The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Community => Coffee Lounge => Topic started by: Liz M on August 06, 2012, 01:25:02 pm
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I am having problems with my 2 year old adopted mongrel. He has been with us for approx 4 months now and he pee's up the table leg or the door every morning, even though the door is open. At first I thought it was him marking his territory as I have another male dog, but he is continuing to do it - it's just a little spray, not as if he is desperate to pee. I have used the usual products, but nothing is working, even 'rubbing his nose'! My OH is now saying he will have to live outside unless I can cure him! Help please he is the gentlest dog and loves to be looked after.
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Is he castrated?
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Oh yes, forgot to say that - he is.
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Questions
1)Where is he in the pecking order with the other dog? This might be him trying sneakily to assert his position if he is an underdog.
2)Has the other dog peed at some time on the table legs and he is marking the scent already there?
3) What is his walking routine?
This is definately some form of marking and I would suspect insecurity. Rubbing his nose in it is an old and fruitless practice, so don't do it. Will wait for your answers before I comment further. But well done for adopting him.
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If it's not hormones ( because he is castrated :thumbsup: ) then modifying his behaviour may help.
Do not chastise him, this will make it worse if he is seeking attention.
I would start again from puppy training basics. Can you crate him at night? ( they don't like to wet their own beds usually)
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Well, lets see........... my other dog is a 6 year old Jack Russell, definitely the boss and Barney my adoptee is always wanting him to play and will nip him to get him to chase him, but as you know JRs don't take orders very well, but this could be the case as he is a little pushy. How would I change that. In any case I'm the pack leader.......... I think!!
The JR has never pee'd indoors, so don't think it's that
He likes to be out most of the day in the field and goes for walks in the evening.
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What have you cleaned the table leg with? Some products smell like wee to the dog and encourage more marking in the same spot.
In the meantime I'd be physically taking him out (on the lead if necessary) and shutting yourselves out while he wees on a morning.
You can also get "pee posts" from Pets at home that are supposed to tempt the dog to wee only on them, perhaps this scent-based redirection will help?
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How long have you had him? It sounds like an insecurity problem The worst thing you can do is tell him off, he's marking his territory in the only way he knows how and this is a comfort for him if he's not entirely sure he belongs. He will continue to do this as long as he feels he's not a confirmed member of the pack, albeit at the bottom where most dogs prefer to be. Rub a paste of Bi-carb and water over the table leg to take the smell away and never, ever shout at him even though you could happily kick him over the doorstep :o
Does he do it when you go out of sight? Tell him, back in a minute, wait five seconds and go back. If he hasn't peed praise him, then ten seconds etc.
(I wish Dogandjo would come back, if only for this problem. PM me, Annie with more advice if you read this and I'll pass it on.xx)
Hope this helps a bit :) :dog:
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Personally if it is in a morning I'd crate him and take him straight out when you get up, don't let him back in until he pees, then lots of praise. Just like a pup. A DAP plugin may help settle him more too, in case it is insecurity.
Bio washing powder neutralises pee smell too, for washing where he has peed.
It's going to take time to sort. Has it just started. If so is there a change in routine etc.
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I wouldn't five him the chance of doing it. Stick him on lead and whip him out and praise loads when he has peed outisde.
Helen
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Sorry, have been busy sheepdogging. Tups were a bit boistrous.
I echo what mammyshaz says about the crate if necessary. But first, it must become part of your delay routine to walk him more than once. You can praise him with some kind of command when he wees. I use 'busy' for a poo and 'wee wees' for the leg cocking. If you say it when he does he will associate the command eventually.
If you only think you are the pack leader then you probably aren't! :innocent:
Most imoportant part of this is to either take him out or put him out and close the door or stay with him until he has weed first thinfg before anything else. If he is weeing before youget up then a crate will be necessary overnight and take him out as soon as you get up.
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I think I would try the crate idea.
Can you call him to you as soon as you enter the room, slip on the leash and take him straight outside and praise when he cocks a leg outdoors?
I had a dog from my father, who had lived in a kennel, previous to me taking him. He was a trained gundog but quite a hyperactive sole. He would do a similar thing when excited, especially when greeting people. I would tell him no but not shout at him or make a big fuss. Stopped after a short time of readjustment. If he is a gentle dog ... try not to show too much emotion if you can .... could be insecurity still.
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Thank you everyone :thumbsup:
I will continue to take him out and not let him in til he pees. I think it may be he still feels he doesn't know his place. He is very playful also and can get so excited in the mornings when I get up that he actually doesn't remember why I take him out.
Well I've washed all the table legs ready for a new day tomorrow and I'll give feedback.
I have had dogs all my life and never had such problems before, it's always been the older dog virtually showing the young one. JRs obviously aren't natural teachers!!
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Dont forget to wash under the table legs as well because the pee will have soaked up into the end grain and retained the smell :thumbsup:
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I wouldn't five him the chance of doing it. Stick him on lead and whip him out and praise loads when he has peed outisde.
But it's not the need for a pee that makes them do it. It's insecurity that prompts them to mark their territory. "This is my place,now everyone know that I belong here" I'm not a dog behaviourist by any means( and that may be your best bet) but having dogs in numbers for more than forty years has given me a small insight into how they think and react and they think like dogs, not humans. Poor old chap, I hope you can sort him out :dog:
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I wouldn't five him the chance of doing it. Stick him on lead and whip him out and praise loads when he has peed outisde.
But it's not the need for a pee that makes them do it. It's insecurity that prompts them to mark their territory. "This is my place,now everyone know that I belong here" I'm not a dog behaviourist by any means( and that may be your best bet) but having dogs in numbers for more than forty years has given me a small insight into how they think and react and they think like dogs, not humans. Poor old chap, I hope you can sort him out :dog:
I understand that but it could well break that cycle if he isn't given the opportunity to actually do it. I agree it is about insecurities but breaking the cycle and giving him a positive experience first thing in the morning will give him the confidence he needs.
I'm a bit behind you in that i have only had ogs for 20 years though.
Helen
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I said right at the beginning that this was likely to be an insecurity problem. But the first issue is to try to break the cycle as Helen says. Then you can start to address his other issues which might turn out to be many. Curing insecurity (or at least helping him to gain confidence) can be more about helping him to know his place. More on this later or my post will be too long.
Dogs do pee when they are exited, but they don't usually cock their leg, they squat.
Also I wan't to underline what ITH says about not getting emotional if he makes a mistake. This would only add to his confusion. Here is a thought! are you calm when you enter the room in a morning or is there exitement on greeting the dogs? Does JR get exited when he greets you too? If so it would be better to ignore them both until they have been out and save the happy greetings until later.
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I just wanted to say after reading back on this post of over a year........................... It was the JR not the mongrel who was peeing. Ha ha he was a clever dog, but I caught him one day. It was a territory thing... new dog on his patch. All sorted now. Got a 3rd dog, but this time a lady, so they both behave!!!! :love:
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We had a Patterdale that did that all the time too, always little pees that you could not really notice but you could smell, we spent a fortune on cleaning products and plastic matting etc, sadly he ran out in front of a car...but I would think its just the same as marking trees and stating territory, he is trying to establish his authority but other than crate him and take him out, I suspect he will continue for a while longer. I think its more common when you have more than one dog and bring another into the fold, we have females now and they are good!! Hope you get him sorted out!!
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(I wish Dogandjo would come back, if only for this problem. PM me, Annie with more advice if you read this and I'll pass it on.xx)
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Dogandjo was on earlier, in a wood discussing a snake!!!
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Good, did not notice how long ago the post was, we had a Lab and an Alsatian, the Lab used to wake us up barking but then pee in the Alsatian's bed......but we soon caught her in the act, they can be crafty at times. We bought a lovely green Ikea rug, and it stunk so had to be thrown away, the Patterdale must have thought it was grass! :innocent:
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(I wish Dogandjo would come back, if only for this problem. PM me, Annie with more advice if you read this and I'll pass it on.xx)
Dogandjo was on earlier, in a wood discussing a snake!!!
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I haven't gone anywhere except physically - I was at a meeting all day! :innocent: Anyway - there were 20 replies fro#m other 'dog experts' so you don't really need me. :innocent: It's a boy thing and it looks like Liz solved her own problem last year. :relief:
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I haven't gone anywhere except physically
:innocent: , go away from the interweb for a few mins and see how people get worried.....just like when we had children that followed us to the toilet!! :roflanim: :roflanim:
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.just like when we had children that followed us to the toilet!!
and now it's dogs :roflanim: :roflanim: :roflanim:
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.just like when we had children that followed us to the toilet!!
and now it's dogs :roflanim: :roflanim: :roflanim:
Glad to hear it's not just mine that does it - he has to sit on the bath mat while I'm having a shower too ::)
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Not just dogs, my cat (oriental) often gets worried when I go to the bathroom and she can't find me!
Helen
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I had to climb up a bank while out on a walk and my dogs got so worried as I found it easier to crawl up, they came and locked my face making it even harder to get up.....