The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Goats => Topic started by: Roxy on March 07, 2010, 11:13:13 pm
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We collected the new nanny (Alpine) and castrated billy (sanaan coloured, but long haired and pygmy sized). Female very timid, but billy very into human contact. He had been jumping out of the field and following the builders round all day, as they renovated the house for his owners. In fact when we went to fill the movement form in, he followed up, and sneaked past into the house.
Anyway, got them home, and put them in with the big Toggie boys. Fed them all in the big field shelter this morning, and went off to feed the ponies. Got a phone call from my brother to say my goats were out, and in the garden of a neighbour. Raced back, to find the 7 goats at my other land up the lane, having just been put there by my neighbours up there. Seems the other neighbuors had shood them onto the track and up there, which was a bit irresponsible saying its a road they were shood on to. Fortunate the other neighbours had the sense to put them in with the big Nubian goats and pet sheep (which had got out as they opened the gate, and was standing with the men when I arrived.
Shut all the goats up in the ponies stable (with a grille on the top half of the door in case of escapees!) and went to see how they had got out. It looks like the new billy had banged a panel in the back of the shelter and made a big enough hole for him and the others to get through. Instead of grazing in the 12 acres they now had, billy had obviously decided to take his new friends visiting the neighbours. They chose the poshest people with the poshest garden of course!!
I got a phone call from the neighbour later, to tell me they had eaten his trees, and flowers (not sure what flowers, as none are out here yet!) I did enquire which trees, worried in case they were poisonous, but he did not know. So, I now have to pay for replacement flower plants.
We have lined the inside of the field shelter with tin sheets, to stop the problem happening again hopefully.
All the goats followed us back down the track, no bother at all, no leads, just browsing the occasional blackberry bush as they went.. They are all really tame, probably too tame, so no problem to take anywhere.
We then had to go and separate Paddy and the love of his life, Jasmine, as she looks close to kidding. No way would Paddy stay alone, so we penned Jasmine up in the same barn, so he is happy. Jasmine is happy because she can eat her hay without him pinching it!!
I went to feed the pygmy goats tonight and found one of the little females dead. She was fine this morning, or appeared so, and was eating ok. Am wondering if it was something in the haylage, as thats all she had eaten, as she was indoors.
So a stressful day all in all.
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Oh, what a shame, Roxy, poor wee goat. Could ragwort in hay cause this?
At least the newbies have settled in and Jasmine and Paddy are happy, so at least some have had a good day. Hope Jasmine's kids arrive safely.
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I don't know, Rosemary, but as you probably know, haylage is funny stuff if there is a bit in it with soil on it. I do my best to check it for such things, and also Ragwort too, but its not impossible I missed some. There again, for about a week, the goat has looked different, not sick, but I could not say exactly, but the hair on her face seemed to stand out, if that makes sense. Thinking back, I had an alpine look like that, and she dropped dead suddenly one day.
It could be the goat just died of natural causes, she was probably 7 or 8, and thats only going off what the previous owner said. May have her uplifted and tested, to see if anything shows.
Pygmy females are tiny, but I struggled to pull her out on my own. I was thanking my lucky stars it was not Paddy, as I would not have moved him an inch!!!
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I'm not even sure I would recognise ragwort in haylage - everything looks different pickled. I don't feed it to my horse as it's too rich for him - he only needs sight of grass to put on weight.
Eight must be a decent age for a goat, no? I suppose a post mortem might put your mind at rest.
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would ragwort have such an instant effect on a goat anyway ..? It is poisonous I know but in the longer term , the toxin builds up over time .
cheers
Russ
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If it affects goats like horses, then no, ragwort would not kill instantly. But the haylage problem, yes. My friend lost two of her horses, both found in the field very ill unable to get up. Other two eating the same big bale were ok. Vet tested water, feed, grass etc. and came to the conclusion, there was soil in the haylage bale, and the two horses had eaten haylage with soil in it. I am not saying the haylage was the cause for my goat, just a possibility.
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Right cheers Roxy I will keep an extra careful eye on my haylage then . I take by hand , all the haylage I need for my horses each day , stuff it in bags and then carry it over to the feeder , so I get to see everything that is in the haylage. I would always have taken out any soil I saw anyway , but I had never heard of this happening ? I know when I dig my veggie plot over, any grass clods get chucked into the field to fill any pot holes .
I have seen many times the horses eating these clods , yes they shake off most of the soil , but there would still be some on the roots !! is it only when it has been fermented that it has this effect then ?
Terrible news about the little goat though !!! whatever the cause . Hope tomorrow is less stressfull for you ....
cheers
Russ
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Hi Roxy, sorry about the loss of your wee Pygmy, I hope all the others are well. Over the 3 years I have kept goats I have luckily only had 2 die on me and both times it was a Pygmy. My first one was just a year old and the vet think it was some form of meningitis and then as you know Pierre died just a few weeks ago from poisoning of the Laurel tree. I did laugh at your description of the escapee's just a shame you have to pay for their damage.
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just being nosey. why woul soil cause deaths in stock. we have had some pretty ropey hay this year. which has had soil in it.
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I wondered that too - my dogs are always digging and eating soil
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My horse eats soil too if he pulls grass up with it on the roots - not mouthfuls of it, but some.
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Haylage or silage made with soil in it can contain botulism. Badly made haylage or silage can also contain listeria, or if bales have had their wrapping punctured.
Sorry to hear about your goat Roxy, very sad.
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Thank you badgerface - botulism was the word I was trying to think of!! Hay with clods in is ok, well, ok in as such as it does not kill them. Being a wet summer, we did get some clods in the hay, but I throw these out. My neighbours horses went down very quick, one that night, the other the following morning. Vet put them on drips, they were in the stable being turned by my neighbour and a farmer, but one died, and the other she had shot, because it was evident it would not survive. That has made me wary, and I am as certain as I can be that my haylage is safe and I do check like I said, as best I can. I get my big bales from a friend, and know the fields, and definitely nothing dodgy plantwise. The only thing I am not happy about is him spraying for docks. But, with the bad summer, he did not mow his fields until late, so the spraying was long done.
Well, goats seem to behaving themselves today. I have spent the morning at work, looking at the clock, and looking at my phone, wishing the morning away, and worrying I would get a call from the irate neighbour again. They all seem ok, so could not have eaten anything poisonous which is good.
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flippin' goats! sometimes nowt but trouble eh?
sorry to hear about your little pygmy Roxy.
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Ragwort is more of a toxin and damages the liver I think over time. Its why you need to be careful with horses and ragwort, because they live so long, they have a bigger chance of being ill if they do eat some over the period of a few years. That said I would always avoid it for the goats as well.
Sorry to hear the news Roxy about your wee one. If their face looks a little fluffy, it could be a sign that she had a bit of a temperature, but other than that who knows.
As to the plants and the garden, as long as they didn't eat anything poisonious thats the important thing- more plants can always be grown.
Beth
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Im very sorry about your loss, i toowould say botulism, as it can occur when the cut is to close to the ground. or if ground is uneven. Best wishes, Helen :wave: