The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Sheep => Topic started by: graham-j on May 25, 2017, 09:37:18 am
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Hi I Lost another lamb this morning laying on its side fitting.
I have lost 3 the same way. I lost two 3-4 weeks ago two days apart, I put out hi mag lick buckets seemed to stop any further deaths , but now another one.
All lambs about 3 to 4 weeks old and in really good condition.This is from 26 lambs.
The problem seem to start when the lamb starts to eat/nibble grass.
I have just heptivact the ewes but not yet the lambs.
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Have you asked this question to your vet?
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If the ewes were not on the Heptavac system prior to lambing the lambs will have no passive immunity to any of the clostridial diseases.... in which case they should have had their 1st shot at 3 weeks old. Without a PM you will however not know what the cause is...
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Have you spoken to the vet? I think on your post a few weeks ago everyone suggested Heptavaccing both ewes and lambs, so if the lambs haven't still been done then could well still be pasturella. The ewes won't pass on any immunity now to the lambs and they would be well overdue their first shot.
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Ewes should receive their Heptavac booster a month before lambing's due to start, then the antibodies to the common clostridial diseases, which the lambs will encounter at pasture if not before, will be absorbed from the colostrum suckled in the first hours after birth. I have never known a lamb that's fitted, for whatever reason, to subsequently recover.
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Twizzel sorry I'm not following you what do you mean by " and they would be well overdue their first shot"
After consulting may people including the vet it was agreed Heptivac P is the way forward, I have Injected the ewes and realise it is too late for them to pass it on to the lambs this year so I will be inoculating the lambs separately.
I will also be having worm counts carried out.
And looking at getting tests done for colbolt and selenium.
Regards Graham
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I think Twizzel is saying that because the ewes were not vaccinated prior to lambing, that you have lost lambs and their age now that you should get them vaccinated asap and I would agree. Ewes would not have been my priority.
Checking for deficiencies is also a good idea. A mineral drench prior to lambing is also a good idea.
No harm in a worm count but it doesn't sound like worms.
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Can you describe the fitting a bit better? Not sure that fitting relates to clostridial problems, although quick death does.
We noticed a 6 week old lamb rolling about on the grass, as if fitting, the other day. We observed it, and it seemed to me that it was a stomach problem, rather than a mental one, and that it might be a little bloated, although not unduly. We caught it, jabbed it with a/b, gave it some lamb quick start, also some bicarbonate of soda diluted, and, for good measure, some liquid paraffin. Kill or cure, we thought, as we had not seen anything like this in 15 years of keeping sheep. Half an hour later, she had recovered, and 3 days later, no further problems.
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I think Twizzel is saying that because the ewes were not vaccinated prior to lambing, that you have lost lambs and their age now that you should get them vaccinated asap and I would agree. Ewes would not have been my priority.
Checking for deficiencies is also a good idea. A mineral drench prior to lambing is also a good idea.
No harm in a worm count but it doesn't sound like worms.
Yep that's what I meant! I would be doing the lamb's first vaccine(shot) with a matter of urgency. They don't build up immunity until a few days after the 2nd jab so it really needs to be done asap to get the ball rolling. The fitting could be if it is pneumonia pasturella due to high fever/temperature. The other thing to check is VitB12 deficiency (ccn) but I think they are a bit young for that, it normally occurs in rapidly growing older lambs in autumn.
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Pretty sure heptavac can't be given til lambs four weeks anyway?
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Ovivac p can be given to younger lambs (3 weeks IIRC). The additional coverage by Heptovac rather than ovivac isn't really required until adulthood.
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Pretty sure heptavac can't be given til lambs four weeks anyway?
No it is 3 weeks minimum.
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And the main reason for waiting till lambs are 3 weeks is because they will have some antibodies from their mothers that have to wane before they can respond fully to the vaccination. If mothers are unvaccinated then these antibodies are not present in lambs so the 3 weeks would be less important.
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I have lambs ranging from 1 day old to 7 weeks old with still some to come. Heptivac P lasts for just one day once open.
How long from the first vaccination dose it become effective.
The only lambs to be affected are 3-4 weeks old, there is no sign of any problems in the lambs once they get past this point.
I would also say there is no sign of bloat or diarrhoea.
The fitting is lamb sat on its arse shaking violently foaming at the mouth,then laying on its side with its legs going backwards and forwards like its running .
The first one was grunting with rapid breathing followed by the running on its side.
Thanks Graham
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Some thing I have just realised the last lamb to die did not have colostrum from its mother it had the powederd stuff as the mother originally rejected the lamb violently.I have a feeling this may be the case with at least one of the other two.
We have had a few we have had to pen up and halter the mother.
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I don't think immunity occurs until a week or so after the 2nd jab of heptavac. That said I've not lost one so far after it's had the first jab. So if you have a group of 3-4 week old lambs it would be expensive but worth doing them now, then when they have their 2nd jab in 4-6wks I would do you other lambs first jab. So you would need 3 bottles instead of 2, but that would hopefully start to halt pasturella. That said it would be worth if you have any more deaths getting the vet to pm a fresh carcass and see exactly what is going on. Pasturella sounds likely but you'll never know for sure unless you pm one.
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I don't think immunity occurs until a week or so after the 2nd jab of heptavac.
Immunity starts after the first injection but at low levels then 2wks after the second injection it is at maximum level