The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Poultry & Waterfowl => Topic started by: perkhar on February 17, 2017, 08:27:41 pm
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Anyone got any money saving tips for hen keepers any ideas welcome
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Porridge with milk fills them up, reduces overall feeding bill. You can add honey if they need a boost
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Porridge with milk fills them up, reduces overall feeding bill. You can add honey if they need a boost
Surely this is more expensive than a handful of pellets??
If you worked out the price for 25kg of porridge oats it works out @ £90, ( even more if you buy a well known brand), whereas 25kg of layers pellets cost @£8.
Of course it will fill them. . . . but I can't see it saving you any money or getting any more eggs.
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Cheap porridge oats doesn't cost that much, does it?! Gosh! :-[
I must admit I haven't needed to buy any for a long time, as I was given a lot when a friend gave up her hens.
If you're that concerned about costs, I would do as suggested above and reduce your number to those that are laying regularly. I must admit my hens are not laying machines, they are sort of pets, so I have a different view. :innocent:
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I must admit my hens are not laying machines, they are sort of pets, so I have a different view. :innocent:
I have to agree with you there doganjo. I have a few hens because I like having my own eggs and I enjoy having the birds around. Mine stay with me till they die. (Sometimes sooner than I would wish - curtesy of the fox)
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I like giving caged hens a wee shot at a longer and better life too. Last lot arrived three days before the ban started but at least they have a good bit bigger a cage - probably ten times bigger, so I don't feel bad about them, and next week they'll have the new experience of earth to poke about it - still fenced in but a bit more freedom than a dog run. :excited: Looking forward to seeing them in the field in April. They're getting a chance to grow feathers just now.
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Sell or eat them before the first moult. Saves feeding non-productive stock and avoids health problems in older, weaker hens.
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Perkhar, how far do you want / need to take this cost saving? Keeping a small number of chickens doesn't provide you with eggs cheaper than a larger scale operation can produce them for who have the economies of scale, so it may just not be right for you at the moment?
There will always be costs and their welfare should not come second to saving pennies, but if you're just looking on getting inexpensive treats then the discount aisle at the supermarket can be worth a rummage :thumbsup: Lots of people clearing their allotments now, too.
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Hi guys well I'll tell you my background I have kept hens for 4 years and have over 60 hens. My bird welfare is top priority. They have a large agricultural shed for housing and are bedded with sawdust every week. I feed them on layers pellets which I have blown in 3 ton at a time to reduce cost and I feed them barley as a scratch feed. Which I order in for our flock of sheep anyway.
I buy packaging like boxes a pallet at a time and I supply my local shop which is a stones throw away from the croft.
I also get supplies of fruit and veg that is just past shelf life and give this to them to keep them entertained.
Before this bird flu outbreak they had over 30hectors to roam if the wished.
I'm interested in any form of cost cutting from any angle not just feed. Saving money whilst breeding live stock doesn't have to effect there wellbeing. It's just thinking about practical ideas in order to make the production of eggs free range more profitable and viable for the future. I know a lot of friend that breed livestock on a smaller scale and have some clever little ways to save in certain areas. From using shredded paper from work for bedding, using a turbine to create 12v power to light there coop. Ect ect.
Looking to see if anyone else has anything interesting to share
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I agree, especially if you're selling eggs etc and trying to make ends meet, or even make a profit, finding ways to keep costs down is essential.
Great tips on the shredded paper - I do the same in my nestboxes with paper from a friend's work. For the chick brooders and runs I also line with cardboard from supermarkets as a base and then cover with horse bedding pellets called Verdo. It wouldn't work large scale, but for the brooders and smaller cages, it lasts for a month minimum and a little goes a long way.
Would be interested to hear other people's tips!
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Bulk buying their food saves at least 1/3 of the cost. If you don't have enough birds for that, team up with a few others.
Grow your own greens for them. Swiss chard works well and is cheap snd easy. Gdng the leaves up in bunches for them to strip.
Then choose productive hybrid hens, buy them at commercial rates (not pet shop prices!) and cull them at the same time as the big boys do.
Btw, we do none of the above, but that's the answer to your question! :). However, I get the feeling in this case that you already know more about this than we do, so please share more!
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The only thing that we have done to cut major cost is use newspaper as coop bedding. We have a variety of coops and not all have taken to it immediately though- some thought shredding it and throwing it through the pop-hole was great fun! We had to lower the perches considerably (to about 6") to avoid bumble foot, because newspaper doesn't cushion the impact like shavings.
We found kiln dried sand was good in brooders after the chicks were a week old- just sieved out the poo daily then threw the sand over the lawn when it got too stinky.
We buy food in bulk to save on price (about a third), but have to be very careful with the shelf life.
If we were really keen on saving cost we would remove the poor or non-layers, but we keep chickens for our pleasure and give away excess eggs (can't sell them legally here without a business licence). We have one hen (Margo) who has never laid an egg in her life - she will be 7 years old in April, but she is a very pretty (Gold with Black Lacing) Wyandotte.
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we are organic so for starters are food is a lot more than conventional -a quality conventional bag say £8 while organic is £11. I buy ton tote bag which is a saving. I am pasture fed in the spring/summer so they are on fresh grass I only put shavings in the laying box. My house is slatted on wheels so my inputs are low. I usually have water direct so my savings are time and not wasting on straw bedding etc. Our only expenditure is the food. However, as they are in - in a large barn this is different but not a lot. I sell my eggs at £3.80 for 12 and £8.50 tray I have worked this out thoroughly in my costings I am not doing it for fun. It needs to break even and above all make profit. I lost a lot to Mycoplasma so I have to ensure I am covering for losses. In future I will only buy fully vaccinated flocks which I think will help with future loses.
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Great ideas floating about we are in the western isles, feed costs are high the feed here if bought per bag at the local agricultural supplies store is 450 a ton bagged. To get packaging up you have to do it via a pallet load you add 70 pound a pallet to anything you bring up to the islands in Scotland.
As I said I have got my feed as low as I can get it. Without compromising laying quality and health.
I never used to use shavings on the floor until I started housing them full time. But I like the idea of it know the house is a lot fresher and saves a lot of time scraping dry matter off the concrete floor. So I will continue this.
Again local store is charging 13.75 for a 15kg bale of dust which if bought in bulk I think I could almost half that delivered. As I said this is a new thing so still need to get more organised with the bedding. I mentioned the shredded paper I like this idea for me it's getting enough of it to do the house without having to drive around collecting it. Working full time leaves little time and is not practable for me but would work great for a smaller set up.
Any suggestions on where to buy dust from would be appreciated ?
Boxes I buy 5000 plus boxes at a time works out 8p a box delivered to my door good quality boxes with flat tops.
I was getting Lables printed they looked great and still have a number of them to use up but they are very expensive when you take in to consideration the selling price. So another reason for sourcing flat topped boxes of a higher score more shinny paper like quality was to allow me to move from stickers to an impression stamp for my lable. This was a massive saving and now costs me less than a 1p to lable a box. Total packaging is now less than 10p
I like the idea of sand in the coop we use it to line the heads before straw to stop it sticking you could always rake out the muck and keep adding fresh sand. That's if you can get a supply of it. I could get as much as I wanted so might look in to this I don't know if it would work long term as you would eventually get sodden and you would have to get it all out but then again that's all you do with the sawdust anyway.
Although I have never done it myself I have a friend that brings up seaweed from the shore and puts it in the run and the hens go mad for it. Not only a free source food from the weed it's self and all the beasts that usually are amongst it. It keeps the entertained for a while.
selling eggs hybrid hens are a must to profit. I love walking around poultry shows and seeing all the breeds and if I had more time I'd keep some for pets but they don't layer enough to pay for them selfs in most cases.
If you have power in your shed what light do you use if it's not led. Then your burning more power than you need to light your shed. I'm guilty of it I had floresent strip lights from a clearance job at work put them in the chicken coop. But truth be told they use more Power than nessasary. Swap it out to led and what he your power usage drop. Better still come of mains altogether and go wind or solar. Expensive to start but once it's in.
I get nest boxes from work they are boxes with a hole cut in them, filled with straw. I used to use fish baskets but I have an endless supply of card board boxes and these I can replace weekly I take them out and burn them and that keeps my eggs a lot cleaner with fresh bedding regularly.
Still looking for more ideas keep them coming you may think it's obvious or silly but small things make a big difference. In my experience and know matter what you know you don't know everything thanks for the responses so far.
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In days of old the difference between profit and loss was being able to sell your chicken poo to farmers for fertiliser. Is there a market for that where you are Perkhar?
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I use a bit of it my self atm it goes in to the mitten and is left there until it's used to spread. I put some of it on our veg plot too. But I'm afraid we are spoilt for fertiliser here with un unlimited supply of seaweed which is used by everyone. But defiantly a option for inland bird owners even composting it down and selling it a bag at a time at farm gate with the eggs...
My composting has a lot to be said for too. It contains far to much straw and doesn't breakdown quick enough but that's through laziness just piling all the bedding in one mound.
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Hi Perkhar
I live off grid so I produce all my electric through solar or wind turbine
LED Lights are available on Ebay for about £5 and will run off a 12v car battery for days as they are only 1watt
I use them in my stables for chickens + my 2 dogs.
Also runs the incubator all spring+summer + lights up the shed when we are lambing
I also use Freecycle in my area as people are always wanting to get rid of old bits + bobs,chicken wire,sheds,feeders are to name a few of what i have collected locally even a used sofa for my outdoor dogs.
When you go to your local feed store ask if they have any damaged bags,i bought 2 on friday for £7 when i weighed it I have 48 kg,so the bag didnt loose much.
I have a guy local who makes garden furniture,I buy all the shavings from him for a few quid also sawdust.
Prevention is better than cure when it comes to red mite,so I use Poundland Vaseline type cream on the perch ends and underneath,I find they get trapped in it if they are around.
In the spring summer I cut large bunches of nettles,let them die down for a day or 2 then hang for the birds,they love it + its free.
Also if you have surplus eggs and a cockerel in with them sell some as hatching eggs,you will get more as hatching eggs than eating eggs.
My favourite that I use all the time is if you have a local bookies go in and ask for all the old papers,racing post etc,good for shredding for nest boxes and great for young chicks in brooders.
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Porridge with milk fills them up, reduces overall feeding bill. You can add honey if they need a boost
Surely this is more expensive than a handful of pellets??
If you worked out the price for 25kg of porridge oats it works out @ £90, ( even more if you buy a well known brand), whereas 25kg of layers pellets cost @£8.
Of course it will fill them. . . . but I can't see it saving you any money or getting any more eggs.
I actually do feed rolled oats to hens and geese in winter. £3.50 per 20kg bag. Layers pellets £6.70
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12v defiantly the way to go. I just haven't got around to it yet it's on my list todo. I spent my weeks work holiday last year running mains out to all the sheds and wiring them but really think 12v is clever. Also your not reliant on mains. I have even thought of doing the lighting in the house off it but these are all in the clouds arm with a full time job. The famous saying if only lol.
We are remote like really remote lol one shop with a petrol pump. No clothes stores. A mobile bank and a few pubs. Not a massive loot available in bulk shredded paper but I'm going to look in to it.
I can't compete with the hatching eggs online. They are too cheap. I did this as a hobbie for a while but postage is a killer here. So that's when I went full in to laying hens no cockerels. I get a good price on my eggs I sell at 1.80 a half doz. to the local shop and I sell at the farm gate for 2.00 a half doz but trust me I need every penny of it to turn a profit.
The biggest expense I have arm is bedding and feed I can't cut down feed anymore I have tried all sorts in the past with giving them grains instead of layers but the egg numbers drop dramatically. There is no doubts about it layers pellets work. I don't know why they make such a difference but they do, as much as it saddens me to say it.
Bedding is new to me and I'm trailing different methods at the shavings are most convenient and I know if I shopped around I could drop them considerabley, but I'm not Aposed to trailing other methods of bedding. Sand is one of them I can get as much of this as I want for next to nothing. Would it work as well I don't know anyone tried the two??
Recycling defiantly is a good method of saving in agriculture, mod cons are great but like with a lot of gadgets out there they would never pay for them selfs if you took them in to consideration.... One mans junk is another mans treasure.
Oh another saving I do which is really obvious and I'm sure you all do. My boxes that go to the shop,are marked and Labled and new. Where as the boxes sold with the eggs at the farm gate are second hand and marked with just the date. A wee saving but still a saving.
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Porridge with milk fills them up, reduces overall feeding bill. You can add honey if they need a boost
Surely this is more expensive than a handful of pellets??
If you worked out the price for 25kg of porridge oats it works out @ £90, ( even more if you buy a well known brand), whereas 25kg of layers pellets cost @£8.
Of course it will fill them. . . . but I can't see it saving you any money or getting any more eggs.
How do they lay off them?? Out of interest mine don't lay as well on barley alone... Whole oats are 209 a ton here barley is at 195 a ton there's defiantly a reason why layers are so expensive they wouldn't sell them otherwise know one would buy them otherwise. I'd like to see a commercial units feeding program to compare with
I actually do feed rolled oats to hens and geese in winter. £3.50 per 20kg bag. Layers pellets £6.70
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Cheap porridge oats doesn't cost that much, does it?! Gosh! :-[
In a word, no - i suspect Roy is working it out on supermarket prices - a quick google showed 25kg of porridge oats in bulk costing £16.98.
Mind you its still more than layers pellets , but its not drastic if you want to give your hens a treat
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Porridge with milk fills them up, reduces overall feeding bill. You can add honey if they need a boost
Surely this is more expensive than a handful of pellets??
If you worked out the price for 25kg of porridge oats it works out @ £90, ( even more if you buy a well known brand), whereas 25kg of layers pellets cost @£8.
Of course it will fill them. . . . but I can't see it saving you any money or getting any more eggs.
How do they lay off them?? Out of interest mine don't lay as well on barley alone... Whole oats are 209 a ton here barley is at 195 a ton there's defiantly a reason why layers are so expensive they wouldn't sell them otherwise know one would buy them otherwise. I'd like to see a commercial units feeding program to compare with
I actually do feed rolled oats to hens and geese in winter. £3.50 per 20kg bag. Layers pellets £6.70
I feed them more in winter when eggs tend to stop anyway or at least give them layers pellets in the morning and oats in the afternoon/evening.
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Hi guys well I'll tell you my background I have kept hens for 4 years and have over 60 hens. My bird welfare is top priority
[/quote If you'd told us this in the first place the responses might have been a whole lot different
I have sources for crossshredded paper for their runs - messy but efficient as it can be composted on clean out days.
Ordinary shredded paper seems to encourage them to try to eat it - maybe they think it's worms :roflanim:
If composted weekly into open bins/raised beds and left to the elements the pungency and risk to plants/seedlings is minimised, and reduces the ampunt of true compst required. Obviously ther's more just now than usual though so I may have to burn some.
Stalks from veges are a free by product, and I grow stuff I don't like or too much for my own needs if I have space. Friends are often very happy to do the same for the occasional half dozen eggs
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I actually do feed rolled oats to hens and geese in winter. £3.50 per 20kg bag. Layers pellets £6.70
That sounds really good macgro. Whereabouts are you?
I'd love to get some oats at that price for my sheep.
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Cheapest I can see by googling is £3 a kilo
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I actually do feed rolled oats to hens and geese in winter. £3.50 per 20kg bag. Layers pellets £6.70
That sounds really good macgro. Whereabouts are you?
I'd love to get some oats at that price for my sheep.
Leicester.
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Yeh understood. My hens lay all year around and after three years they are gone I can't profit by feeding hens that don't lay.. I'm afraid there isn't any money in hens that don't lay... It's very tight margins. The cost of a hen is an important factor too it takes a while to get that back out of the hen. I last ordered 30 hens at £9 each with a £20 pound delivery charge on top. What kind of price are they down south for hybrids
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Hi Perkhar
I have a mate in Gloucestershire selling hybrids at £17.50 each
When I bred + sold eggs+poultry I sold P.O.L. for ? £15 each
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So I'm not doing to bad here then lol.. My hens are super layers fair play to them. I get mine from Donald macdonald isle of Skye and he's top notch, in terms of help and gets them delivered to your door. He's been supplying hens for years. I wouldn't want to try and produce them for that sort of money. He's obviously got a good system going to raise them at that price.
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I supposed it depends what breed. My feed chappie sells Hylines for £8 each POL
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So I'm not doing to bad here then lol.. My hens are super layers fair play to them. I get mine from Donald macdonald isle of Skye and he's top notch, in terms of help and gets them delivered to your door. He's been supplying hens for years. I wouldn't want to try and produce them for that sort of money. He's obviously got a good system going to raise them at that price.
Does he even have enough money for petrol to come back home after that delivery???
I've seen POL pullets down here for 9-20. Varying from preloved to pet shop etc. Mostly 15.
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Surely sand although plentiful has too much salt in it to be good for bedding or even scratching around?
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We have used sand as I base layer for straw bedding for years for sheep and cattle but I myself have never used it in the coop jus because it's convenient to buy the sawdust in bales that I can carry comfortably over to the coop. As said before they were housed full time I never had anything other than the concrete floor. Which was cleaned weekly.
I wonder how he does it at that price but it's the same as all of us. With very little margins I suppose. I can't say I'm making a fortune from egg production. But that's not why we do it.