The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Community => Coffee Lounge => Topic started by: Fleecewife on June 05, 2014, 07:24:24 pm
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I mentioned a while ago that I'm currently studying Global Food Security. This week we are looking at food wastage throughout the world, and I must say I'm shocked to the core.
ONE THIRD of all the food produced in the world is wasted, and of course that means that the water, fertilisers, labour, packaging, transport and so on used in the production of that food are also wasted. ONE THIRD :rant:
This means that 28% of the world's land area dedicated to food growing is growing food which is not used.
The amount of water wasted worldwide in the production of food which is subsequently wasted would be enough to supply the drinking water needs of the WHOLE WORLD.
Have a look in your fridge and food cupboard and assess what you waste. Look in your dustbin and see how much food you throw out each week. Lots of us on TAS grow our own food, so wasted veggies, for example, are not actually wasted but composted and go to produce more food, but there is always something we waste. Mine is bread flour which is out of date and I dump it - so I must buy less.
Yes this is a rant :rant: :rant: :rant: against the whole world which sticks its communal head up its communal bum and ignores such an enormous problem, while people starve.
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I couldn't agree more with the sentiment of what you're saying and in our own miniscule way i'd like to think that we are at the lower end of the wastefulness scale In the "civilised" world at least. The thought that half the world gorges itself on far too much and throws away the rest whilst the remainder have not enough to survive cannot be anything other than obscene
HOWEVER I cant help but feel depressed that it is far more complicated than simply not being wasteful. Every loaf of bread or pack of out of date meat or fish has paid for someone's wages and fed their family and if we simply buy less and use more someone else somewhere suffers ??
Am I more offended by over production, or over consumption, or food in landfill that could feed others, or produce energy i'm not sure. Great place to discuss it though
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I agree with all you say. There is a problem with the dates on food, it will last MUCH longer than the supermarkets would have us believe. We just cleared out the cupboards of the house our daughters have been sharing. There was half a bag of whole meal bread flour. I used it this week, made the best loaves for a long time, then read the use by date- October 2011! It smelt ok when I used it, and made really good bread. If food isn't obviously mouldy, rotten or smell bad, I ignore sell by / use by dates. I hate waste.
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I have to hold my hands up (we don't have an emoticon for that) I am very wasteful. I'm not proud of it.
Yogurt and veg are probably my worst culprits. I find it more difficult since I moved to the smallholding because we aren't near any shops. I have a delivery once a week and buy food 'just in case' Just in case of what I'm not sure. We have 3 freezers full of stuff. We are never going to starve.
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yoghurt is another one that is usually safe well past its date, well its not killed me or the kids yet!!!
salad has to be one of the worst, we don't grow our own (yet) so cant pick fresh and so much of it goes off so quickly...
other than that most of our food waste is tea bags :-) which have been used but still seem to fill the little box the council give us very quickly!
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OH and I have done really well at not wasting stuff-just can't afford to so we stopped. Some of that is me using stuff past its date without me saying owt ;)
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Louise, you are absolutely right. I use stuff that is well past its sell be or use by date. Bags of salad will last several days if unopened but then need eating in a couple of days. Yoghurt, unopened, will last a couple of months. Tinned food - food canned in Roman times has been found to be fit to eat so why it even needs a sell by date beats me. Fresh meat will go a short time over but fish not so much.
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I think I am pretty good at avoiding waste, like processing and freezing bits and pieces that can be used in a dish. I'm sometimes catching myself putting some "missed" veg in the compost bucket...at least once it's out there the chickens help themselves ;)
Sounds a very interesting course, Lesley , and such an important issue.
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When I was a boy nearly everyone I knew had a 'pig bucket' which was collected and fed to pigs. Phillip's Cycle factory employed about 800 workers even they had pigs that had any waste from the canteen.
Pig keepers, my uncle included went around collecting any waste and turned it into pork.
We as a country have it to easy, but that's going to change.
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my OH did the same, that was his commitment to the young farmers' club and he lived in inner Birmingham!!! I remember that the doctor who took my tonsils out said they would give them to the hospital pigs (probably he pulled my leg) but every hospital did have pigs when I was little.
Now aren't you all wondering how old we are :roflanim:
And then came Health and Safety and one now is not even allowed to feed one's animals anything that comes out of the kitchen - but can I stop my chickens from finding the compost? :roflanim:
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A lot of food waste is also a result of supermarkets not selling misshapen fruit/veg that are perfectly edible but because they are not of the "perfect" size, shape etc people will not buy them! I see that Waitrose are starting to sell odd shaped tomatoes in a bid to try and reduce the amount of food waste that occurs as a result of this ridiculous idea. I find the misshapen carrots etc quite entertaining :-[ and they don't taste any different from the perfect specimen!
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We waste very little. I plan our meals for the week ahead and only buy what we need. What does bug me is fruit and veg that goes off within two days of buying them. I think people on a tight budget are more food careful as they just cannot afford to be throwing it out. There is far more waste from the supermarkets.
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I do use a lot of food past it's sell by/use by dates. I just take the labels off so that OH doesn't know ;D
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I will use food past its sell by date and have never had any issues or felt ill by doing so. Beats me why things like chocolate need a sell by date as I don't think it used to have one years ago? Also agree about the tinned food seems odd to put a sell/use by date on it really.
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I have heard there are changes coming up - so far " sell by " is only for the supermarkets (helps them manage their stock levels). "Best Before" is safe for months after , even sold by some companies like Approved Foods but "Use by" is for perishables like meat or ready meals with meat. I tend to stick to the meat dates if possible. OH has been ill with Chlostridium once and Salmonella you can get from "overripe" chicken is not much fun either....common sense, really (if it smells weird or bad bad it's off)
If there's anything new on that coming up on your course, let us know, Lesley. ;)
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I have a dog and chickens and a caste iron gut and am creative in the kitchen so don't really understand food waste. The only thing I am guilty of is leaving a stripped chicken carcass in the oven which I've forgotten to make stock from or finding a couple of soggy carrots or potatoes under the veg... But since it's home grown isn't so bad.
I read a book about cooks from around 1930s or so. They'd leave game till it was full of maggots. I have rediscoverd that Even meat that is properly high and gag worthy is perfectly safe once cooked, and really tasty, so no need to steer clear of the discounted joints at the supermarket if you don't want to. -just seen northfifeducklings post, I've only done this with beef and pork so far.
It is true that loads gets "wasted" before it gets into the system by being misshapen and stuff... But lots of this gets spread back on fields, so it's kinda just composting on a larger scale. With some things like carrots, if they're sold dirty they last way longer than those that are washed, but people seem to want the clean washed ones.
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Steph, I agree to a certain extent, "well hung" game is quite a different thing from battery raised and cling-filmed meat these days! No pheasant will give you Salmonella ;)
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We shouldn't be importing food from some of these places as by doing so we are also importing their water supply. The best way to eat is to use seasonal produce grown as locally as possible, the more we can do that the better for everyone.
Putting people out of work is a moot point if the food production itself is depriving them of their own land and food. There are too many places in the world where the people have barely any water because it is all diverted to grow luxury crops such as asparagus or Kenya beans. The only way to prevent this injustice is for the likes of us to stop buying them, read the labels and consider the origin of the product. Be an ethical shopper and have a fridge purge twice a week, you'll have some very inventive meals that way too. :yum:
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I live in an orange and mandarin growing area and about 1/3 of all the fruit is rejected because it is too small or the skin is marked. It is either left to rot on the ground or piled up and burned.
I asked around this year if I could collect the 'bad' fruit for my animals and they all said just go ahead and help yourself.
Most of the fruit I juiced and fed the pigs with the rest, none of it was bad!
Just this week I was given three crates of peaches that had marks on the skins. Approx 30 kilos of waste fruit? I gave a load away and me and the pigs and my donkeys enjoyed the rest. None of it was bad!
If some of the ridiculous regulations were changed or removed altogether, there would be a lot less waste.
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It's a crazy world ::) 3 crates of peaches - yummy!
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A friend of mine used to get citrus peel delivered by the lorry load for their cattle when they lived in Lincolnshire.
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It is true that loads gets "wasted" before it gets into the system by being misshapen and stuff... But lots of this gets spread back on fields, so it's kinda just composting on a larger scale.
I actually think most of the waste happens before it gets to the consumer. Having worked for a local veg producer for the past 5 years (mostly just packing veg boxes once a week), I know how impossible it is to produce just what is needed: you don't know in advance what the weather will be like - how many customers you will have - how much you'll lose due to an attack of various pests - what other influences there may be to change the demand side of it... And the same goes for the large producers. They can cancel orders at will, and then the farmer is stuck with produce they can't sell, even if it is perfect. (I remember the times I worked for a fruit grower, and how often he was desperate because his perfect strawberries were rejected - just because the demand wasn't there that particular day... But the cost for growing/picking had been incurred.)
A lot of loss that incurs in other countries is also due to lack of proper storage facilities (I'm thinking of developing countries here - if they have a good harvest, they don't necessarily have the means to provide secure storage to protect from pests).
"Gleaners" are these days addressing some of the problem (there was something on BBC recently - sorry, won't let me post the link). But that's only really feasible in fairly densely populated areas.
To get back to the problem of shelf life and modern technology: our household must have been the last to get a fridge back in the late 60s; we never lost food - my mother was far too canny for that! Raw milk didn't go "off", either - it went thick and was eaten like yoghurt. And I am sure I've been throwing out less since I got rid of my fridge and freezer a few years ago. You just buy differently and keep a closer eye on what you have if you know you can't rely on technology for it to keep. (And no, I don't go shopping daily - more like fortnightly.)
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I waste very little , can't afford to . Being the one who grows , buys , cooks and dishes up what i eat , i know exactly what i want and how much .
Between me and the dogs nothing goes to waste . Stale bread goes out for the birds , if they can get it before the dogs .
I find bought sausages can go a bit iffy , but the dogs still eat them with no side affects , very rarely happens though .
If i make too much mashed spud , i will just reheat the next day , or fry for bubble and squeek . I only ever cook what spaghetti and rice i will eat in one meal , same with veg .
Living with hardly any money , and growing your own food , makes you think about food waste .
Many , these days , buy huge amounts of food at the supermarket , how do they eat so much ? Why eat so much ?
I am not a foodie , but it seems that many , if not most , are .
It seems like
an obsession , a constant stream of kack going down their gullets , they must spend more on loo roll than i do on food .
Life has been easy for a long time , and we have changed lifestyle , and
live a throw away lifestyle ( being a womble i don't ) .
The times they are a changing though , many are in for a big shock .
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I can't remember when we last "wasted" any food but we have a holiday cottage on the farm and the amount of wasted food in the guest's dustbin is truly staggering. Perhaps if they knew how much hard work goes into producing it .....? We always look in the last wastebin liner they threw out when they were emptying the fridge before leaving. Our dogs dine royally some nights! Mind you, they sometimes also drink more alcohol in a week than our whole family gets through in a year, but that's another story .....
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Our dogs dine royally some nights! Mind you, they sometimes also drink more alcohol in a week than our whole family gets through in a year, but that's another story .....
What - your dogs??? :o Oh dear... ;D
I agree - I don't waste anything, either. But then I know how it's produced, and have been involved in that for most of my life... I still think a year on a farm should be compulsory for everybody! (But then I also think a year on a bicycle should be compulsory for everybody who wants to get a licence to drive a car... ;) )
The only thing that sometimes gets "wasted" (i.e. composted) in my household is veg or fruit that had been graded out - I sometimes can't resist "rescuing" those items after the veg packing, and occasionally it's just more than I can eat... I do often give surplus to neighbours, too.
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Another tiny thing I've noticed, semi skimmed milk goes 'off' faster than whole milk. Whole milk tastes and smells exactly the same several days after it's use by date.
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To answer fleece woman's original post…the world is not a community, well not in a friendly helpful thinking way..
its simply a greedy group of power crazy people who couldn't arrange a p/// up in a brewery, by keeping people hungry allows a hold on countries, ..why is it, the leaders of those countries always look well fed and drive around in nice cars ,wearing expensive clothing and jewellery ,
we are wasteful, simply because we can be..if we couldn't , we wouldn't…
it got me thinking the other day ,when i saw a cartoon strip with a little coloured lad speaking to a little white lad, the title was….you poo into water, what clean water …..
how would things change, if we all started to be ..lets say more careful and more considerate, on the way we buy food,,, it would be lovely to think all that surplus food could be sent to the starving, but that then would cause another problem….they would be dependent of free food, would they really want to start helping themselves…
and something tells me, certain greedy powerful groups, would start to pinch the food and sell it on the black market, actually we all know that happens now…
is it a shame the world wastes so much, yes coarse it is…but i can't see how we can make any difference, without getting rid of the greedy and powerful idiots that run this world
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yes, many years ago I saw a childrens' movie on TV with Bette Midler that raised the issue of speculators in food and how they keep people poor and hungry...I was shocked then and still am... this should absolutely be banned. Food is not a commodity for bankers to play with. I am so glad I am growing some of mine myself - really appreciating every leaf of lettuce I don't have to buy!
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we honestly barely waste food, with 4 kids, 4 dogs, goats etc nothing gets wasted and on unedible veg/eggs shells get composted. we rarely have food in the cupboard long enough to even go close to its sell by. we do sometimes use "approved food", which helps stop food wastage too.
i really dont understand how it happens, im sure they must have too much money.
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It's easy to see why it happens, you only have to walk round a supermarket. There are so many seductive offers selectively placed at eye level so that people buy more than they need. We all know the saying about not going shopping when you're hungry but despite heeding that I still find myself having to remember that cut priced salt and sugar are just cut priced toxins (not a rant, it's just how I discipline myself).
What is it about bogof selling that is so seductive? Are they preying on our lust for a bargain? If we really wanted/needed these items they would be the grocery list before we left home, and yet we buy them because they are 'on offer'. It's fine with household products and non-perishables that I would buy routinely as it saves money but so much of it is perishable food.
Whole companies are employed by supermarkets to manufacture situations we consumers can't resist, it's big business. They don't produce anything, don't make any contribution, just focus on advertising and product placement. They study our buying patterns in order to subtly manoeuvre us into making their preferred decisions and get paid handsomely for doing so.
It's a good discipline to make a list and stick to it if you can but you'll need to go round the shops wearing blinkers :roflanim:
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I hear this argument, but don't agree JulieWall. It's a mentality about making the most of what you have when you have it. Any one who grows their fruit and veg knows about dealing with gluts when they come along. I might eat several plums a day when the tree ripens, then make a few puddings, jam and some in the freezer for winter.
Finding that there's an offer on at the supermarket just makes me behave in the same way. I have a fridge, freezer and can be creative enough to use four trays of 1/2 price chicken thighs, a massive bag of tomatoes, or whatever, without it getting boring.
That and the fact that most things in the supermarket aren't fresh, so as discussed previously, I'm all for ignoreing the dates and stocking up... 8 jars of mayonnaise, or a whole shelf of tinned tomatoes, at half the price I'd normally pay = good stuff!
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I was just speaking for myself and saying how hard it can be, not criticising anybody's mentality ??? I didn't think it read that way personally :(
My point was about the massive pressure on consumers that these companies indulge in and to simply say we all need to be mindful of not being manipulated. What you are doing is sensible (I do it too ;) ) and selectively taking advantage of these offers for things you would buy anyway is just playing them at their own game. Loss leaders are to lure you into the shopping environment, but if your basket is filled with mainly loss leader products, the supermarket's tactics have failed.
By 'perishable' I was referring to products with use by dates on such as cooked meats, pies, yoghurt, dairy products, etc. Fruit and veg to me are fresh produce (name is misleading I agree).
Don't fall into the trap of presuming that everyone else has the luxury of freezer space - or even a freezer, some people don't have the money, the space or may even feel that it conflicts with their green ethics. There isn't a one-size-fits-all answer but we do need to be more aware.
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<<There isn't a one-size-fits-all answer but we do need to be more aware>>
That is true. When I was at school (a VERY long time ago) we were given one of the most valuable lessons I have had. This was about the power of advertising and how people were manipulated. Not only are there whole companies whose staff are dedicated to convincing the masses to do something they wouldn't otherwise do, but others spend their entire working lives, presumably with grant aid, to carry out high level research into sales propaganda.
Since that lesson, so most of my life, I have kept a very cynical attitude towards advertising and product placement.
There is also a more subtle influence on people's buying habits which comes from social pressure, what you are 'expected' to do. Many of us on TAS are immune to those influences, as is proven by our choice of smallholding as a way of life. Many of us live on very tight budgets too, but we also tend to be of the mindset that says 'grow your own'.
Most city dwellers tend to conform and anyway don't always have somewhere to grow food. Even those with gardens are 'expected', or so they feel, to grow flowers in their gardens, although that attitude seems to be changing.
I think one bit of evidence of the power of advertising is that some people who are living on the edge and have very little money don't spend it wisely. They buy white sliced bread, crisps, ready cut chips and chicken. (OK they buy more than that - cigarettes ;D)) So perhaps this is partly to do with basic education. Lots of you have mentioned that you are careful housewives when it comes to cooking, but many folk these days genuinely don't know how to prepare a meal from scratch, or to make the most of gluts to prepare for leaner times. Even the meteoric rise in the number of chef-y type programmes doesn't always show people how to prepare good nutritious food at home - some do though and this must be a good thing. I don't watch the soaps so I don't really know their contents but if I visit people who have the TV on with one of these showing, there just seems to be a lot of shouting, aggro, stabbings, teenage tantrums and illicit sex. If these icons of public adoration were seen preparing a good nutritious meal from produce they'd grown in the allotment, or assiduously sorting their rubbish into their coloured bins for recycling, that would send a different message and help to educate people.
I think the problem of food wastage has very different causes in different parts of the globe. We too had a food safe to store anything perishable, in the coolest part of the old stone-built dairy, and my mum would stand the bottles of milk in cold water with a cloth over the top, so the evaporation from the constantly wet cloth kept the milk cool, but it didn't last as long as today. However, in very hot countries, if you don't have a fridge then you have to be very canny about preserving food. I have seen food stored in the moist ground, shaded from the sun, but you have to have the ground, and you have to have the knowledge of how to do it.
There seems also to be a trend away from cooking at home to eating out, either in restaurants or takeaways. I think there is maybe an even greater wastage from restaurants than from private homes. It always seems strange to me that those at the upper end of the income bracket have enormous, expensive stainless steel kitchens, but nothing in the fridge, because they don't ever eat at home. This seems to be an American trend which is spreading here, if TV and literature is anything to go by (which it probably isn't)
I'll have a look back through the reading stuff for my Global Food Security course for a pie chart which shows the proportion of food wasted at each stage and I seem to recall (there's a lot of info for my poor brain to retain) that by far the biggest wastage comes from 'domestic' sources, which I think includes supermarkets. No time at the moment but I'll look later.
Thank you all so much for taking part in this discussion - I'm really enjoying everything you all have to say :bouquet:
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A big part of the problem is that we all expect - or rather, the supermarkets tell us that we should all expect - to have every type of food available at all times... And because you can't plan 100% for either demand or yield, farmers need to over produce all the time, resulting in fields of perfectly good produce being ploughed in again. Would it really be that terrible if you couldn't get broccoli today, because the shop's run out - or no carrots tomorrow?
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salad has to be one of the worst, we don't grow our own (yet) so cant pick fresh and so much of it goes off so quickly...
biggest area of waste in our house too.
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and it's the easiest thing to grow, even in a container , just get a box of living salads and pick apart and plant ;)
The topic of restaurants is a very important one ! Just watching some of the shows that partially are filmed in restaurants - how much unserved food is put in the bin because it doesn't look right or is 10 seconds overcooked makes me cry each time! That doesn't count in what customers haven't finished...bring back the pig buckets and urban pigs!
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Ok , so i don't go to the s'market 3 times a week , not even 3 times a year actually , but when i do go with someone , the tricks don't work on me . I buy what i want and nowt else .
If i want cheese and the one i usually have is £3 but another is on offer at £1 , yes ok , i'll buy the £1 one . But i only buy what i want cheese , i am imnune to their corruption .
Read up about Edward Bernays , the propaganda man . It will open your eyes to many things .
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A local supermarket gives their goods that have reached their sell by date to the Salvation Army for their homeless project. On one occasion, there was at least one case of bananas which had reached its sell-by date so out it had to go. These bananas were still green so nowhere near being unfit to eat. They were also given far more bread than they could use. Fortunately, the new manager seems better at ordering and their is less waste but that appalled me.
I'm like most folk on here in that I hate waste. If we don't eat it, the dogs or goats do or it goes in the wormery or on the compost heap. My worms must be sick to death of tea bags and egg shells because that's usually all they get.