The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Pets & Working Animals => Dogs => Topic started by: Marches Farmer on August 08, 2015, 03:17:02 pm
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OK, perhaps the Chesapeake Bay's not quite right for me (or me for it) - see earlier post. Still casting around for the right breed whilst trying to avoid the Lab. Kind of goes agaisnt the grain to breed rare breed sheep, pigs, poultry and turkeys and have one of the most numerous breeds in the dog world.
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If you dont want a common breed of dog but want retrevier/lab type traits and looks have you considered the Mareema?? I dont have one of these but i would like one!
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OK, perhaps the Chesapeake Bay's not quite right for me (or me for it) - see earlier post. Still casting around for the right breed whilst trying to avoid the Lab. Kind of goes agaisnt the grain to breed rare breed sheep, pigs, poultry and turkeys and have one of the most numerous breeds in the dog world.
You're not going to eat it though. I can't see a contradiction in keeping rare breed livestock and a common breed of pet dog. We have an 8 month old Golden Retriever and she is uncontestedly the most beautiful dog anyone is likely to encounter. She loves me dearly and I her.
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Check out https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_Shepherd -- there's a relatively small breeding population that has been imported back to the UK.
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I once lived with a flat coat for a while (not mine) and he was the dearest dog you could wish to meet, but not the brightest star in the sky. I can't say this is true of all flatties, I have seen some at shows and all have been docile and obedient.
What about a curly coated retriever?
If you are set on a gun dog then best to go to a dog show and talk to gun dog owners. Most will be only too happy to discuss their breed with you.
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We have had two black flatcoats bitches in my family, and on our way to getting a third girl next year. They are the sweetest, most sensitive family dogs. Eager to please and very chilled out inside the house. I really can't think of one single bad thing to say against them.
I believe the males can be bouncy, but I have always had bitches so wouldn't know. Cannot recommend the breed highly enough. You will never regret adding a flatcoat to your family. They come in chocolate too, but I love the sleek black coats. Let us know if you get one!
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Research your flatty line carefully - a lot seem very prone to Cancer :(
Lovely dogs though, fab personalities.
Similar looking and not at all common would be a Hovawart too but may not have the temperament you are wanting? http://www.hovawart.org.uk/ (http://www.hovawart.org.uk/)
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In order to decide the right breed for you, you need to ask yourself what you want the dog for, and what lifestyle you can offer a dog. Your choice should not be based on 'what is the most unusual breed I could have', more what do I want the dog to do and what exercise will it need
The Kennel Club website is a good place to start.
http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/services/public/findabreed/ (http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/services/public/findabreed/)
The only problem with flatcoats (other than them being very happy, very bouncy dogs, so i wouldn't consider them for a young family) is that many strains appear to carry the cancer gene. That said I have friends whose dogs regularly get into double figures, but others whose dogs last no longer than 7 or 8 years. They are a breed I'd have other than the factor of early loss, and the accompanying worry and sadness when they contract that disease.
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Me!!!!
Known as 'The Peter Pan' of the dog world. My father worked and trialled them and had the odd litter so grew up with them. We've chosen to keep one ever since so about 35 years living with them!
They are, in general, much livelier than say a working lab or golden and less easy to train/handle than the other retriever breeds. They love life and are full of boundless energy and enthusiasm. It is said not to own one unless you have a good sense of humour or if you object to guests being kissed all over. They are very affectionate clowns. In general they adore children, adults and all species of animal. They can be constant playmates for children. They are always ready for fun/silliness.
We have an old boy at the moment who is 10 but people are amazed when we tell them his age. He still behaves like a pup! My children think the world of him. Mine have grown up with Flats but some children maybe 'afraid' of the Flats pushy, boisterous nature. However, my Flats have never even accidentally hurt the children and I've been able to trust them as much as you could trust any dog. They are in general very tolerant of small children and there is not a bad bone in my dogs body. He is, like most Flats, an amiable fool.
They can be a bit hyper and obsessive. They need lots of exercise, lots of attention and something to do .... especially young males. I did a bit of agility with my current dog plus trained him as a gundog. Never intended to go shooting with him but it helps to get the level of obedience that makes them easier to handle. Young males often need 'bossing' to stop them getting out of hand. They are in general, no where near as easy to train as a working lab and not as easy to live with. They are not as laid back. They are constantly 'on the go'' and tend not to know when enough is enough.
Flats can be very boisterous, particularly the males. Several people have come to fuss our Flat and said that though they loved them they had parted with theirs (all males) because they couldn't handle them. The males can be strong-headed and do need firm boundaries set. They can be hard to handle 'physically' so need to be trained to a good level. They are big characters with big personalities!
In trials/working tests, not many, if any, can honestly compete with the good old working lab! If you are interested in that side I can run through the differences as I see them.
I did once own a Flat who was aggressive to people and fought like a street fighter. I was only a teenager but trained and worked him and went picking up with him. The gamekeeper wanted to buy him 'an old fashioned keepers dog' he said. He would have kept you safe from poachers, I guess but would have been big trouble had he not been so obedient. He was a one woman dog but totally loyal to me. I know people always say 'check the parents' but his were fine and had the more usual Flattie temperament. So just to say .... they do vary as with any breed. The breeder of my current Flat says that she sees a bit of 'dog aggression' in the breed at shows. When they do fight they can be surprisingly good at it.
Cancer is a problem in all lines of the breed. They originate from a relatively small gene pool of dogs remaining after they fell from popularity as the main retriever breed before the war. It is a worry for the breed as a whole. My sister lost one at 1 year old and I remember being heartbroken losing one at 7 when I was a teenager ..... my first working dog. You will hear lots of sad stories but having said that we have been fairly lucky with them and had on until 14. one 13, one 12, one 11 and one 10. Latest lad is now 10. I'm still in touch with his breeder. His mum is still alive and all but one of his siblings.
I love them :love: :love: :love: :dog: :dog: :dog:. Have tried to mention the good and the bad points. Not as easy as the other retriever breeds but HUGE personalities, loads of FUN, loads of ENERGY, BUSY,BUSY BUSY. Not a sit in the corner type dog but if you are that way inclined they will make you SMILE. :sunshine:
HTH
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Very interesting replies, thank you. I did go to the gundog show last weekend but couldn't get to talk to owners of all the breeds, although I felt a bit like a TV interviewer, "Hello, could you tell me why you chose to keep this breed...?" Breeds will only survive if there's a market for the pups, hence my inclination to get something a bit more unusual
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Not had a flattie but have gordon setters who are part of the flatties ancestry and share their character, lovable clowns xx however i now have collies and prefer the trainability of them. You may find a rarer gundog breed are not easiliy trained and less focused on you than a collie. If i were to get another gundog breed i fancy a viszla they seem quite handler focussed.
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Have you considered an English Setter? getting very rare now, I have an Irish setter but the English I have met have similar temperaments. Although they have a rep for being loopy, they are very intelligent but sensitive dogs-I can see how some would find them difficult to train and how they go 'wrong' but they are very people oriented and quick to learn new commands. Mine at 11 is still learning new ones! He'll also turn on lights, open doors and ambush (in play) other dogs. Mine is from show lines, the next will be from working lines as I'd prefer one with less coat-he will also not be neutered as it knackers their coat and am also moving away from neutering as a norm anyway. I used to keep collies and wouldn't go back now-way too bloody neurotic.
It may not be all of all flat coats but personally, all the ones I've known haven't made it past 7yo or so sadly.
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http://www.pets4homes.co.uk/pets4homes/home.nsf/dogsforsale (http://www.pets4homes.co.uk/pets4homes/home.nsf/dogsforsale)!openform&Breed=Flat%20coated%20Retriever
Here are some ads
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I like the idea of going to a KC assured breeder - don't let a bitch breed until she's 2, no more than 3 litters in a lifetime and no more than two of those within a year. The uplift in price could be a nasty shock, though!
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Very interesting replies, thank you. I did go to the gundog show last weekend but couldn't get to talk to owners of all the breeds, although I felt a bit like a TV interviewer, "Hello, could you tell me why you chose to keep this breed...?" Breeds will only survive if there's a market for the pups, hence my inclination to get something a bit more unusual
At Malvern? I was there all day - Judging Brittanys. You should have shouted - anyone here called doganjo :roflanim:
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I like the idea of going to a KC assured breeder - don't let a bitch breed until she's 2, no more than 3 litters in a lifetime and no more than two of those within a year. The uplift in price could be a nasty shock, though!
Have a look at the Breed Club too - for some breeds, breed clubs ask for higher standards/more of their members than the KC does. Assured breeders are a step in the right direction but I wouldn't always discount a non assured breeder as plenty do more than the KC ask for (and for some people I know, its why they aren't assured members - they don't agree with the scheme)
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Yes, at Malvern, Doganjo. And tell me, "Why do you like Brittanys?"
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My website www.aberdon.org.uk (http://www.aberdon.org.uk) explains a lot of how we got into them. I find them a very exciting breed, ready for anything, but they are not for the faint hearted - if not properly trained they can become self employed. Mine are hooligans because I let them off with too much :innocent:
Our club website has more information - www.brittanyclub.co.uk (http://www.brittanyclub.co.uk)