The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Goats => Topic started by: Rhi on October 16, 2012, 02:32:05 pm
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Hi, I have 4 goats,
We live on a large farm and our cattle have gone down with TB, I have been told goat need testing for TB?
Is this true? Can they get it or carry it?
Also do the restrictions with our cattle affect goat movements?
Thank you
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Yes, they will be tested along similar lines to cattle. Same consequences as cattle if they are positive. Sorry, but unfortunately goats can and do get bTB. There was an outbreak in the Golden Guernsey herd in Wales a few years back.
As far as I know, if you are on a farm shutdown your goats can't go anywhere either. But your local AH will advise, your vet wil also know.
I am sorry, but hopefully your goats won't test positive. Where in the country are you?
Are you drinking the milk? If yes, you would be safer to pasteurize it from now on.
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Thanks, I'm in mid wales. Oh dear I wasn't aware, thank goodness I asked, our whole cattle herds due to be re tested next week after having 2 reactors in a test before sending stores to market.
We don't milk, I just keep them as a hobby and was hoping to breed off them.
Thank you
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If you want to breed from them this year and maybe are on a standstill/shutdown, it may be best for you to buy in a male or see if there is a local person that is a trained (goat) AI inseminator (and has their own tank for storing straws). May be quite difficult to get a male on loan or send the girls away.
What breed are your goats?
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This was my dilemma, I was concerned about the TB as my girls we're supposed to go away to stud, but I'm now considering buying my own billy.
I have abit of a mix, 1x togg, 1x togg x saanen, 1x saanen and 1x guernsey x saanen, none are registered, just pets and abit of a hobby. X
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I have just spoken to my vet, and because I'm not milking or consuming their milk they don't have to be tested. Which is a huge relief, but even though I only have 4 girls, I'm considering buying my own billy anyway, make thing a little less complicated. Thanks
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surely if the cattle are positive you want the goats tested, as otherwise they will keep infecting other animals surely???
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surely if the cattle are positive you want the goats tested, as otherwise they will keep infecting other animals surely???
I agree, for your own piece of mind as well, if you do get more reactors in the cattle (hoping you don't of course) then there would always be that question - if only?
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mmmmmh.... difficult one I think :thinking: I was under the impression that you don't have a choice. But I am in Scotland, and so far no TB here.
When the outbreak happened in the Golden Guernsey herd it caused a lot of heartache as goats had been sold from the initial outbreak farm (it was then thought that goats cannot get bTB, and to date I think the only outbreak has been in GG's)....
But humans do get bTB too, so another thought to consider... I normally get quite close to my girls, and the goat kids have no manners like "hand-in-front-of-your-mouth" when coughing, even when jumping up to me (and my human kids). I would probably be worried sick that my human kids could be getting infected, and for peace of mind have the goats tested.
But if the goats test positive.... :-\
Your vet will be the best person to advise. Do you know any other goatkeepers nearby?
Re male - I would go with a Saanen type, but then most will turn out white...
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I have been led to believe by my vet that goats can carry TB to cattle but not actually get it (I think =/) the goats don't mix with the cattle, and the ones that reacted we're on our other farm, but because its the same holding number we automatically go down, because the 2 who reacted we're kept isolated before sending away if we don't get any reactors next time we hopefully have restrictions lifted. I only know one person with A goat local to me, I know there are people within a 20 mile radius who keep them, and I've asked them and none of them test for TB, which I was suprised at.
I never realised getting some goats as pets would be such a complicated hobby, my husband doesn't like them anyway, he'll like them even less now!! X
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I am in Scotland, and so far no TB here.
Scotland's status is "TB free" but it is a fallacy to think that this means there is no TB in Scotland. There are cases from time to time; there was one in Dumfriesshire (in cattle) fairly recently. But the level at which there are cases in Scotland allows the country to use the status "TB free".
Don't ask me, I don't make up the rules. :D
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I had TB in the 60's apart from check ups at the doctors and taking some ghastly quinine tasting milk shakes twice a day no big deal (Mum had it and was sent away to knighton clinic where the windows were left open and the squirrels and snow came in...all visitors wore thick coats.Dad got fed up after 9mnths of travelling 50mls and no improvement and insisted she was moved to the clinic two miles away.Warm wards and proper care and she was out in two months)
I don't think goat TB is the same as the cattle one is it from what I can remember...just hope you don't vaccinate for Johannes because it can cause positive tests
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I think from recent reading and talking to the vet, goats can get bTB but are more resistant to it. She checked with AH for me and said if the neighbouring farm came down with it again, my goats would get tested by AH. It's a blood test, not the same as the cattle test.
All the goats in the badger vaccination area were apparently tested in the spring and none had TB.
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This is something I worry about quite a lot as we live on land that was formerly used to film BBC Badgerwatch as we have so many! I keep goats on that land and the neighbouring farmer has Dexter cattle. He lost a whole herd (small herd) to TB 3 years back.
Am I right in thinking that DEFRA contact us to say if there's a local outbreak? I might have dreamt that.
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This is something I worry about quite a lot as we live on land that was formerly used to film BBC Badgerwatch as we have so many! I keep goats on that land and the neighbouring farmer has Dexter cattle. He lost a whole herd (small herd) to TB 3 years back.
Am I right in thinking that DEFRA contact us to say if there's a local outbreak? I might have dreamt that.
I think Animal Health deal with it but talk to your vet if your worried about it, they'll know the local situation.
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I am in Scotland, and so far no TB here.
Scotland's status is "TB free" but it is a fallacy to think that this means there is no TB in Scotland. There are cases from time to time; there was one in Dumfriesshire (in cattle) fairly recently. But the level at which there are cases in Scotland allows the country to use the status "TB free".
Don't ask me, I don't make up the rules. :D
I know there are isolated cases of bTB up here too, but it is not something that is in my herd health plan, so I am not quite absolutely sure about all the rules.
As far as I know most cattle that come to shows up here has to be tested, and also it seems to have killed off the Alpacas at the local shows (but alpacas and bTB is a completely different story.)
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I'm beginning to think there are distinct advantages to keeping goats in a back garden with only a yard.
Rhi, I hope the second tests are all negative and that your goats keep well. Good luck with the breeding.
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As far as I know most cattle that come to shows up here has to be tested, and also it seems to have killed off the Alpacas at the local shows (but alpacas and bTB is a completely different story.)
I'm sure you're right, any cattle moving into Scotland have to be tested unless they are from a TB4 area and, I think, have spent all of their lives in a TB4 area - or it may be that they have to have spent their whole life on one holding and that holding has been TB4 for all of that time.
(TB4 is 4-year testing, the lowest risk status there is. All of Scotland is TB4 from a testing point of view.)
As I understand it, there is no reliable test for alpacas but there does seem to be a significant risk they can carry it. So - hopefully - Scottish alpaca-keepers are aware of the risks and do not bring alpacas (not sure if it's all camelids - it probably is) up from south of the border.
Goats and sheep can carry it but the recorded incidence is very low. However, that small risk is why BH won't let me fetch sheep here from anywhere other than very strongly TB4 areas - hence why I buy in Scotland and at Carlisle! (Although I know there are now a few non-TB4 parishes in Cumbria, which makes us want to be even more careful.)
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Thanks everyone, a ministry/ animal health vet is ringing me in the morning to let me know what's what, I don't think my vet knew fully, and I wasn't convinced. I will have definate answers tomorrow, will keep you all posted. TB is bad round here, we were down with it for 2 whole years at one point, been clear for 1.5 years and now we've reacted again, and it just happened to be in the 2 cattle who kept escaping in to the forestry!! Their post mortem results came back as visible lesions which puts us at high risk status, meaning we have to test 3 more times and be clear each time, which I didn't know until earlier. Thanks guys xx
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Quote - Posted by: SallyintNorth
and also it seems to have killed off the Alpacas at the local shows (but alpacas and bTB is a completely different story.)
I hoped you mean it's killed off their presence, I'd hate to think of all those poor Alpacas keeling over because they go north of the border ???
Rhi's post has just come in, hope all goes well for you in your next tests Rhi, you think there are badgers in the forest then?
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It was Anke who posted about alpacas killed off at Scottish shows - I assumed she meant it had killed off the entries, not the actual alpacas. :D
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@penninehillbilly, its full of them, the farm on the other side is constantly down with TB, although his sheds a re badger proof its difficult to get everything to the standard and they go into his silage pits and straw barns. We have a lot around our land here, we're surrounded by woodland on 3 sides and river on the 4th side so they tend to stay our side of the valley, although, they have felled a huge chunk of the forest by our house and I've noticed the badgers have moved into some old sets close to where I keep my goats which is one of the reasons I got thinking about TB, then we went down with it and alarm bells started ringing.
My dad lives near Huntley Aberdeen and he says TB just isn't an issue up there like it is down here. my family breed and show british blue cattle and when going to shows like royal highland TB rules are a lot stricter and usually and extra test is done to be sure when taking stock into scotland, where as down here we can show the stock fine without extra testing. Its a huge issue, with many different debates and opinions. X
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Sorry to hear Rhi, I hope the other vet in the morning helps to settle your mind. I too would have thought the goats should definitely be tested.
Beth
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Really hope you get good news.
We have always kept suckler and milk cows on our farm, and for the past 50 years have had a clear test for TB . Cattle only tested every 4 years.. Unfortunately, during the test, it became apparant that the cattle on our land were affected by TB, and I think 5 farms round us were affected too.
My goats were up the lane, away from the fields the cattle were in. I spoke with the vets, who advised me to keep the goats on a small fenced area, as a precaution, and to pasteurise any milk. At no time was I offered a test on my goats, and I have asked numerous times, and been told there is no need..
Farms near me are now on a yearly test.
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Rhi.........if you are offered a free test for the goats.....accept it, for 2 reasons (1) peace of mind & (2) these are rarely offered so always good to accept.
I tested for Brucella on this basis 4 yrs ago !!!!!
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It was Anke who posted about alpacas killed off at Scottish shows - I assumed she meant it had killed off the entries, not the actual alpacas. :D
Of course we Scots don't kill off the Alpacas... ;D , but this year there were none at Border Union, and having talked to (former) Alpaca keepers it was because of TB restrictions for feared contact between animals and humans etc etc...
Rhi - hope your goats and the rest of the coos are ok. :wave: