The Accidental Smallholder Forum

Livestock => Sheep => Topic started by: juliem on January 09, 2019, 04:48:10 pm

Title: retrieving old flock number
Post by: juliem on January 09, 2019, 04:48:10 pm

Hello  ....I just rent the land out so I don't know anything about sheep.
However my tenant..fairly elderly keeps 50 plus sheep on my fields .He's had the same flock no for 30 odd years.
Last winter his son took over managing the flock and the flock number was transferred into his sons name.
However things did not work out and his son handed back the flock.(Very acrimonious...still not speaking to each other a year later !!) His son does not keep any sheep now.
Now my tenant wants his old flock number back  and he did ring DEFRA...but got nowhere.
He would like his old flock no back so he can use his tags he already has.
I have offered to ring DEFRA for  him and he is coming round to my house tomorrow afternoon and hopefully sort it out with Defra....
Any tips ?
I Jjust get the single farm payment....do I NEED TO GET MY SBI NO/DETAILS/FIELD NO'S UP ON COMPUTER BEFORE I RING THEM

Title: Re: retrieving old flock number
Post by: pharnorth on January 11, 2019, 11:43:44 am

Seems no one knows- did you succeed?

Title: Re: retrieving old flock number
Post by: juliem on January 11, 2019, 10:44:48 pm

 No because he did not come round but  I will catch him when he comes to feed them tomorrow evening.
The flock number debate started when I told him he should have sold his lambs by now and he said he couldn"t.

Title: Re: retrieving old flock number
Post by: Backinwellies on January 12, 2019, 08:08:08 am

If I understand you correctly then the actual flock number was transferred to son … so I'm guessing only the son can agree to transfer back.  Not likely to happen.    so new number will be necessary … and new tags …. maybe time to find new tenant?

Title: Re: retrieving old flock number
Post by: juliem on January 12, 2019, 11:29:23 am

your probably right about the new tenant....but I only have 12 acres and although well fenced /water  I live in an arable area and theirs not many takers .
So even if the son has no sheep he can't be made to give up the flock number.?
So when the sheep go to auction do the auctioneers cheque electronically the records for the flock no ?
Are new tags expensive ?

Title: Re: retrieving old flock number
Post by: shep53 on January 12, 2019, 12:53:44 pm

Confused !  if I read it correctly he has lambs to sell and has the correct tags in stock to put in them  and he has a holding number ? then just tag them and sell them  ?      The only time I use a flock number is to order tags , so he gets a new number and tags for this years lambs ? Farmers sell livestock every day with different  flock/ herd numbers to their own

Title: Re: retrieving old flock number
Post by: juliem on January 12, 2019, 04:24:02 pm

yes he has lambs from last year that he will probably sell as hoggets .this Spring. So he can still sell them under his old flock number and tags.
And this years lambs he will need a new flock no and new tags ....they are not due to lamb till April..
Thanks everyone for helping me get my head round flock numbers

Title: Re: retrieving old flock number
Post by: fsmnutter on January 12, 2019, 05:27:02 pm

I still think you should call the authorities. As far as I understand it, a flock number is issued to a person relating to a certain holding number, so this will probably still be the same one if he used to have that flock number on that land.
The guys on the other end are very helpful and knowledgeable about these sort of details.
Good luck

Title: Re: retrieving old flock number
Post by: pharnorth on January 13, 2019, 12:54:38 am

I agree with fsmnutter.  The sheep are on your land and the authorities legally need a clear line of communication with the flock owner otherwise you could be involved if there were issues with tag numbers, welfare, outbreaks of disease etc etc Whether it is his original flock number or a new one isreally not important (except perhaps psychologically to him) but what does matter is Defra know who he is, and his flock number is associated with the CPH number relevant to your fields.

Title: Re: retrieving old flock number
Post by: Penninehillbilly on January 13, 2019, 12:29:35 pm

Ate you able to contact the son and act as a go-between? Maybe son does not realise he has to do the  transfer back ?

Title: Re: retrieving old flock number
Post by: shep53 on January 13, 2019, 01:49:19 pm

phone APHA 03000200301 and ask about livestock registration , they are the people who give you flock numbers

Title: Re: retrieving old flock number
Post by: juliem on January 14, 2019, 08:18:43 pm

replying to Penninehillbilly about acting as a go between....I am trying not to get involved....believe me the relationship has completely broken down.Rented a field to a couple with horses once..they split up and were argueing about who owned the horses.Never again.
The father and son had completely different approaches to keeping sheep.The son..very professional/worming/vacinnating/always on top of flystrike/checked every day.The father more keeping sheep as pets...but he is quite a character and more bidable .ie he does what I say..no youthful arrongance.
Yes will try and phoning that no tomorrow..shep53.If it's defra they are usually very helpful.