The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Sheep => Topic started by: smudger on August 22, 2013, 10:13:57 am
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I have Lleyns and looking for a terminal sire which will also give me good type replacement ewes ie hardy, low keep, easy lambing but still with excellent mothering abilities / milkiness. Apart from a good carcase, the ram must give lively lambs / easily lambed. Good fleece would be a bonus.
I had thought charallois but hardiness is a concern (we are at 1000ft). I like the look of Hampshires, but looks aren't everything I keep telling myself. I considered Romney but not sure if really a terminal breed. I discounted texel but understand there is a NZ strain that are easier lambing but probably can't afford one anyway (£ thousands?). Suffolks? Poll Dorsets? Exmoor Horns since they are local?
Is there a lleyn X ewe which is saleable above fat lamb prices? (We won't need all our ewe lambs retained every year). Thx for any suggestions.
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Hampshire Down :thumbsup: :trophy: gets my vote.
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Go see Peter Baber, he's not too far from you www.baber.co.uk (http://www.baber.co.uk)
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Southdown?
The easier-lambing Texel, in our experience, is the Dutch Texel. We paid £450 for a very good DT tup a couple of years ago; there should be more available now.
I'd have thought you would sell Lleyn x Texel or Dutch Texel as breeders no problem. Everyone knows the Lleyn is a good mum, very milky, easy lambing, pretty too!, but a bit too prolific - which shortcoming the Texel could tone down :thumbsup:
Texel fleece is nice, DT even more so :spin:. Charollais is better, mind ;) :spin:
Exmoor Horn is a hill sheep so I wouldn't have called it a terminal sire, and the fleece is on the coarse side, certainly compared to Down breeds, Texel or Suffolk. You could use it to add hardiness and weatherproof fleece then add Charollais in the next generation... ;)
Romney would be a very interesting cross. Should be nice fleece too. :spin: I don't know how you would fare selling fat lambs though. Lleyn x Romney ewes... I'd think about buying some! (If you were in Scotland!)
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I've got a couple Lleyn cross Texel and I must say I've had no feet problems, As hard as nails and they have the most beautiful Fleece! The heads are no chunky at all and not massively board across the shoulder.
I understand peoples concerns with them but if you can, pick a ram with smaller features as I was always told the ram size and shape massively affects the lambs. So if you find a narrower headed Texel ram his lambs should have a narrow head, Plus the Lleyn has a nice head!
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. I discounted texel but understand there is a NZ strain that are easier lambing but probably can't afford one anyway (£ thousands?). Suffolks? Poll Dorsets? Exmoor Horns since they are local?
Is there a lleyn X ewe which is saleable above fat lamb prices? (We won't need all our ewe lambs retained every year). Thx for any suggestions.
Google EASYRAM and you will see nz texels / suffolks and crosses of the two about £650 or try INNOVIS BREEDING for maternal texels with nz blood in them , same sort of price
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the lleyn x easycare is a super ewe would do everything you listed exept the wool . i worked a flock of 900 of them the ewes the ewes scanned at 198% the gimmers 175% on grass only no winter feed at all. they got some haylage if there was snow on the ground . but did have plenty to range over .lambing problems were below 1% . to be fair is more maternal but you still get good grass finished lambs
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I understand peoples concerns with them but if you can, pick a ram with smaller features as I was always told the ram size and shape massively affects the lambs. So if you find a narrower headed Texel ram his lambs should have a narrow head, Plus the Lleyn has a nice head!
It's not the head with Texels, it's the shoulders and buttocks. Because of the width of the shoulders, you often can't lamb a malpresented lamb with only one foot forward, you have to get the second front leg as well. And you can get big-buttocked lambs stuck at the hips, which can therefore suffocate or suffer other problems as mum runs around with them hanging half out. :o
HVF is quite right, you can select a ram with the features you want, and with luck they will be inheritable. Our DT tup was reasonably priced precisely because we chose the one with narrow shoulders and not his half-brother with the broad square back. ;)
If you did decide on a horned breed, such as Exmoor Horn, then you would need to consider head size and also litter size. Exmoor Horn breeders breeding pure strive for all twins, because a single ram lamb, with his horn buds, can be too much for a young ewe to pass.
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Definitely a Zwartble :thumbsup:
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Go see Peter Baber, he's not too far from you www.baber.co.uk (http://www.baber.co.uk)
I had my SufTexs from him and I am extremely happy - he runs his flock along the same lines as easyrams, except I don't think there is much NZ blood in his.
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Thx chaps and chappesses.
Internet browsing sorted for the weekend. I had also forgotten to mention 'lambs finishing off grass' but see easycare can do that. I'll reconsider the texel even though they look like bulldogs :( . The lleyns were a joy to lamb, wouldn't want to lose that, however take on board not all texels are equal.
Surprised no one shouted for the poll dorsets, just wondered if poll dorset x can still lamb earlier / out of season? (I have half a mind that the boring monotony pf the 2 week Xmas break could be enlivened by some early lambing. Pre-family and farm we used to escape the country.). Not sure on fleece however.
(Zwarbles...... :-\ [size=78%]) [/size][/size]No actually....[size=78%] :roflanim: . Nice try (nothing wrong with the sheep mind).
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We keep 25 breeding Lleyns along with Suffolk cross ewes for meat. We have put a Hampshire across the Lleyn also across the Suffolks Lambing has always been a problem with the Lleyns due to the large forehead from the hamp. We have just purchased a Charolais Tup lamb who we will give 8 Ewes to this year 4 Lleyn and 4 Suffolk crosses hopefully he will still produce a good grass finished lamb. Another problem with the Lleyn x Hamp was that they weighed around 50kg + by the time they had a good covering of meat and our local market prefer 42-45 kg (top price)
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Google EASYRAM
I did but got all these computer / IT websites! :roflanim:
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Thx pasture farm. Great to have a direct comparison. My lleyns were fab lambers- I only saw 2 lamb (gimmers with malpresentations). All the others just got on with it, never showed any inclination of lambing, then we'd come down to sucking lambs 1-2 hours later. Just looking for a better / quicker lamb carcase.
By the way google worked it out when i typed easyram sheep.
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Go see Peter Baber, he's not too far from you www.baber.co.uk (http://www.baber.co.uk)
Thx Tim. very good link and he farms on similar quality of land. Interesting he emphasises the 'maternal' indices of his suffolks:
This year also sees the introduction of a Maternal Index for the Suffolks for the first time. This will be an aid to people selecting Suffolks for crossing to keep the ewe lambs. Half of our rams on offer are in the top 10% for the breed for the Maternal Index
If ewe lamb retention is a priority, does anyone have experience of suffolk v texel ewes? (or general differences, other than looks, of texel and suffolks?) Easycare also have sufftex's - what are the attributes of both breeds that this cross carries (or aims to carry?). Is it just the texel is 'meatier' but more difficult lamber?.
[/size]If ewe reten[/color]
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No reason you couldn't retain a SufTex x lamb and get the best of both worlds....
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Why look for anything else other than a LLeyn ram. Mine finish about now from an April lambing at around 40 -42 KG on grass at 1000ft.
I scanned 194% on mine and had 38 from 20 using Lleyn to Lleyn.
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I have a few poll dorsets and one Lleyn, I put a poll Dorset ram to them all! Growth wise the Lleyns are not too far behind the Dorset lambs. I got a ewe lamb from the Lleyn and will be interested to see if it will inherit the out of season lambing!