The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Cattle => Topic started by: SallyintNorth on February 22, 2011, 10:42:12 pm
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Rosemary asked me to start a thread on managing a house cow. As she says, there's not much information out there, so it's good to share our experiences.
Please bear in mind that I'm new to this game, so things that seem to work for me to date may well turn out to have hidden snags downstream! (Not that we're new to cattle, BH has farmed cattle all his life, but in terms of managing a house cow it's all new.)
I wanted a Jersey to hand-milk and was advised to start as young as possible, certainly not expecting to re-train an older cow used to being milked by a machine in a dairy herd. Being impatient I bought an in-calf heifer.
I didn't want to become a slave to the milk, and only want to take what I need for the house, so we decided to buy a second calf to suckle the cow in addition to allowing her to rear her own.
So far it's working well. From about 7 weeks in I have had to keep the calves away from mum for a few hours to let her build up enough for me to get what I want for the house. In a few weeks I expect to need milk for pet lambs, so will then wean the bought-in calf - she's three months old now and is eating several pounds of cake a day, so is ready to be weaned when I need that milk.
I really could go on at enormous length about this; it's been a long-held ambition and I am absolutely revelling in it. But I've answered the question I was asked so will stop - for now!
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what do you intend to do with the calves when they are weaned?
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We have wanted a house cow for ages but over the years we just never got around to it mostly because we didn’t know how to go about it, and work commitments too!. However its something we wish to achieve in the next year or so once we have additional land.
Thanks for sharing your experience and I’m sure others like me will be interested in future postings
Dave
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we got 2 calves-to-be-house-cows, but still a year away from a drop of milk yet xx il be following this thread eagerly !! :cow:
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what do you intend to do with the calves when they are weaned?
Hillie's own calf is a Jersey heifer so she'll stay on as #2 house cow. (BH says "two is plenty", so her name is Plenty.)
Topsy (as in grows like) is a British Blue cross from a dairy cow and is turning out very nice, so will probably enter the suckler herd. Otherwise would be sold in the store ring if she did turn out not suitable for breeding, or as a bulling or calving heifer if for some reason we decided not to keep her ourselves.
I am very lucky to be on a working beef and sheep farm, so there are things that are easy for me to do which would be more of a challenge for a 'real' smallholder. If we didn't have our own suckler herd and had less space so couldn't readily rear calves to bulling age then I would sell her as a weanling. She has grown so well on Jersey milk that I would already make money on her.
This time I have put Hillie to a beef bull, so next year's calf would likely be for meat unless it was a nice heifer, in which case again BH may decide to keep her in the suckler herd.
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what beef bull have you x her with
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How long after calving did you start milking her? Did you do any preparation for milking prior to her calving to get her used to the idea? How long do you need to keep the calf away for? How much milk do you take?
Your Jersey will yield a lot more milk than my little Shetlands, I think. We buy about 16 pints of milk per week plus if we want to make cheese and butter, we'll need around 4 pints a day, maybe a bit more. Milk consumption might go up too.
Have you tried cheese and butter making?
Sorry, so many questions!!
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what beef bull have you x her with
Red Devon. I moved here from Exmoor and always thought Jersey x Red Devon would make a very nice suckler and/or house cow, while giving a reasonable bull calf. BH is going to try Red Devon on one of the Blue-Greys as well.
Anyone else tried Red Devon on Jersey? Or Blue-Grey?
Sally
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How long after calving did you start milking her?
I started milking right away, froze the colostrum for calves or lambs, fed some of the early days milk to the pigs and chickens. I thought it was a good idea to get her into the routine from day one, whether I actually wanted the 'beastie milk' or not. (It does make fab yoghurt, too.) I'm hand-milking so I can take exaclty as many squirts as I want, and not a squirt more!
Did you do any preparation for milking prior to her calving to get her used to the idea?
Yes, for several weeks before (we weren't sure exactly when she would calve so this was longer than really needed!) I fed her twice a day in the stall where I would be milking her, tied her up with her cake, washed and dried her udder and generally 'messed on' with her, including rubbing her udder and pulling her teats. Also sitting down by her and clanking buckets around and under her.
Prior to this I had spent a lot of time getting to know her, getting her used to and liking being stroked and handled. No luck with getting her to accept a halter, but she did accept being chained in the stall while being fed - and remaining tied up for a wee while longer (ie, I very carefully did not teach her that she would be untied the minute she finished eating her cake!)
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How long do you need to keep the calf away for?
For the first several weeks I didn't need to keep the calves off at all, I could get what I needed for the house no bother. Prior to this we used to buy a pint a day, sometimes a litre. And 1/2 litre yoghurt maybe twice a week. (There's only the two of us. I knew our consumption would increase when we had our own gorgeous unmolested Jersey milk, but I didn't have to rush into that.) So I didn't have to take much at first.
In fact at first I took more than I really needed as I was worried she might not produce it if I didn't use it. (Pigs and chickens did well!) Plus I wanted her to be used to the idea that she might finish eating her cake but I might still be milking her - and she is to stand quietly until I am finished. (She can ask for some hay or silage, that's allowed!)
As it started to be the case that there was very little to spare (don't forget, Hillie is feeding her own calf plus a bought-in one - I imagine there'd have been plenty for me for many weeks had she had only her own calf to feed), I began to teach the calves that when the family comes in for the night they will go up to the end of the shed and have some cake and hay and sleeps on their own, and Hillie that she will get some cake then go back to her pen on her own for a few hours. Then more cake and be milked, then the calves will rejoin her. They got used to this very quickly, though Hillie would make sure that I knew if she thought I had left her too long, and we had our first bucket-kicked-over incident!
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So do you bring them in at night, keep the calves separate at night and milk her once a day in the morning?
Are you going to wean both calves at 3 months old?
I'm not planning to put a second calf on to either of mine - if they raise their own and feed us I'll be quite happy. Since no-one seems to monitor milk yields in Shetlands, I have no idea what the yield is likley to be.
I've halter trained mine - not tried them outdoors yet - that will be a laugh! - and they like being brushed and are OK so far with having their udders rubbed and teats gently pulled. Must look out a clangy bucket ;D
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How much milk do you take? Your Jersey will yield a lot more milk than my little Shetlands, I think. We buy about 16 pints of milk per week plus if we want to make cheese and butter, we'll need around 4 pints a day, maybe a bit more. Milk consumption might go up too.
I take at least 1/2L per day, at the moment up to 1.6-2L if she has it and I want to make yoghurt or whatever. I am happy to be flexible and not make yoghurt if she's short - sometimes she is, often it's weather but sometimes I can't put my finger on why she has more or less on a given day. She's rearing two calves, not sure how much they take - but they are certainly not going short! I give her more than a bucketful of cake over two feeds, and if she doesn't get this then the production does noticeably drop. She has ad-lib hay and/or silage plus munches her barley straw bedding, and is out at grass when the weather is suitable.
I expect to wean the bought-in calf when we have pet lambs needing milk. If/when they need more than that, then her own calf will probably be weaned - although I wouldn't want to do this before she is four months old, I think.
When lambing is over and pet lambs are weaned, then will be the time to really get into the cream and cheese products! (Or if it all seems like too much work, I would get another calf to set onto her, rather than have my joy turn into a millstone.)
I don't know what you can expect in terms of production from your Shetlands - would the breed society have some figures?
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So do you bring them in at night, keep the calves separate at night and milk her once a day in the morning?
They are in at night yes and at the moment spend the night together. I separate them when they come in (late afternoon) and milk later in the evening, then put them all back together overnight. At the moment that gives me enough milk. We're just starting lambing so for me it is better not to have to do a regular early morning non-urgent routine - pretty soon there'll be woolly creatures demanding urgent attention first thing, I'm sure!
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Ah, I see now. The Shetlands are so hardy, I'm hoping to outwinter them with a field shelter but we'll see. If they calve in spring, as planned, the calves will be weaned in autumn.
Because no-one keeps Shetlands as purely dairy cows, I think yields aren't really known since the milk tends to go into the calf. I will ask the breed society though.
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Are you going to wean both calves at 3 months old?
I am prepared to wean from 3 months but will only do so as I need the extra milk. I'll wean the bought-in calf first, then if/when I need more milk again, her own calf.
If I had a large family and the time and desire to make all my own cheese, butter, etc, then I'd be doing this a different way, I guess. This way suits us - we enjoy the Jersey and her calves, love the milk and yoghurt and will enjoy experimenting with other products when time and supply permit. She pays for herself through rearing her own and bought-in calves (there may be another later on in the lactation, I'm not sure yet) and the time it takes to look after her and milk her is not so onerous that it becomes a millstone.
Looking forward to hearing more about your adventures down this road - I have enjoyed reading and seeing your approach to halter-training your Shetlands and I am sure will use some of the ideas with the two calves.
And I am hoping to hear other people's ideas and experiences too - so far it all seems to be working out very well for me, but it's still very early days and I am sure there are pitfalls ahead!
Sally
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Have you tried cheese and butter making?
I have made butter, clotted cream, creme fraiche, cream, semi-hard and hard cheeses - but all for other people!
Butter-making is VERY hard work, even with an electric churn. Home-made butter for special occasions only I think!
One thing I haven't had to do for myself before is source the various cultures for the various products - and keep the cross-contamination to a minimum.
I am hoping to find out more about and try some traditional methods and products (eg, 'clobber' - milk left on the warm plate overnight, and other less scientific and simpler ways to make cheeses.) Anyone know any good recipes / techniques?
Cheers
Sally
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We have got three cows that we milk (although they are only all in milk during the summer). We have a BBX jersey, a BBx Friesan and a recently acquired Jersey.
In my experience the BBxJersey is the best house cow. You get the really high quality milk, docility, but a calf that is potentially more valuable that from pure jersey.
There are loads of ways to manage house cows and the calves and everyone finds a different way of doing things that suits them.
We milk the cows by machine (we were lucky to pick one up fairly cheaply) but all the cows are equally happy to be milked by hand - in case of power cuts! The calves are bucket reared and we also buy in extra calves to rear on the surplus milk. Any milk over and above what the calves have, goes to the pigs. Cows are at grass in the summer and housed over the winter.
We produce all our own milk, make butter, yoghurt, ice cream, cheese etc.
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How about doing a house cow book?
I did contact the Shetland Cattle Breeders Association - they generally give about 12litres a day, on average, peaking at 20-24litres. Butterfat is about 5%. So enough to share, I think ;D
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How about doing a house cow book?
This guy's done one, looks like it gets published in the US in a couple of months, July here:
The Family Cow Handbook: A Guide to Keeping a Milk Cow
by Philip Hasheider
No doubt someone here will get a copy and let us know if we should all get one!
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How about doing a house cow book?
There will be a substantial section on House cows and cattle generally in the next book - which is in the pipeline.
Tim wrote a bi-monthly six part series on house cows for Country Smallholding, but it is quite a while ago now.
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How about doing a house cow book?
This guy's done one, looks like it gets published in the US in a couple of months, July here:
The Family Cow Handbook: A Guide to Keeping a Milk Cow
by Philip Hasheider
No doubt someone here will get a copy and let us know if we should all get one!
This book is now published over here. Has anyone seen a copy?
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How about doing a house cow book?
This guy's done one, looks like it gets published in the US in a couple of months, July here:
The Family Cow Handbook: A Guide to Keeping a Milk Cow
by Philip Hasheider
No doubt someone here will get a copy and let us know if we should all get one!
This book is now published over here. Has anyone seen a copy?
Well, no-one else seemed to have seen it so I have bought a copy.
It's a nice book, well-written, easy to read, lots of nice colour photos. I've skim-read it and it seems to cover most of what you would want to know.
It is, however, very American and has not been edited for a European or UK market at all. Immediately obvious areas that would benefit from localisation include:
- breeds of cattle suitable for a house cow - many are similar or the same, a few described are not available here, and a large number of less mainstream British breeds are not there (no Kerry, no Gloucester, no Galloway, no Shetland, no Blue Grey - and no mention of British Blue in the crossbred section either; Dexter is there, and Milking Devon, which is a US descendant of the Red Devon)
- the book seems to assume that you'll have a single cow (although there are many pictures of two-cow systems being used) and, although it does talk about ruminants being social, it states that a dairy cow will do fine even if she's the only animal on the farm - not something we would feel comfortable about over here
- diseases and related topics - for instance, it talks about getting a cow that's been vaccinated against TB, which is not an option here, and doesn't mention BVD, IBR or Bluetongue at all
- American weather (it hardly mentions rain! but spends a lot of time talking about heat and humidity)
- American availability of grass and grain give a slightly different feel to discussions of feeding
- pretty much all of the UK is copper deficient, but copper is not mentioned in this book
All in all, I would still recommend Valerie Porter's "Cows for the Smallholder" for a UK-based person wanting to get a house cow.
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We got 2 Jersey heifers beginning of last month that we plan on having as house cows. Thank you for this thread, it's been informative, can't wait until my girls are big enough to have babies and then I can get started with being a domestic goddess and making my own dairy products ;D
They're a nice change from screaming pigs :D
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Oh, congratulations on your beautiful girls! Piccies.... please? :D
Today my Hillie has been giving me big loves - resting her head on my shoulder and having her jaw rubbed. Ahhhh. :-* :love: :cow:
She is an ace communicator - she doesn't speak English but she's great at pointing. For instance :
Hillie: (pointedly licks silage wrap used as insulation around water pipe) means "Grass no good, time for silage" (She got hay, we weren't ready to start on the silage just then!)
Hillie: (pointedly licks empty green Crystalyx bucket in the byre) means "Our minerals tub in our field is empty" - it was.
She is thoroughly spoiled and we don't deny it - but then she works harder than any other coo on the farm!
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Its a pity this thread didn't come up early 2011. My ex-neighbour (I moved) was a 76 year old farmer who had always kept a house cow. The one he had all the time I lived there was a red poll. He used it for all kinds of things, would put it in with his herd for a few weeks before he got them in for winter - he walked them along the roads and she knew her way home. I think he used to put it to an angus.
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Its a pity this thread didn't come up early 2011.
Uh, here's the initial post in this thread:
http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/forum/index.php?topic=13031.msg126973#msg126973 (http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/forum/index.php?topic=13031.msg126973#msg126973)
dated 22nd Feb 2011
Nice story about your neighbour, anyway. We do use Hillie to lead / show the others where to go / what to do. BH says she'll follow me anywhere :D
We're just commissioning our refurbished cubicle shed, and Hillie's been showing the others how to get up into the cubicles. She has a 'get up' command, which I use to get her back onto the milking platform if she steps back when she finishes her cake, so I just used that to get her into the cubicles. Sadly I'd never taught her a 'lie down' command so we just had to wait for nature to take its course to get that bit!
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I kept a series of Jersey House Cows for many years and made the usual butter, clotted cream and ice cream etc. even had a go at cheese
I started with Valerie Porter's "Cows for the Smallholder" and that gave me a pretty good start, after reading Self Sufficiency to whet my appetite. Just jumped in with both feet, and it seemed to work, but I wish I the internet had been around then. I found this a while ago with lots of interesting info
http://familycow.proboards.com/index.cgi (http://familycow.proboards.com/index.cgi)
All the best
Sue
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I found this a while ago with lots of interesting info
http://familycow.proboards.com/index.cgi (http://familycow.proboards.com/index.cgi)
Sounds great - but nothing is working today! Will try again another day :)
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Hi there - just gave it a try and its working for me. But you do have to register to use the forum etc. I did and it was no hassle and they don't pester you or anything. Give it another try but register when you get there
All the best
Sue
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Hi Sue
I tried to register first, then tried every other option. But I tried again later - and realised that the top part of the page is all a banner, the content is changing way down below. ::) Bit of a nuisance to have to keep scrolling down every time you move to another page, but at least I'm in and registered now. Thanks for the tip - I think I will get a lot from that site. :thumbsup:
Cheers, Sally
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Its a pity this thread didn't come up early 2011.
Uh, here's the initial post in this thread:
http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/forum/index.php?topic=13031.msg126973#msg126973 (http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/forum/index.php?topic=13031.msg126973#msg126973)
dated 22nd Feb 2011
Okay - maybe I should have written "I wish I'd noticed it back then", which is of cours impossible because I wasn't registered here then. :P
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Here are my girls ;D
Yoyo is the bigger one and Flake is the smaller one, daughter Charlotte in the middle :)
(http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii205/Langley_album/DSC006881.jpg)
Yoyo isn't as toed out in real life it's just the way she's stood ;)
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Are they both Jerseys?
Lovely picture. :)
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look at that yorkshire and dry ground :farmer:
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Are they both Jerseys?
Lovely picture. :)
Yes they are, I love them, didn't think I'd like cows quite as much as I like these two :D
Robert, I just hit lucky with where we were stood, pig field not quite so dry ;)
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I know. I really like ours too :) :cow: :cow: :cow:
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I like ours, but poor Specs has to go :'( - her udder is shot and she is barren too.
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:cow: :'(
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Oh they are so adorable. :)
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Are they both Jerseys?
Lovely picture. :)
Yes they are, I love them, didn't think I'd like cows quite as much as I like these two :D
Beautiful! :love: :cow:
I knew I would love my Jersey but I wasn't expecting the level of bond which forms between a house cow and her human. BH says, "She'd follow you to Silloth," and I expect she would. I miss her if I am away - and she misses me for sure. She also gets jealous if I am giving too much attention to any other cow - or pig, collie dog, or anything! - and comes over and wraps her head and neck around me.
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sally just wait till she gets the taste of your strawberry patch ;) :farmer: