The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Sheep => Topic started by: AilsavanRooyen on August 22, 2015, 07:36:29 pm
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We are completely new to sheep and as such we would like help in selecting the breed of sheep (with/without crossbreeding) for our situation for there really are so many to choose from! We might be hoping for too much, or there could be many breeds that fit, but I was hoping that our search for the perfect sheep will at least be simplified a bit by the opinions of the more experienced comrades....And then of course comes the issue of finding those sheep for sale! But one step at a time...
Our situation is that we are taking on a small arable farm on the NE coast of Scotland with low lying good rich soil but somewhat neglected grazing (horses or just occasional topping) amounting to 15 acres over several fields. We would like to get some sheep this year to start using the pasture and to start a breeding flock. This will lead to supplying meat for our future farm shop, and possibly some may be an added 'attraction' to the farm for visitors (so a bit of novelty value won't go wrong!). The ideal sheep therefore will be one that is suited to low lying rich grazing, is easy to work with (for the inexperienced, i..e easy lambers, milky ewes, good temperament), low maintenance (my husband works away and I have 2 young kids), can stay out year round (can provide field shelters) and very importantly, it must taste good! I hope this list might trigger some ideas in people's minds - all ideas very gratefully received! And thanks for sticking out this rambling message... Ailsa
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Have to say I kept Black Welsh Mountain and couldn't fault them.
They are attractive to look at, Small and easy to handle (I am just under 5ft) Intelligent and easy to train. Weren't escape artists despite what everyone told me. Did all on grass. Easy lambers. Good natural mothers and very milky. Normally twin after the first year. No foot problems. Slightly less likely to get fly strike. And...... taste delicious.
Spare ewe lambs were easy to sell to other newbies as starter flocks.
PS Loved weeds and cleaner my fields up beautifully
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Hebrideans mix of 2 and 4 horn for the nice aesthetics to look at. Meat is fantastic and in your ground you can get them easily bucket trained so you can work with them as required they are easy lambers low maintenance milky ewes with good temperaments not sure how physically able you are but they are not to big to turn them over and there's going to be plenty for sale at Lanark mart on 29th august they should also improve the grass also
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Southdowns their lovely, very docile and amazing mothers. Can't rate them enough, they produce very good lambs off grass alone.
Such characters as well.
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Have you read the 'Livestock sheep' section on this site ? If there was a perfect or dream sheep I don't think there would be nearly 60 native breeds in this country to be honest :) There is probably several breeds that may suit your requirements it's more your personal preference. My advice is to select a rare breed to keep the breed numbers up. (see rbst web site there may be something that floats your boat). Good luck :thumbsup:
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Forgot to add my dream sheep are Cotswolds (I like a challenge)!! but I don't think they would probably suit your circumstances But who knows? Certainly have the fleece to shelter them from that weather up there!!
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TBH, these threads always end up with everybody recommending the breeds they keep themselves! However.....
- suited to low lying rich grazing
- easy to work with
- good temperament
- easy lambers
- milky ewes
- low maintenance / outside all year
- a bit of novelty value
- must taste good
Sounds a hell of a lot like Zwartbles or Ryelands to me! :thumbsup: Here is a pic of a couple of our Z's, just because you gave me the excuse! ;D:
(http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j216/Blutack/TAS2011/Sheep/BiscuitandBonnie2.jpg)
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Shetlands may suit you.
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I keep ryelands but the do seem to fit the bill. They have the cuteness factor too because people say they look like teddy bears.
Their short legs mean that they aren't escape artists and don't jump like many other breeds either.
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Shetlands should suit. Bucket / flappy feed bag trained my flock easily, variety of colours and markings for the novelty factor, easy lambers - all lambed outside with no assistance and great mothers, very hardy, and I sold the lambs super easy. :)
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TBH, these threads always end up with everybody recommending the breeds they keep themselves! However.....
- suited to low lying rich grazing
- easy to work with
- good temperament
- easy lambers
- milky ewes
- low maintenance / outside all year
- a bit of novelty value
- must taste good
Sounds a hell of a lot like Zwartbles or Ryelands to me! :thumbsup: Here is a pic of a couple of our Z's, just because you gave me the excuse! ;D:
(http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j216/Blutack/TAS2011/Sheep/BiscuitandBonnie2.jpg)
Yes I foresaw that people might just like to say that their sheep are the best, but certainly not all sheep suit all habitats and owners, so to hear suggestions, with justification, is such a help. Your Zwartbles are seriously beautiful sheep, thank you! I can seee why you ightt want to show them off. Will be chasing up all ideas with great interest. I can see me wanting to get 2 each of 15 breeds. But I won't...
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This is great folks, thank you! Any further ideas will be welcome but this is just the sort of advice, enthusiasm and interest I am looking for. Since this is going to be a long term relationship I want to like the choice breed from the outset and a bit of character and beauty go a long way! That probably sounds sexist but I'm sure people know what I mean.. (in fact I always was fond of the runt too, or the feisty, but maybe best not to indulge)
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A lot of the breeds mentioned take a long time to mature to a killable weight and kill out the size of hamsters. If you are looking to supply meat for your shop, id at least choose another breed as well (if choosing a primitive at all) to give you a quicker finishing and better sized lamb. Only really saying this, because you suggest with the farm shop that your venture is slightly commercial.
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Zwarbles are pretty hefty which might not suit you.
Your dream sheep will be specific to you, so all we can do is make some suggestions.
The weather and climate of Scotland is very different from much of England, so it could be best to concentrate on local breeds, adapted to Scotland.
The rare breeds are in need of support, especially North Ronaldsays, Soay, Boreray and multihorned Hebrideans. See the thread about 'rare breeds at Lanark Mart' - Palacerigg, which just received its RBST approval, has had the rug pulled out from under it by the local council, so there is a one-off chance to buy some of those sheep, on this Saturday at Lanark. It would be lovely to see them stay in Scotland.
These are little sheep, so the meat carcase is lighter, but makes up for that in wonderful flavour.
For appeal to visitors, the Hebs, especially the multihorns, are stunning.
There are other rare breeds, some suitable for the Scottish climate - look back through past emails on this topic.
Another Scottish hardy breed, although no longer rare, is the Shetland. These come in white and a huge array of other colours and patterns. Added to all the other benefits of the smaller primitives, Shetlands grow a lovely fleece, which adds value and interest for your visitors, the possibility of having their fleece spun at a mill for sale in your shop and a new craft for you to learn.
You can also have the skins tanned for sale, another added value, and the tups have horns which can be used to make buttons, pendants or crooks.
You mention you have children - Shetlands in particular are great for kids to show. They are small, easy to train and handle, and many breeders will be delighted to help with advice and friendship. Some of the other breeds can be too big or too feisty for children to take into the show ring.
I keep the Ancient Type of multihorned Hebrideans and a couple of Shetlands, but in the past I have kept Jacobs (that's another breed with the wow factor, good fleece, beautiful skins and they are ready for slaughter in their first autumn), Gotland, Manx Loughtan, Soay, and some down type crossbreeds for fleece sales (a bit too wet here for them really)
Of all these breeds, only the down types lack the extra taste of the Primitives. This develops in particular in sheep which are reared slowly, so if you are not restricted for space they are a great bet. The Jacobs I mention above are pretty tasty too. Top for us is Hebridean, but I do appreciate that many breeders need a quicker return.
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Every breed is the best breed to the people who keep them, for example I love my Lleyns :hugsheep: My suggestion would be to look at different breeds(which you like) looking at the society webpages and looking up people who keep them. I would email the people who keep them, preferably closest to where you live, and ask them about the breed, maybe even arrange a visit to see them for yourself and that will help you to decide what breed to keep. Possibly go to rare breed shows and talk to the people there.
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Might not have the novelty, but in terms of animals that tick rest if your requirements id say Lleyn or a Lleyn cross. Yes I'm as guilty as everyone else for suggesting their own breed! We've had first year with lleyn X charmoise hill and produced fantastic lambs.
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Yes it is a cracking cross
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The ideal sheep therefore will be one that is suited to low lying rich grazing, is easy to work with (for the inexperienced, i..e easy lambers, milky ewes, good temperament), low maintenance (my husband works away and I have 2 young kids), can stay out year round (can provide field shelters) and very importantly, it must taste good!
I'm relatively new to sheep, I've not got any of my own currently, but have helped for several years with lambing and then spraying, vaccinating, shearing and foot bathing etc.
I've "met" suffolk crosses, southdowns and their crosses (these were suffolk cross x southdown), rough fells, cheviots, herdwicks, texels and their crosses (some texel x suffolk, some texel x all sorts) and some generic white sheep. I didn't find much difference between them all, save to say I am not a southdown fan - too hairy and dopey for me, but any of the others were fine :)
I would personally say avoid anything that gets a top knot or is very hairy, and when you buy AND keep - be ruthless about feet, mastitis and other problems. Don't buy anything with bad feet or that you can find out has had bag problems and if you have a sheep with bad feet or bag problems, don't keep it. If you aren't aiming to supply huge number's and want to keep girls year after year, don't keep anything that prolapses or is a bad mother, don't keep anything that you have to throw extra feed at etc etc
Rather than worry too much about the type, make sure you've sorted out the basics first - your race and/or where you plan to do any necessary work, how to make your field/s work to make getting the sheep in for vaccination/shearing etc etc the easiest for you - IMO if you have the frame work, the breed of sheep you like will work around you, letting you pick what you like :)
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I think I better step in again and better describe our farm as I think when people think of Scotland they tend to think it is all rather wild and for the hardy only! Our area is in fact very soft, fertile and low lying, with most agricultural land here being used in the production of arable crops, soft fruits and beef or dairy. Sadly indeed it is not as warm as or southern neighbours, but we don't get much snow, if any, and the winters are mild. To this end we are in the fortunate position of probably being able to take pretty much any breed we would like. On a personal level I really like the Soay and Hebridean sheep as I spent a couple of seasons on St Kilda, surrounded by Soay sheep, and my cousin has Hebs and they really are incredibly delicious, and lovely sheep. So to Fleecewife I thank you for you well considered recommendations and advice. However, as alluded to by Porterlauren, these might not be the most economically sensible choice for us since when you factor in the time to mature and fixed abattoir costs, irrespective of size, then I think we may be better thinking of a larger lowland breed. My thoughts are currently on perhaps a small number of multihorned hebs or Jacobs (which sound really good) for breeding sales, some meat sales, our own freezer and undeniable attraction, plus some zwartbles or ryelands for main flock, where they will also perform well on all of the above but perhaps with more productivity. We do need to keep a keen eye on commercial viability as quite frankly we will need the money! But I do not see this as reason to compromise on joy of the job when there are so many choices available, and quality must play a large part in this mix. I have yet to look at all the other suggestions but will certainly do so. Waterbuffalofarmer, good idea and what I had in mind. I just have to get a speed on as sales are happening now! Nutterly_uts, spot on, breed is far from the only priority! Getting a 'sheep head' on might just take time, but good to get have such pointers. Just ordered Tim Tyne's book. having read some others I was not feeling genned up enough. Sounds like that should help. I just wonder if I might be able to find some local sheep hand to turn to as that would be a big help (assuming they were a good shepherd!) Perhaps I put that call out on another thread before long!
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When do you want to have lamb ready to sell in your shop?
You could buy store lambs to finish and later some in lamb sheep to give you a crop of lambs next year. If you want to stock your shop all year round you need to think how you are going to achieve that.
Lamb and sheep prices are down at present and it is a buyers market.
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Herdwicks - the Queen of meats :yum:
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I think it all depends on your customers and what meat they want - lamb (you need a lowland cross like a texel cross to finish quick, but not to leave longer than lamb as they get fat)) or hogget (where the slower maturing breeds come into play) and mutton (where you want a really slow-growing animal that doesn't put down fat - the traditional breeds like Shetlands, Hebs etc come into their own).
But on rich ground Shetlands may do just too well.... they are however a good crossing ewe to something like a texel or Charollais, giving quite reasonable lamb carcasses with easy lambings.
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Harmony - sorry I may have confused again, we don't have the farm shop yet. It is only in planning phase at the moment but we hope to have it up and running in 2 or 3 years time for once the kids start school and we have established our red deer herds (another story but that is to be our main focus) Whether or not we can offer year round lamb/hogget/mutton sales remains to be seen but I believe to some extent one can play around with breed of tup to extend breeding season, depending of course on ewe breed and growing conditions. I cannot see us working an intensive system so it is much more likely we will offer the meat according to the season, or of course frozen. We will also have to determine what sells best, but for that we will have to open first. We won't have so many sheep that a change of mind regarding breed should break the bank, but it would be nice to get it mostly right. And then of course to do right by them, and know how to select well will play a huge part in our success.
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Harmony - sorry I may have confused again, we don't have the farm shop yet. It is only in planning phase at the moment but we hope to have it up and running in 2 or 3 years time for once the kids start school and we have established our red deer herds (another story but that is to be our main focus) Whether or not we can offer year round lamb/hogget/mutton sales remains to be seen but I believe to some extent one can play around with breed of tup to extend breeding season, depending of course on ewe breed and growing conditions. I cannot see us working an intensive system so it is much more likely we will offer the meat according to the season, or of course frozen. We will also have to determine what sells best, but for that we will have to open first. We won't have so many sheep that a change of mind regarding breed should break the bank, but it would be nice to get it mostly right. And then of course to do right by them, and know how to select well will play a huge part in our success.
I agree about seasonal lamb/hogget, that's what I do with my sheep. I am intrigued to hear abut your red deer, how are you going to have them killed for meat? By bullet or on farm abattoir?
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Hi I am based in the west of Scotlandand keep a variety of breeds currently have Jacobs, Border Leisters, Zwartbles, Suffolk's, texels and crosses of these breeds I couldn't decide what breed I liked from what you have described it sounds like the zwartbles might be what you are looking we just sent March pure zwartbles to our local butcher for the first time and he was really impressed with the meat and so were his customers. As people have previous said everyone has there own favourite breed I started with Jacobs and just ended up buying different breeds I liked still can't decide what breed I prefer. Feel free to pm me if you would like any further info about any of the breeds I've collected. Good luck on your new adventure.
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If you want year-round fresh sheep meat for your shop you have three choices that I can think of.
- A slow-maturing animal (eg., most of the primitives) which you can slaughter at any stage once they're ready
- A non-seasonal breeder such as the Dorset Horn / Poll Dorset. These would do well on the ground you describe, I think, and do taste good. I helped for a while on a farm which had two flocks of Dorsets, one lambing in spring, the other in autumn, and so they could offer fresh lamb year round. You can use the same tup on both flocks, I think, but in this system each ewe only lambs once a year.
- Have whichever sheep turn you on, and buy in store lambs to fill in the gaps in your own production calender
On primitives or not, the only thing that has occurred to me is that some primitives have meat that's more akin to venison than lamb, on terms of flavour and leanness. If you're selling venison anyway, then that may be either a good thing or not so good!
The Dorset Horn / Poll Dorset is a rare breed, though not primitive, so you would still have that angle. And nice fleeces are good to spin :spin:
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ile de france sound like the breed that would suit you well, there are very versatility, and adaptable, there meat is high quality, they grow at a good rate and is well graded, lamb out of season(same as dorsets) and need very little help lambing( real milky ewes to) and produce real nice fleeces. thought i would add a few pictures, for ones who havent really seen the before :)
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The only breed thats been mentioned which is really a credible commercial maternal breed is the lleyn. The rest are mostly for novelty.
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They're certainly commercial Porterlauren, but to Joe Public, Lleyns just look like standard white sheep :sofa:
The reason I thought the Z's might work here is because they are borderline commercial, the meat is a bit leaner than some, and they are also striking to look at and renowned for being friendly (perhaps because of their dairy origins). As Fleecewife says, they are a big leggy sheep. However, ours are so docile, I can walk up to them in the field and tip them, without worrying about my bad back. For me, that makes them far easier than our panicky Manx Loaghtans, even though the Z's are far larger.
So, friendly, milky, easy lambing, lambs finish the same year...... what's not to like? Well, some keepers on here, myself included, have had problems with bad feet, whilst others have reported that they need hard feed to do well (maybe not for the OP if she's at sea level and has rich grass). They are also neither rare nor British of course!
P.S. Here are a couple of pics to illustrate. I'm sorry - I just can't help myself sometimes! :roflanim:
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The only breed thats been mentioned which is really a credible commercial maternal breed is the lleyn. The rest are mostly for novelty.
'Novelty' Interesting choice of word there. Not a description I would use for the hard work and commitment a lot of folks on here put into keeping pure breed sheep going!
Commercial breeds / crossbreeds are vitally important to the farming industry we need to supply the conveyor belt supermarket system for bland tasting fast growing lamb .
Smallholders and crofters (That is what this site is all about isn't it)? have an opportunity to offer something different to the market by keeping some of the more ' unique ' breeds in smaller numbers and offering a better quality product as well as supporting the rare breeds. I am of the opinion that wool will have its day again at some point in the future. :knit:
Apologies for digressing off subject . :)
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Its just a wild guess here but I think Womble loves his Zwartbles ;D
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Harmony - sorry I may have confused again, we don't have the farm shop yet. It is only in planning phase at the moment but we hope to have it up and running in 2 or 3 years time for once the kids start school and we have established our red deer herds (another story but that is to be our main focus) Whether or not we can offer year round lamb/hogget/mutton sales remains to be seen but I believe to some extent one can play around with breed of tup to extend breeding season, depending of course on ewe breed and growing conditions. I cannot see us working an intensive system so it is much more likely we will offer the meat according to the season, or of course frozen. We will also have to determine what sells best, but for that we will have to open first. We won't have so many sheep that a change of mind regarding breed should break the bank, but it would be nice to get it mostly right. And then of course to do right by them, and know how to select well will play a huge part in our success.
I agree about seasonal lamb/hogget, that's what I do with my sheep. I am intrigued to hear abut your red deer, how are you going to have them killed for meat? By bullet or on farm abattoir?
Hi again! At this stage we are thinking of doing both - field culling and abattoir. I like the idea of field culling most, primarily for welfare but also for financial reasons, so this is what we will do for the ones for the shop. Field culling works best for taking off in small numbers, which is what will suit the shop best anyway, and the surplus we will sell to the new deer abattoir in Fife, only an hour and a bit away, who need supporting and offer a good price.
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If you want year-round fresh sheep meat for your shop you have three choices that I can think of.
- A slow-maturing animal (eg., most of the primitives) which you can slaughter at any stage once they're ready
- A non-seasonal breeder such as the Dorset Horn / Poll Dorset. These would do well on the ground you describe, I think, and do taste good. I helped for a while on a farm which had two flocks of Dorsets, one lambing in spring, the other in autumn, and so they could offer fresh lamb year round. You can use the same tup on both flocks, I think, but in this system each ewe only lambs once a year.
- Have whichever sheep turn you on, and buy in store lambs to fill in the gaps in your own production calender
On primitives or not, the only thing that has occurred to me is that some primitives have meat that's more akin to venison than lamb, on terms of flavour and leanness. If you're selling venison anyway, then that may be either a good thing or not so good!
The Dorset Horn / Poll Dorset is a rare breed, though not primitive, so you would still have that angle. And nice fleeces are good to spin :spin:
Sallyintnorth, great points - hadn't even crossed my mind about the venison clash potential! I'll try not to worry about that, perhaps it is a good thing, mmm. Oh so much to think about!
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The only breed thats been mentioned which is really a credible commercial maternal breed is the lleyn.
My first thought, reading AilsavanRooyen's opening post, before anyone else had posted, was that Lleyn fit the bill perfectly!
There does seem to be a market for Lleyn gimmers, too, which would be another string to their bow.
However, Ailsa seems keen to support rare breeds, to have some sheep that are of interest to visitors and a draw to the shop and to have something that tastes a bit different. Which is not to say Lleyn don't taste good, they do, but not very different. And as has been said, to most people they just look like any other commercial white sheep. Although the breed standard does say that the ewes' faces should be pretty! :innocent:
The only breed thats been mentioned which is really a credible commercial maternal breed is the lleyn. The rest are mostly for novelty.
Ailsa did say in her opening post that she would like sheep with some novelty value, as part of being a draw to get visitors to the shop. ;)
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Ailsa you talked about breeding out of season by choosing the right tup. Actually you need the ewes to be non-seasonal or extended-season breeders too; the ewe has to be cycling in order to attract and accept the tup.
Reading the Dorset Horn & Poll Dorset Sheep Breeders' Association material, they do say that you can use the Dorset to get three crops in two years, which would boost production, and also that you can start the ewes lambing at 15-18 months, rather than having to wait for them to be two years old as you would in other breeds. (Assuming not tupping as lambs.)
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On slaughter and butchering costs being the same, whatever the size of animal... Slaughter is, yes, and will cost a couple of quid more for an over-12 months animal too, so the slower-maturing type will incur this charge.
Butchering - not necessarily. If you were going to cut the carcase into as many pieces, then yes of course, but you tend to make less cuts from the smaller sheep. For instance, whole legs rather than two half-legs (or two half-legs rather than a shank and two leg joints.) Barnsley (double) chops rather than singles, rack of lamb rather than cutlets, etc.
A top conformation commercial lamb, grading E2, is the quickest and easiest for the butcher. No waste, plump muscle, easy peasy. Once you come away from commercial types, you'll have poor conformation to correct and possibly more fat to trim, all of which adds to the work for the butcher.
If I was going to be having the quantities butchered that you will be, I would discuss with the butcher how best to approach the carcase of your chosen sheep, given its strengths and weaknesses, and whatever you know about the requirements of your customers - and agree a rate for butchering that is fair to both parties.
And, in my opinion, superb tasting lamb / hogget / mutton will get your customers coming back over and over again, and getting their friends to come too. That's worth considerably more to you than saving a few pence per kilo on butchering charges. ;)
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I just wonder if I might be able to find some local sheep hand to turn to as that would be a big help (assuming they were a good shepherd!) Perhaps I put that call out on another thread before long!
Also, you could see if you can get some volunteering on a local sheep farm - you'll learn a lot that way, and build a relationship with the farmer which hopefully would be mutually beneficial.
Don't ask to 'come and help for a couple of days to learn about sheep' - that's all one way. Instead, if you have the time, ask if you could help whenever they have a job on, to learn enough that you can be genuinely useful as well as benefitting from the experience yourself ;)
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The only breed thats been mentioned which is really a credible commercial maternal breed is the lleyn.
My first thought, reading AilsavanRooyen's opening post, before anyone else had posted, was that Lleyn fit the bill perfectly!
There does seem to be a market for Lleyn gimmers, too, which would be another string to their bow.
However, Ailsa seems keen to support rare breeds, to have some sheep that are of interest to visitors and a draw to the shop and to have something that tastes a bit different. Which is not to say Lleyn don't taste good, they do, but not very different. And as has been said, to most people they just look like any other commercial white sheep. Although the breed standard does say that the ewes' faces should be pretty! :innocent:
The only breed thats been mentioned which is really a credible commercial maternal breed is the lleyn. The rest are mostly for novelty.
Ailsa did say in her opening post that she would like sheep with some novelty value, as part of being a draw to get visitors to the shop. ;)
And indeed they are the prettiest sheep (said like a true Welshman!)
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Sorry I dont have a breed suggestion as of such
But I find it funny that people assume the breed has to be different to be a novelty to the public
Most of the time for people not "farm savvy" a sheep IS a novelty
A farm 15 mins from me runs huge huge lambing open days, he is very successful, he runs all lleyns, he was once asked why he didnt have some "different" looking sheep for people
The reply was simple
Lleyns look like "boring white sheep", however if you asked any child in the country or adult even to draw a sheep that is what they would draw, and that is what a sheep would be to them, white and woolly, they can relate to that
If the man had a pen on lambs and some were black, some brown and some white, the kids would always go for the white ones because that was what "lambs" looked like, we also found the same with chicks
We used to take chicks to schools for children to see/feel (for free, purely for the enjoyment) they all wanted the yellow chick because thats what chicks were
Some of the brown or multi coloured chicks didnt even get touched as the children didnt know what they were!
I find it very interesting, how I hear over and over how the lleyn is a "boring" looking sheep, but actually it is a "Sheep" looking sheep
My advice would be to look what is in your area, if you want rare then most breeds are rare for some reason or another, so will have downsides, small carcass, horns, wirey wool, etc but should taste good
IMO any breed that is naturally reared on grass and given as little inputs as possible is good tasting :yum:
I didnt get on with zwartbles and I am low land, they werent tough enough, found the feet prone to scald and the ewes really do need feeding, whether that's very very good grass or feed and the lambs grew legs for a long while before growing carcass, and in a market that eats and pays for the carcass.. they just didnt fit for me
A sheep that looks pretty and has a superb shape and is run commercially is the blue texel?
Apart from that I think every breed I could suggest wouldnt be classed as novelty/pretty :)
Good luck with your search! :thumbsup:
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Lleyns.
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Out of interest why do folk think that 'rare' or 'minority' breed sheep taste better than other breeds? Is that based upon in depth, fairly run taste tests. . . . . or just an unsupported statement?
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I don't know if it's of any help to you at all, but I started in sheep breeding by accident really, about 8 years ago. I was given six orphan lambs, four of whom were nice ewes (1 Suffolk x and 3 mules). I only meant to keep them for grass cutting but was persuaded by an ex-sheep farmer to get a ram and breed. Along came a Ryeland tup and he produced some very nice lambs.
These ended up going to market and I decided to get a few more breeding ewes, and got 5 Charollais. Again the Ryeland x Ch produced some nice fat lambs.
I then got a bit fed up of seeing an all-white flock so decided I'd add a bit of colour, and got some Gotlands and Zwartbles, and a Herdwick! I also got Gotland and Zwartbles rams and bred some purebreds for a time, but decided I'd be better off concentrating on commercials for market so sold the rams. In the meantime I had some very interesting crosses! What I've enjoyed is experimenting with crossing different sheep, but of course the resulting lambs are not going to be good for market - however I sold all of them quite easily to smallholders. The Zwartbles x lambs were slower maturing and were sold as stores.
Sadly I lost my Ryeland tup and bought in another. I then decided to bring in yet another tup who was a Meatlinc x - he produced some very consistent and interesting lambs, in particular the Zwartbles ewes were crossed to him and the lambs are fabulous. Unfortunately I found him dead after a heavy head butting session with my Ryeland!
I've now got a couple more tups who I am am bringing on and will be experiencing further with - these are a Texel x Lleyn and Texel x Suffolk, both really good specimens but it remains to be seen what lambs they produce. I need to have two tups so will keep the ones who produce the best lambs.
If you are wanting to produce consistent market type lambs then you will need to get breeds which will produce that - my Ryeland tups crossed with my commercial ewes have fitted the bill. However Ryelands do produce a lot of fleece! Something to think about as flystrike can be a problem.
As to taste - I've never actually tried any of mine but really should! I'm pretty sure that most homebred lamb will taste nice :) .
Sorry about the rambling post but really what I'm saying is that you need to decide what exactly you are after in your 'dream sheep', and having quite a few acres means that you can up to a point experiment. Gotlands are the most gorgeous friendly sheep but don't produce market lambs. Zwartbles are also friendly in the main. Herdwicks are escape artists. If you are wanting meat for your own shop then it probably doesn't really matter what breed you go for - get ones you like!
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Out of interest why do folk think that 'rare' or 'minority' breed sheep taste better than other breeds? Is that based upon in depth, fairly run taste tests. . . . . or just an unsupported statement?
In my case it's from having eaten a few different types of sheep.
Texel - tender, tasteless
Charollais - tender, sweet, succulent
2nd-summer Swaledale off moorland - cooks like spring lamb, tastes like lamb ought to taste. My favourite non-primitive thus far. (But haven't tried Herdwick.)
Old NoE Mule - you'll never make lasagne or moussaka with any other mince again. (Though you have to build in time to let it cool and the bright orange fat run off, that is if you have guests who may not like a pool of orange grease on their plates!)
3-summer Castlemilk Moorit wether - really is gamey, somewhere between mutton and venison in flavour. Many people who "don't like lamb" really like this meat. As do people who don't like venison ;).
3 yr old Shetland ewe - full of flavour, more flavour than Swaledale wether, but needs the long slow cook, even after hanging for more than a week before butchering.
22 month Shetland x Manx (with a bit of other things - Charollais, Beltex, Swaledale & BFL - in there) - just the most wonderful tasting roast I have ever had. And so tender - and not fatty - too.
The research continues :). I am enjoying it very much :D
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re taste I can only tell you about pure Texel and pure Ryeland, both very locally grown.
I agree about Texel.... meaty, tender but not much taste. The Ryeland ( full hogget brother to some of our store lambs) was tender, incredibly tasty and very lean.
Hence we opted to go with Ryelands as we are raising for the table. We have 8 ram lambs which are going to the butcher between end of Sept and end of January. They are already sold and I could have sold as many again.
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I think that there is probably as much (or more) variation within breeds as between them.
Ive killed and eaten a fair range of different breeds of sheep / lamb. Apart from the proper wee primitive things, which taste more like venison, I think that most lamb, when reared on a grass based diet for the same kind of length of time, tastes very very similar.
The change comes probably from the amount of fat laid down etc, and the length of time from birth to slaughter.
Although slow matured lamb / hogged tastes great. . . . . . days to slaughter is the biggest profit factor, way ahead of carcass conformation etc.
So i'll take a fast growing lamb over most other things!