The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Community => Coffee Lounge => Topic started by: Farmer on June 05, 2009, 07:27:29 am
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Hi all,
We were informed last night that Severn Trent Water Authority have applied for planning permission to install THREE WIND TURBINES along the river valley where we live - each measuring higher than the Eiffel Tower, one of which would be situated directly opposite our farm spoiling the wonderful view we enjoy at present - we're devastated!
I realise I probably sound like a NIMBY but just the thought of the beauty of this wonderful vista being lost to these monstrosities fills me with distress - Oh you can bet there will be protests, they've already started, but in my experience 'the big boys' always get their way and our local borough council has a reputation of ignoring the wishes and protests of its residents no matter what effect their decisions have on the countryside - the amount of empty new build industrial estates are evidence of that!
Does anyone have any experience of these eyesores being erected near them - do you have any information that might be useful in mounting a protest? Has anyone ever managed to stop them from being erected?
Any help/advice would be appreciated, thanks
Farmer (Sad, disillusioned and very pi##ed off)
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Does anyone know if they are cost and energy effective? I was told they only last 6 years before needing to be replaced and that takes more energy, I feel for you, I can see why you are so down about it.
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We have large windfarms here in argyll, but I like them!!
There is a humming noise from the propellers but you soon don't hear it!
I'd rather have them than some other form of energy producer.
Sorry, I can't help!
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I don't think people have ever stopped them , they only way to normally stop these things are to have to the land as a SSSI or ANB or even have a rear creature of some sort and proof that the building of these things would disturb them to distribution.
I am for wind turbines but have never had to live closes to any before so my oppions of them might chance.
(if it get the go ahead am sure you'll forget that the wind turbine is there, and see past it.)
Linz
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We have a windfarm quite near to us. There are twelve windmills and I haven't heard any complaints from anyone. The people who live closest don't mind them. My husband uses them to judge which way the wind is blowing and can usually tell what the weather will be like. I haven't heard any noise from them but some people have a higher hearing tolerance the others. anyway I hope they won't spoil your life too much.
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sorry it's in your backyard, but they have to go somewhere, we'll be seeing more of them - and i'd rather one of them than a conventional power station.
Though i agree that there is some debate on how efficient they are - fact is we are gonna run out of coal/oil at some point, so we need to start looking at alternatives
though why we aren't seeing more offshore wind farms around the coast is still a mysetery to me.
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Im all for them too - hopefully getting a mini version at home in the future. There is a huge offshore wind farm near Skegness. Its the prettiest thing to ever happen to that part of the east coast!
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I do sympathise with you, none of us like change on our doorstep!, BUT do go and see them up close if you havent already, having only seen them from a distance we drove past some last year and stopped right by them, they are enormous! I think there were approx 20? To be perfectly honest I thought they quite elegant and mesmerising, they were silent and I couldn't 'feel' any vibration. They had a kind of visual appeal unlike pylons and wires!!! which dominate much of our countryside!
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They are sprouting quicker than mushrooms here in Brittany. They do have their own elegance.
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Try Google for "Moorland without turbines" or Wind farm, Isle of lewis. They managed to get a plan for 172 of them stopped here!
Dave
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We have 2 windfarms near us, one of which is within view, but I'm afraid I quite like them (possibly because I was a kid when the first one started) Some of the ones in our area must be over 15 years old and I don't think they've been replaced, I believe (but not an expert) that they are somewhat less efficient than coal, gas or nuclear power, also if there's not enough wind (or too much) then they switch them off.
I know there's a huge debate over where they're sited and whether people like them - but IMO they're here to stay the reserves of coal and gas and oil aren't going to last forever and lets face it would you rather have some wind turbines or a big coal fired power station in their place ?
On a slightly different note hydro power is much more effective and there are belived to be about 600 streams in Scotland which could provide power from them. Why are we not seeing hydro stations popping up all over the place too ?
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I do sympathise with you, none of us like change on our doorstep!, BUT do go and see them up close if you havent already, having only seen them from a distance we drove past some last year and stopped right by them, they are enormous! I think there were approx 20? To be perfectly honest I thought they quite elegant and mesmerising, they were silent and I couldn't 'feel' any vibration. They had a kind of visual appeal unlike pylons and wires!!! which dominate much of our countryside!
Have to agree I think they're rather elegant, and quite peaceful to watch. But I know not many people like them. My other half's father hates them with a passion. I used to live in Kinross, and they wanted to put in 3 turbines there, which did get refused in the end- they can be stopped I believe.
http://secretscotland.wordpress.com/2009/03/13/wind-farm-wars/
http://www.wind-watch.org/news/2009/03/13/where-the-wind-farm-war-is-waged/
Beth
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I am still unsure, I think they look like Ballet dancers on hills, very gently whirling their arms, but not sure if I would like them where once I had a good view,,,,,I looked at properties where there were going to be windfarms and it did not put me off, I would have been put off if they were to build a Nuclear power station or a motorway however......
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People in Fife and Tayside have successfully stopped more than 2 applications. I think if there are good grounds for your objections you will have chance. I personally think that most of the commercial proposals are very poorly planned, far too invasive to people's lives and property. A positive example is our village, glad to share this with you
http://www.fifetoday.co.uk/fife-herald-news/Newburgh-community-windfarm-project-moves.5292906.jp
The actual generators will be much smaller though, I think. :&>
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On a slightly different note hydro power is much more effective and there are belived to be about 600 streams in Scotland which could provide power from them. Why are we not seeing hydro stations popping up all over the place too ?
Could I just clarify first that *certain forms* of hydroelectric are quite efficient, many are not. As for why we don't clog all our streams with mini stations... the environmental damage would be absolutely horrendous. A site being suitable for generating power is not the same as a site being suitable to place a plant!
I'd also like to point out the largely irrelevant repetitive claim that wind turbines (and solar panels, and heat exchangers, and ground pumps, and ... you get the idea) cost more in energy to produce than they generate in a lifetime. For some of these technologies, that is absolutely correct. For now. And it will continue to be the case until enough have been built, money has been ploughed back into the sector and newer more efficient technologies are developed to improve the situation.
Far too many people seem to be happy to look at the situation *now* and blatantly ignore the fairly rapid state of progress modern technology allows for when significant development is funded.
Farmer: you're right, your post is a very clear "not in my back yard" and while I recognise the need to place various forms of energy plant in locations which will almost never be acceptable to everyone, it is necessary. I'm also very aware that if they were being planted near my own home, I'd be just as upset and angry as you.
I would suggest the natural energy industry is still in its fairly early stages, but it is also beginning to gain strong commercial interest. Let's also remember that while wind farms are largely incredibly ugly (and I'm speaking from the point of a landscape photographer here) that they can also be removed in the future. If they're the best, currently working, short term solution to avoid or reduce the need for new carbon or nuclear fuel power plants, then it's time for us all to stop bitching and get on with it .. then provide support to energy suppliers and political parties who will actively support funding of research into greener and less intrusive technologies so we can get rid of them again.
Far from an ideal solution, but it's not going to happen without a lot of public support.
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(if it get the go ahead am sure you'll forget that the wind turbine is there, and see past it.)
Linz
I'm sorry but this is just the attitude that allows these big companies to run roughshod over the general public. Their motto seems to be - "If we just keep on with our project they will get used to it and sleep through the noise!"
The same thing applies to these damned trains going through the night past my bedroom window. I will NOT get used to it and you , Farmer, have every right to make your opinion known on your right to a view. I personally would prefer a windfarm to a nuclear power station given a choice, but you have my sympathies
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Oi am not saying lay down and allow it !
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Farmer, do try to get in touch with protest groups which were successful, (maybe there are some in your area?) and get organized with other likeminded folk. :&>
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Sorry to hear about the turbines. In my experience though it will not be quite as bad as you are thinking now.
Forget trying to stop them, it ain't going to happen, unless its a large farm, then you might just might stop it. Wind turbines are modern sacred cows.
I have two near me, well not that near, one is 1km the other 2 km away. Still very visible though.
I have mixed views about them. I am for this kind of energy, but I really think that some people look at them with rose tinted glasses ( might help ! ) If you repeat the mantra " turbines are the solution " twenty times a day and before going to bed, you might just believe it. They are part of the solution.
The only potential ( slight )problems that I have seen with my own eyes are.
1. Huge shadows that flicker across the fields close by as the blades turn. This can drive you to distraction but you are hopefully not that close as the law no longer allows that. Initially cows get disturbed but soon adapt.
2. Ice debris in winter. Turbines do not turn all the time, and ice build up on the blades can cause debris far and wide, huge chunks sometimes. Of all the truths , urban legends about turbines this one is a FACT.
3. A complete eysore in my opinion, required I am afraid to say. They tend to look in my opinion better from a distance. A nice feature as you are driving by or enjoying a walk. However close up they are ugly and feature less.
A couple of other points. The blades and hub are designed to give approx 25 years service before replacement or major repair. Most are top quality German build.
One amusing item. Locally several people including me, have asked for planning permission to put up a small turbine on our land. We are talking about land, not little gardens here. Remote areas with no neighbours close by. We were all rejected on the basis that they did not blend in with the scenery. Two 60 metre turbines are ok though.....
Kevin
Wallonia
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It's these "double standards" that make the situation a whole lot worse!!!
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One amusing item. Locally several people including me, have asked for planning permission to put up a small turbine on our land. We are talking about land, not little gardens here. Remote areas with no neighbours close by. We were all rejected on the basis that they did not blend in with the scenery. Two 60 metre turbines are ok though.....
Obviously I don't know about your specific case, but generally larger projects require planning permission from central government while domestic "green" energy sources require planning permission from local planning offices. Two entirely separate bodies with typically entirely different goals ... I hardly call that double standards, just different opinions.
As for the specific reason your smaller turbines were rejected, central government guidance in the form of Planning Policy Statement 22 allows very few reasons a local planning officer can reject an application for a micro generation scheme ... the subjective option of "serious visual impact" is one of those few reasons allowed.
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I hardly call that double standards, just different opinions.
Of course it's double standards it's Government bodies we are talking about here, they are full of double standards and corruption!!!!
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They are different government bodies which may be controlled by different parties and have distinctly different ideas on what should be happening. It would only be double standards if the same body made the decisions for the large turbines and the domestic turbines in this case (which they may have done, as I said, I don't know the specific case, only the generics).
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Well, you may call it the other typical thing - that one hand doesn't know or care what the other is doing. Even worse...
I do not agree that it is not worth fighting - as I said 2 abominable schemes have been abolished in our area because of it. :&>
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If you loose and fought as hard as you could at least you know you tried.
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I should have made it clear that I am in Belguim not the UK !
Kevin
Wallonia
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That won't alter the sentiment in the previous responses, but it will certainly nullify the content! :D