The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Sheep => Topic started by: FiB on April 20, 2014, 07:44:13 am
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I have 2 limping lambs ( all outdoor born so don't do navel spraying etc) no evidence of thorns or damage to foot...... Do they sometimes sprain a joint ( they seem so invincible leaping about!). I did start to convince myself one looked a bit wobbly on all joints and looked up joint ill on sheep 201.... But stopped quickly! Totally well other than that. :thinking: ???
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They can hurt themselves looning about, I have one that has done just that, but in young lambs, joint ill would be my first thought to try to rule out, is there swelling to their knees? Do they look slightly buckled forwards on them? If it is joint ill, they will need a jab of antibiotics ASAP.
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Ta.... Is joint ill a possibility in outdoor systems then, reading my Tim Tyne it seemed to implicate hygiene and practices in the lambing shed..... Will feel joints in a min. Always have alamiycin in... Are all ABs equal? Thanks as always...
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it does sound like joint ill, had an outbreak of it my self. I'm using betamox la and touch wood its worked a treat. Alamycin might also work but betamox is a little stronger :thumbsup:
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It is possible outside, bugs can still get in through navel, although less of them about outdoors. Betamox is recommended, particularly as prevention I think, and is supposed to be the best. We use Alamycin, though, because it is what we have. We have had one with joint ill (we lamb indoors but I am worryingly obsessed with bedding and disinfecting pens after we had about 10 with joint ill a couple of years ago) this year, and treated it with Alamycin, and it is all better now.
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We have had 2 with joint ill this year and we lamb outdoors. One was really bad and unable to stand on any leg 12 hours after being lame on one hind, the other just had one swollen front knee. Think they were born on some mole hills to a mother with lumpy milk that we had to strip out. Betamox has cleared it up very well. We have always been told to treat any lameness in young lambs as potential joint ill as the earlier you get it the better the chances.
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We have had some limping but it is scold.
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:wave: i would guess joint ill we had 2 last year never had before and had none so far this year :fc: all outdoor and all navels diped. alamycin will sort it .the quicker the better though. could be scald but should be able to see it . you should still spray or dip navels when outdoor lambing there is loads of stuff in the ground that can go in through the navel
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Yes we get the odd case of joint ill outdoors, although I can never be certain it isn't in lambs that were indoors briefly - although we do spray them if they come in.
Alamycin seems to work best for us; vet says use what works for you!
However, before getting out the a/bs, I'd be doing two things. 1. Check for scald - red/inflamed/weeping skin between the toes. Blue spray will sort that. 2. Assuming no obvious lumps or heat in any joints, observe for 48 hours. Most often it's an ouchie from landing badly, stepping on a thorn, or whatever, and goes away. (But if you know you do have joint ill in the flock then yes I'd be jabbing anything limping asap too, as best treated early.)
In older lambs, conditions resembling joint ill can be due to infections borne by ticks, say our vet. We had a bad year for that a few years back - terribly lame lambs that, even though they rarely stood up didn't lose any condition. :/ Alamycin was the best for that; we said if it happened again we'd use an anti-tick med - but so far :fc:
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on the same thread, we have a number of lambs who seem to be getting a bit of scold. strange as its been dry and we don't normally get problems with them so young. we caught a couple last week and gave a squirt of blue spray which sizzled and seemed to do the trick. now several others. we've also got a few who are getting mucky bums. inclined to give them a jab of abs. never ab'd young lambs before.. got some pen and strep which we normally give mums 3mls based on 60kg sheep. for lambs do we simply factor it down. say about 1/2ml each ?
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touch wood we very rarely get any joint ill, the last one we had the vet give us synolox for him. hes now three, and a pet :)
but maybe its scald, we ve caught two limpy ones and ab sprayed them. in fact when we do our vaccing, we will be spraying every single tootsie with ab spray, as advised by a local shepherdess x
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With the pen/strep, I'd say 1ml each (which is what I normally rec'd). Alamycin has a better capability of getting into the joint space to help with infection, but because it is a tetracycline, it can cause problems with young, growing lambs (affects the growth plate of the bones). Usually say betamox or pen/strep are good to use, or you can do pen/strep 1/2ml and 1/2ml alamycin, as long as you don't use alamycin long term
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Brilliant breadth and depth of experience shared as ever thanks so much. Pretty sure it's not scald as the feet looked and smelt fine and no tenderness shown by lamb. Seems a bit better today and the fact I couldn't catch him may be an indicator? Have alamiycin if can't get any of the other from vet, but more good info re not being ideal for lambs thanks, f xxx
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Alamycin is recommended by some vets for use in neonatal lambs as a preventative against joint ill and pasteurellosis. ???
And this from Norbrook's information about Alamycin LA
Alamycin LA is indicated for use in cattle, sheep and pigs in the treatment of: atrophic rhinitis caused by Bordetella bronchiseptica, Mannheimia haemolytica and Pasteurella multocida; navel/joint ill caused by Arcanobacterium pyogenes ...
They'd hardly recommend it for joint ill if it was dangerous to young lambs? ???
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I've just noticed one of my lambs very lame in front this morning - doesn't even want to put her foot on the floor. No obvious signs of anything in limb or hoof. I've just moved them all up yesterday to our top field, which has a few banks to jump off and a chopped down telegraph pole that they have been jumping off too. I'm assuming it's a sprain at the moment. Shall I give alamycin after 48 or 24 hrs, just in case it's joint ill?
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I still havnt treated mine, limp has got better and didn't seem to be all joints to me and no warmth in joints. My current thought is thistles... The fild they are in has a lot of creeping thistles? I guess if you feel it might be joint Ill smee2012 ..... all the above says ab sooner rather than later - good luck.
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Sounds as if just a little knock after hoolying round, glad lambie feeling better x
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I would certainly be looking more down the strain/sprain/pulled muscle route than anything more sinister in the first instance and therefore giving antibiotics unnecessarily. Having watched my lambs tear at full pelt around the field trying to race each other whilst leaping, twisting and bouncing, it's no wonder they don't all break their legs, let alone just sprain something.