more nose weight and it will sit there at well above the motorway max speed and sit there like a rock :farmer:
-
Robert, like I said the caravan club is guidance anyway and the law's confusing as always in agriculture.
Hand manoeuvring a single axle trailer is easier than a double axle trailer because the two axles create two possible centres for any turn you want to make. So if you swing it around the rear axle the front tyres will have to slide sideways to keep up. That resistance to yaw make the twin both more stable at speed and easier to reverse in a straight line
-
and tri axle even more stable but more suseptible to scrubbing single axle farm trailers are the easiest to reverse the hardest is a trailer with a turntable on the front :farmer: ;)
-
Hi,
We were going to buy a llandrover
Hi,
We were on route to look at a Landrover when we saw a Mitsubushi L200 4work for sale. We ended up buying it and are very glad we did instead of the Landrover. Very versatile with the rear hard canopy that comes off,halfway to being comfortable,reliable and not to bad on the fuel if driven right (31mpg). depending on which landrover you went for you will find yourself needing a trailer to do a lot of jobs because the top won't come off!!
Cheers Fishy