The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Community => Coffee Lounge => Topic started by: Berkshire Boy on October 22, 2012, 09:14:17 am
-
Did anyone see the programme on BBC2 last night about how the Scottish government has sold out to Donald[I'm not bald]Trump. If I was Scottish I would be very concerned at the ease with which Trump has walked over the SNP.
He is building a golf course that has destroyed an area of outstanding natural beauty. sand dunes that are apparently unique. The Police were an absolute disgrace and looked like they were on the Trump payrole.
Would be interesting to hear what the Scots on here think of it.
-
What I think of that isn't printable.
If you ever get the chance, watch "You've been trumped".
http://www.youvebeentrumped.com/youvebeentrumped.com/THE_MOVIE.html (http://www.youvebeentrumped.com/youvebeentrumped.com/THE_MOVIE.html)
-
I saw it and it was heatbreaking for those that have a compulsory purchase order, let alone the areas of scientific interest.
It just goes to show that money talks
Sally
-
The Trumps are scumbags. End of.
-
I was pretty angry by the end. Of course the film could be one-sided but the refusal of both the Scottish Parliament and Grampian Police to comment was pretty damning.
Trump is behaving like Boss Hogg of Dukes of Hazzard - which was supposed to be a comedy series of the 80s not Scotland today. One is depressingly used to stupid and venal politicians getting off on the lie of enormous wealth being brought into the region. The main construction contract being awarded to a contractor from Cork is a case in point: much of their labour will have been their own people, and their earnings will have gone back to Ireland.
The behaviour of the police was brutal and totally one sided. Rosco P Coltrane would be proud of them.
Now that the environmental damage has been done I hope the dune stabilisation work actually gets done, and properly. Dunes are an immensely fragile environment and notoriously resistant to management. It would be terribly easy for there to be some cost-cutting.
I wonder where the money has come from. When I met Donald Jr and Ivanka eight or nine years ago it was clear that their strategy was to project-manage and brand projects as "Trump" but not to put money in. Ivanka, by the way was the smart and articulate one while Donald Jr was distinctly not. It's likely that Trump found external investors, and they are likely to be looking at some serious losses now. Given his previous financial collapse I doubt if even Trump would have carried on investing his own money into the current economic climate. I mean who are all the tourists with open wallets that are going to visit this golf resort when Scotland isn't actually short of really good alternatives?
Trump is now using the proposed wind farm as a reason not to build the clubhouse and hotel - and spitefully refused to invite Alex Salmond, whose ministers called in the local planning refusal, to the opening of the course. More likely the finance numbers don't make sense any longer.
-
Im not convinced he ever intended to build the hotel and the windfarm is a great excuse to get out of it, even if he had built it the vast majority of workers would have been cheap overseas workers.
I think the man is an obnoxious bully and thinks he can buy Scotland. So far he has been right, sadly.
I worry than the need to make the figures add up would mean that an 'independent' Scotland would actually be less independent than it is at present!
What angered me the most was the treatment of councillors who happened to oppose the plans. Very unpleasant witch-hunts.
-
I watched in disbelief, what a arrogant idiot he is , and so is his son. I was amazed at what antics he was aloud to get away with.
I really felt for the locals and the pain he was putting the comunity through.
-
I was speaking to someone the other night who had been to the clubhouse, I think - they said it was very nice indeed.
I don't think we should let the Trumps have any further influence over Scotland or the Scots. We are where we are.
-
Reading this made me so angry and upset,this is our world of today,nobody else could get planning permission but he can,I think it is obvious why?.It would not surprise me if he was a Mason,illuminati pig!And he obviously is,money,power,tread all over everyone to get what he wants. :rant: :rant:
It is about time we as a people stood up for ourselves against these life leeches,NWO and all the rest of it.Something is going to happen and it shall not be very nice.do you not all see it as worrying that because of his money,he can go to Scotland and kick dirt in the Scot's faces.
I suppose all of the smallholders and the like must in his eyes be classed as living like pigs.Outrageous! Oh what a dreadful pity it would be if his plane just fell out of the sky. :innocent:
:sofa:
-
Playground for his cronies from the wonderful US of A, that's all it is.
I don't think he ever intended to build the "affordable housing" that was one of the conditions he got the planning permission for, either. Also - anybody who knows anything about tourism in Scotland knows that there are very few Scottish people working in it - so what was that about jobs for local people, another one of those conditions? When I first moved to Scotland (1997) I worked in a hotel. At least half my colleagues there were foreigners. Then the company (small chain of hotels for coach tours, family owned) got public funding to build another, brand new hotel in an area with very few jobs. Guess what? They had to go to Ireland to recruit staff, as they simply couldn't find enough Scots willing to work in the "hospitality industry" - always hard work and paid peanuts. So if that Trump hotel ever comes to pass, there'll be a new influx of eastern European workers, who these days seem to have a monopoly in Scottish hotels. Somebody has to do the dirty jobs... And unless the pay is way above average (for hotels), no locals will be doing it, especially not in the Aberdeen area, where unemployment figures are fairly low compared to the rest of the country. And Trump won't pay more, since nobody makes that kind of money by paying the skivvies well.
I'd better stop now - otherwise I'll spend the night on here listing his crimes!!! :rant:
-
Playground for his cronies from the wonderful US of A, that's all it is.
I don't think he ever intended to build the "affordable housing" that was one of the conditions he got the planning permission for, either. Also - anybody who knows anything about tourism in Scotland knows that there are very few Scottish people working in it - so what was that about jobs for local people, another one of those conditions? When I first moved to Scotland (1997) I worked in a hotel. At least half my colleagues there were foreigners. Then the company (small chain of hotels for coach tours, family owned) got public funding to build another, brand new hotel in an area with very few jobs. Guess what? They had to go to Ireland to recruit staff, as they simply couldn't find enough Scots willing to work in the "hospitality industry" - always hard work and paid peanuts. So if that Trump hotel ever comes to pass, there'll be a new influx of eastern European workers, who these days seem to have a monopoly in Scottish hotels. Somebody has to do the dirty jobs... And unless the pay is way above average (for hotels), no locals will be doing it, especially not in the Aberdeen area, where unemployment figures are fairly low compared to the rest of the country. And Trump won't pay more, since nobody makes that kind of money by paying the skivvies well.
I'd better stop now - otherwise I'll spend the night on here listing his crimes!!! :rant:
Bravo ;D :hug:
-
I don't mind people coming to this country to work because that does grow the economy. But I want them to stay and spend their money here. If they remit all their earnings back home and/or don't pay tax then it ain't touching the sides. Great for Poland, lousy for the UK.
-
I don't mind people coming to this country to work because that does grow the economy. But I want them to stay and spend their money here. If they remit all their earnings back home and/or don't pay tax then it ain't touching the sides. Great for Poland, lousy for the UK.
I wasn't trying to say - more jobs for the Poles - after all, I'm a "foreigner" myself! It's just that them always saying "we have to do this kind of thing to create more jobs for the locals" is just so much hogwash. (Apologies to the hogs.)
-
hes a bilderberger. suprised?
-
Had to look that one up - but no, I'm not surprised.
-
So why did the Edinburgh politicians buy the story when the locals didn't? Aberdonians aren't stupid and have a great deal more experience of serious US money men than most 'cos of the oil. And the project was rejected by a local and democratic process - oh well, history is full of such stuff.
Leaves Grampian police with some questions to answer though. Like just how stupid do you have to be to arrest a journalist and cameraman while they film you?
-
why were there subtitles? ::) ::) ??? nothing wrong wi country buchan ;D ;D
its an awful programme, no wonder he wanted it banned. horrible man - going for president? tshh!
-
Just watched a repeat - that man is a monster. How money talks. and opens 'doors'
I wonder how much money changed hands behind closed doors.
-
I doubt very much there's been any actual corruption. Even though the UK Bribery Act came into force after this all kicked-off the US Foreign Corrupt Practices Act has pretty scary consequences for Americans. I'd imagine there were a few all-expenses-paid trips to the US to look and see what gorgeous projects he has built there. Possible rather less than was spent on Googling his business practices.
Even gerrymandering carries real risks these days, so I suspect the whole episode is a consequence of politicians with the best of intentions being suckered. Trump's presentation to government will have been full of projections showing the economic benefits to Scotland. The presentation to his board will have shown how it can be built and run for as little as possible without using expensive local labour. His investors will be expecting their cash to be paid back, so every bit of profit will be repatriated. Politicians are depressingly receptive to promises of economic largesse.
-
A lot of local people were very excited about this development initially, myself included, I thought it would be an amazing facility . We could not understand why there was such an uproar about the area being revamped as the area had nothing else going for it, poor weather and the city dump a few miles south.
In the programme, both Les Taylor and Jamieson lorrys / trucks and earth movers were on site from the film yesterday, they are local businesses employing local people.
However following the hoohar regarding the way Trump has treated the local residents and disrespected their homes I no longer support the project. I thought the site manager was an joke of a man.
-
I watched it in disbelief - I can't understand how the police were able to act in the way they did without any comeback. Also the bit about the re-fencing and the invoice for that ridiculous amount of money!
Just shows that if you can't employ a legal team to obstruct actions then you are the mercy of whatever they want to do to you
I was fuming :rant: by the time it was finished - not a great way to then go to bed!
-
so the fact that hes not building the hotel now - is that good or bad?
the poor council guy that initially refused the planning, did he not get the sack, if not completely ridiculed?
if trump thought that farm was a pigsty, then he should visit here cos we are - literally :roflanim: im sure dorothy wud have bitten his tooshie :roflanim:
it was an upsetting programme.
-
I'm an Aberdonian, and I could see right from the start that Trump was in it for Trump and no-one else. I've also been on shoots and training days on the Menie Estate and it's a b---y shame that it's been ruined by the likes of that American scum bag
-
But wasn't it amazing that the local press - i.e. Press & Journal - refused to print anything in the slightest anti-Trump? They even refused to mention in the cinema listings when "You've been Trumped" was shown at the Belmont... It was more or less sold out several times, anyway, just through word-of-mouth. Shows you the real thinking of the locals.
-
The cinemas were owned by the Donald family (not same as teh ice cream family - that's ours), don't know if they still are. They also had an interest in a lot of major projects in Aberdeen over the years. That makes me wonder if they had an interest in this too?
-
I think the most worrying thing was the attitude of the police. I always poo poo DITW and his conspiracy theories etc but I am starting to think we are living very close to a police state. :gloomy:
-
It was an eye opener for me, I was very annoyed at the treatment the residents got.
I had been possibily for the development up to watching this program.
But Grampian Police are probably pawns in the Trump/Scottish Government game and are between a rock and a hard place.
Trump was I think was reported last week to say Alex Salmon had asked him to help sway public opinion in the states over the realise of the lockerbie bomber (I also find this hard to believe), also that if the wind farm development goes ahead he will pull out (Oh dear).
How would I feel if I was on the receiving end of what these peoople got (not very happy to put it mildly).
-
A lot of local people were very excited about this development initially, myself included, I thought it would be an amazing facility . We could not understand why there was such an uproar about the area being revamped as the area had nothing else going for it, poor weather and the city dump a few miles south.
In the programme, both Les Taylor and Jamieson lorrys / trucks and earth movers were on site from the film yesterday, they are local businesses employing local people.
However following the hoohar regarding the way Trump has treated the local residents and disrespected their homes I no longer support the project. I thought the site manager was an joke of a man.
Les Taylor went out of business last year sometime - I think the machines were bought by the Irish contractor, or have been made available to them. Not sure about Jamieson's.
The film clearly states that most of the contract work is being done by non-local firms. I doubt if the hotel is ever built that local folk will be employed - we expect at least the minimum wage and 37 hour weeks!
Scotland has enough golf courses - and blooming good ones at that. We don't need Disney (sorry Trump) or his theme parks here thank you very much!!
And doesn't the fact that the site is a SSSI - site of special scientific interest mean anything?
-
When this project was first mooted I was generally supportive but I was absolutely furious by the end of this film.
Grampian police must be held to account absolutely disgusting, unjustified and reprehensible behaviour.
Talk about raping the land :rant: :rant: :rant:
-
It will not be the last thing that salmond sells off - he will do anything for a vote or get his fat baw heid in front of a camera!!
I have yet to speak to anyone that will vote for independence. I am sure it won't be long until he starts canvassing in the methodone queues, or gives the under 10's a vote.
-
Sorry to disillusion you TT but there are a large number of us who WILL. I am sick to the back teeth of everything being run in Scotland by and for London and the South East and this is the one way we can redress the situation. Yes, Mr Salmond has made an error of judgement, but so have a number of other politicians, so he will have my vote in Autumn 2014 without doubt.
-
Sorry to disillusion you TT but there are a large number of us who WILL. I am sick to the back teeth of everything being run in Scotland by and for London and the South East and this is the one way we can redress the situation. Yes, Mr Salmond has made an error of judgement, but so have a number of other politicians, so he will have my vote in Autumn 2014 without doubt.
i thought it was the other way around. dont scottish mps get to vote on english issues? even tho it has nothing to do with them?
i doubt very much that scotland will vote for its independence, then, when its all doine and dusted the seperatists will have to be quiet permanantly.
-
Sorry to disillusion you TT but there are a large number of us who WILL. I am sick to the back teeth of everything being run in Scotland by and for London and the South East and this is the one way we can redress the situation. Yes, Mr Salmond has made an error of judgement, but so have a number of other politicians, so he will have my vote in Autumn 2014 without doubt.
seconded, most people I know will do the same, a few undecided but none for the union. No idea where the polls get their figures from as they certainly don't tally with my experience.
-
Trump from what I saw on the TV program is used to getting his own way and I did not not like the way the residents were treated but yes Trump is just out for Trump he will not ave gotten as rich by being a nice guy.
Alex Salmond has supported the golf course for he best of reasons i.e. creating jobs in the area.
I think Trump maybe trying to discredit Salmond but it will not work and to be honest I believe if Scotland had a Labour or a Tory government the results would have been the same. Trump would have been welcomed.
The councillor (Ford)who stood up against the development was in the Green Party. I asked an independant councillor once about him and he said although Ford had different views to himself he had respect for the guy.
-
Scottish independence probably needs a thread or ten of its own. There's some very strong feelings going to be expressed.
:sofa:
Trump was one of the US presidential hopefuls: I doubt he'll go for the Scottish crown!
-
Trump was one of the US presidential hopefuls: I doubt he'll go for the Scottish crown!
Argh!!!! Now don't go giving him ideas... :rant:
-
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-20501837 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-20501837)
In the news again.
Mr Trump has criticised the documentary. Has he actually watched it?
-
I won't be voting for independance thats for sure. Its an unknown quantity here and I think alex is on dodgy ground when it comes to managing ourselves as a separate country. He ought to get his house in order first meaning tackly the huge unemployment, the amount of people going bankrupt and the crappy education children receive.
-
It used to be the English taking over everybody, now it seems to be America and Canada ::)
-
It used to be the English taking over everybody, now it seems to be America and Canada ::)
Forgive me for sometimes getting the impression that that is what the British want: away from horrible Europe - get closer to "our cousins across the pond"; at least they speak a language we can understand... Not everybody does, I know.
-
regarding the act of union I thought it was both parliaments that consented to create the union, not england forcing it's rule over scotland?....
I think alot of people are not aware of this, as there seems to be some misguided ideas on the subject by the uneducated.
Donald Trump, would not touch him with a barge pole!... let alone give him planning permission to build anything within the british isles. i am sure that there have been many proposals to create businesses that would have benefitted local communities that have been swept under the carpet by councils and governments. but trump trumped it all.
-
I LOVED the video of Obama belittling him! Brilliant!
-
It used to be the English taking over everybody, now it seems to be America and Canada ::)
Except for the French who own the utilities and the Spanish who own the BAA airports. Most of central London is owned by foreigners now all paying stupendous prices. That's because the political and financial stability of the UK is seen as a big plus for most of the really rich people from the Gulf and Asia. I guess that if the Qataris have a really big investment here they may be minded to send the odd load of gas round to Milford Haven just to keep the lights on, but I'm not sure.
I'm watching to see how the Catalans make out. Their election just produced a fairly difficult result for just about everybody out there. It's complicated.
I thought Salmond was wrong to agree to a Yes-No vote because there's lots of supplementary but important questions. Perhaps if he gets a yes vote he'll then ask the electorate again but Cameron's strategy seems to be winner takes all. That's stupid because the issue isn't going away whatever the vote says.
-
i agree, the catalan seperatist issue will influence the scottish situation.
i fully support scotlands right to choose, if they choose to seperate i will support that too.
-
regarding the act of union I thought it was both parliaments that consented to create the union, not england forcing it's rule over scotland?....
I think alot of people are not aware of this, as there seems to be some misguided ideas on the subject by the uneducated.
I think that is a bit harsh dismissing people as uneducated.
In fact, Scotland was almost bankrupt because of the failure of the Darien scheme and was in a very weak bargaining position with the English when the Act of Union was negotiated.
-
I think history is a great place to learn from but a lousy place to return to. This decision should be taken for forward-looking positive reasons, but I fear resentment over past evils will get in the way.
If the decision is to separate then Scotland will set off down a path of choices which cannot be determined until then, and the Catalan experience will be useful guidance - though Madrid is going to fight that one tooth and nail and will use Scotland in its battle.
I'd also assume that Westminster will play dirty and will have a plan B, plan C
-
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-20538417 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-20538417)
well this will add fuel to the fire! Ouch in Scotlands wallet!
mandy :pig:
-
I wasn't at all surprised to read this... ::)
-
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-20538417 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-20538417)
well this will add fuel to the fire! Ouch in Scotlands wallet!
mandy :pig:
Quote from the same site "The government estimates the event will generate about £100m for the economy."
-
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-20553939 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-20553939)
Woohooo - now that is good to see:
Donald Trump golf opponent Michael Forbes wins 'Top Scot' award
That's the guy who, according to DT, "lives like a pig"... :thumbsup:
-
Good stuff :excited:
Trump makes me so :rant:
-
that trump is a total tosser.
-
that trump is a total tosser.
You couldn't put it more succinctly.
My brother, who works for a wind energy company that wants to expand in Scotland, reckons we should just ignore him. He's rather difficult to ignore when he's in the news all the time - and now he seems to have started an anti-Scotland media campaign in the USA, to stop Americans from coming here and spending their cash on holiday (oh, sorry: vacation ;) ) in Scotland...
-
well theres an upside to everything eh.
-
He's at it again...
I know some of you are signed up to 38 degree and will have received this as email - but here's a quote from it - or rather, since it won't let me paste anything into this post (why is that? - sometimes it seems to work, and other times it doesn't....), so I'll attach the letter as a word document.