The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Pigs => Topic started by: thenovice on February 11, 2012, 10:36:24 pm
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I picked up my first pig from the butchers today and was surprised by the amount of fat on the cuts. On some pieces there was twice as much as meat! The breed was GOS/saddleback, and she was about 6 months old. She didnt look too plump when we took her slaughter, so was it just a rookie mistake of incorrect feeding, the breed or the fact that its winter and so they lay down more fat to keep warm? Any ideas folks? It would be great to get more meat from the next one, as she is now mostly destined for sausages! HELP :D
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Which cuts are you talking about that were twice as much fat as meat?? Our pigs are fatter than most, but I haven't seen anything like that.
It's not good for your pig to be obese, but don't compare them to those emaciated supermarket pigs either.
Why would your pig only be good for sausages - fat gives flavour and keeps the meat moist, sounds to me you'll have some nice roasts :yum: You don't have to eat all the fat, just leave it on when cooking and cut it off afterwards. If there's a thick layer of backfat, don't throw it away, it's very good for salami's and lardo (cured backfat). Did you get the flair fat?
If you want more meat, you can let your gilts live a few months longer.
:wave:
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you dont say what you were feeding them.
did you knock her back 2 weeks prior to slaughter.
you need to feel the back bone if its visable the pig is too skinny if you have to really press down too fat
we had as a experiment 2 x GOS and 2 GOS x saddleback same age running together etc. the x's went to slaughter 3 weeks earlier came back with a good fat covering (some would say a little too much) the others came back spot on a layer of fat you would expect from a rare breed pig .
the reason we did this is because some friends of ours always buy in x's and always complain about the fat so we wanted to see if there is a difference, the worst x they had was a berkshire x saddleback, they now buy pure breeds.
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Don't write her off as sausages - as Eve says, cut the fat off the joints ;)
She didnt look too plump when we took her slaughter
You have to feel if she's too fat, just like Chickenfeed says - it really is the only way to know for sure.
Overfeeding is very common to begin with so don't beat yourself up - just make a note of it for next time & weigh out your feed amounts and find a container that either holds that amount or make a mark at the level you need to fill it to (if you weren't doing so before).
HTH
Karen :wave:
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all good advice already given but was it your pig you received back
the Small; amount of meat compared to fat would bear this out you don't give any measurements of fat depth
it is backfat that is measured ideally this should be 10-12 mm that is what they aim for in emaciated pigs (eve)20 mm is about normal for well produced traditionall breeds some even get to 30-40 mm but without photos or measurements we can only surmise
feeding what and how much did you feed just because your pig reaches the magic 6 months it does not automatically mean it is ready to kill
breeding gos and saddelback are both traditional breeds therefore dual purpose and both can go to fat esp the saddelback a cross is just that you are never certain of what you will end up with and where until it is hanging on the hook and by the it is to late
Hampshire pietrain and Duroc are about the only lean pigs you can get away with overfeeding and crosses of them reduce the fat to an acceptable level
from your description it sounds more like a kunnie that you ended up with :farmer:
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Hi Novice,
I had exactly the same GOS x Saddleback,the boys were taken at 7 or 8 months and had fed them a lot of veg and fruit,two pigs were very good with not even one inch on,the two larger had over one inch on.-I took the girls in at 10 months at 125kg and 135kg and they were Very fat,as yorkshire lass can tell you.
I was wondering what you have fed yours and like you say maybe because of the winter you may be right,I hope Robert shall be along or Oaklands,they can help more than I as was my first time too.
here is the link with pictures of my first lot.this was four Boars.http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/forum/index.php?topic=19008.msg178099#msg178099 (http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/forum/index.php?topic=19008.msg178099#msg178099)
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leghorn your cuts are alright the photo with the black pvc tape on the bag the right hand side of it you can see where the pig has stopped growing and started again thin line on the fat this extra fat is easy removed if you want to trim it back :farmer:
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Contrary to views expressed above, Saddlebacks are NOT especially prone to being fat and I have documentary evidence over 12 years and literally throusands of examples to prove it. Unless posters can substantiate their claims, please do not denigrate breeds on Forums such as this where literally thousands of people may be viewing your comments.
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Contrary to views expressed above, Saddlebacks are NOT especially prone to being fat and I have documentary evidence over 12 years and literally throusands of examples to prove it. Unless posters can substantiate their claims, please do not denigrate breeds on Forums such as this where literally thousands of people may be viewing your comments.
i dont think anyone has said saddlebacks run to fat.
my example came from my own experience with X's. we have had pure pedigree saddlebacks that produced some fantastic pork & bacon.
maybe some x's dont mix well together (another reason for buying in pure breeds). ;)
so just for the record saddlebacks make great pork & bacon.............................as does brithish lops, berkshire GOS, tamworths, large blacks etc etc etc it down to personal choice when choosing a breed.
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the pig in question was half a saddelback had it been half a tamworth the same view would be expressed
keepers with years of experience can control the growth and the layering of fat those looking for advice do not have these skills and are looking for alternatives
Richard your comments equate to dogs lets just take collies for example yes they are vicious temperamental bitting fur on legs but with proper handling and skill they can also be lap dogs
far to often a blinkered approach is taken to pig breeding especially by the head of the breed societies :farmer:
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from your description it sounds more like a kunnie that you ended up with :farmer:
Just don't even go there Mr W ::) :D :D :D
My last Kune Kune to get slaughtered was leaner than the Berkshire we took :o
If pigs are too fatty - any pigs ;) - it's because they've consumed more calories than they've used (just like us humans) so up their excercise and space they have and/or reduce the feeding - simples ;D :thumbsup:
far to often a blinkered approach is taken to pig breeding especially by the head of the breed societies :farmer:
Pot - kettle ::) :-\ Chairmen should remember this too ;) :D :D :D
Comments made amongst friends (whether vitual or not) on an on-line forum can very easily be misconstrued and as Mr Pig says, read by many thousands of folk and taken the wrong way.
We all need to have our own favourites (without that all of the traditional breeds would be in more trouble than they are now) - one man's meat is another man's poison and all that ;)
Karen :wave:
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emaciated pigs (eve)
Robert, are you saying I'm an emaciated pig? :D Our 6-month old entire GOS boars do come back with 30-40mm backfat even though they have a huge field to run around in, they got their pound-per-month feed plus large quantities of apples (whoops, too much fruit sugar probably, but they tasted very sweet ;)). Much less fat on legs and shoulders, of course, and we use the fat in charcuterie, so we don't mind. I'm slimmer than my pigs ;D For the next lot, we're ditching that pound-per-month rule after 4 months.
Robert, re Leghorn's photographs: how do you see a pig has had a growth check - is it that little band of meat in the middle of the fat on those chops? Can you tell roughly at what age that would have happened?
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yes Karen but do they read these comments or skim read that is the question
i did say that traditional breeds are duel purpose and you have fell into the trap as well by saying your kunnies were leaner than berkshires
now from your experience of slaughter houses the novice(poster) could have had a swap no inference was implied about kunnies even if they are described as round and fat in Maori :farmer:
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i don't want to start the old argument that commercial pork is inferior to traditional pork it is still farmers that are producing them :thumbsup:
30-40 mm is an inch to an inch and a half that is alright if you can use the fat but just imagine that on bacon the public would not buy it as they perceive it as being to much and have heard comments from the buying public on this (i don't sell to the public)
yep that that little band in the fat a change of environment or feed maybe leghorn could expand on this and tell you the age that happened at
so the exercise guff does not work either with feeding pigs from your experiences eve :farmer:
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so the exercise guff does not work either with feeding pigs from your experiences eve
Nope, they didn't burn it all of, even though their field this year was much, much bigger than previous years. Could see it the last few weeks that they wouldn't be any slimmer than the previous years' pigs. We don't mind as we use the fat, but if they can be just as happy with eating a bit less bought-in feed, well... ;)
We changed the feed of our pigs from pellets to wheat & beans at about 4 months, that might have caused that little meat layer in the fat - though the change in their diet was fairly gradual.
@ The Novice: there's a book called "Fat" from the same author as "Odd Bits". Might be of interest. :wave:
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We had some saddleback x boars and kept them through winter killed two weeks ago tomorrow and the fat level was very good not a lot at all.. We were very strict on feeding them..... It was our first time too. We did let them run outside in a penned area and come in when they pleased...
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I should really like to learn from Mr. Pig with all many more years of experience than me exactly what he feeds his Saddlebacks and what age they go to slaughter. On the whole I have found our Saddlebacks come out less fatty than the Tamworths, all of whom get exactly the same feed rations at our place, lots of space to run around, and unknown amounts of woodland roots etc. to dig up and eat. Our best pig ever was our first Saddleback x GOS cross (boar) who grew much faster than his sisters, went to slaughter at 6 months 1 month earlier than them and had only 18 mm fat. Next year I am planning to do the pound-per-month rule up to 4 months and after that up it gradually to a max of 5 lbs a day (2.3 kg) whatever age they go to slaughter. I had not heard before of Leghorn's comment on cutting down for 2 weeks before slaughter - is this a common practice?
Like Novice, my pigs never look plump when I send them off - but then I can never feel their backbone either. They just seem very solid and hard all along the backbone, not fat, and no amount of pressing would make it feeleable I dont think. Tamsaddle
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More from curiosity than a practical suggestion, but in the depths of my memory there is something about using ultrasound on fat lambs, with the aim of improving feeding/breeding to get the carcass just right.
Ahh seems to be a Signet thing http://www.signetfbc.co.uk/documents/content/sheepbreeder/factsheet_10_ultrasound_scanning_sheep.pdf (http://www.signetfbc.co.uk/documents/content/sheepbreeder/factsheet_10_ultrasound_scanning_sheep.pdf)
Anything similar happening in the commercial pig world? Any useful results to filter down?
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depends on the slaughter house used they do a backfat probe and this is recorded on the e aml but from memory it is on the commercial pigs as they are paid plus or minus on backfat and weight
interesting as well the commercial graders (the people that go round selecting pigs for slaughter for the commercial producer) are mostly women and this is on a hand eye coordination again from somebody that was considering b and b for pigs :farmer:
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i don't want to start the old argument that commercial pork is inferior to traditional pork it is still farmers that are producing them :thumbsup:
30-40 mm is an inch to an inch and a half that is alright if you can use the fat but just imagine that on bacon the public would not buy it as they perceive it as being to much and have heard comments from the buying public on this (i don't sell to the public)
yep that that little band in the fat a change of environment or feed maybe leghorn could expand on this and tell you the age that happened at
so the exercise guff does not work either with feeding pigs from your experiences eve :farmer:
i don't want to start the old argument that commercial pork is inferior to traditional pork it is still farmers that are producing them :thumbsup:
30-40 mm is an inch to an inch and a half that is alright if you can use the fat but just imagine that on bacon the public would not buy it as they perceive it as being to much and have heard comments from the buying public on this (i don't sell to the public)
yep that that little band in the fat a change of environment or feed maybe leghorn could expand on this and tell you the age that happened at
so the exercise guff does not work either with feeding pigs from your experiences eve :farmer:
That little band of fat,the pigs went at around 7 months,when I first got them,I fed them weaner meal,or the tiny pellets,it was giving them the runs and under advice,they went on to Heygates sow rolls though mixed this with veg and fruit.However,they seemed to be fattening too quick,so for breakfast,they would have a sack of carrots and just a small amount of rolls,afternoons the same but even more veg and fruit than rolls,I have to admit that they also had some bread,but not too much.
The boys were always really active and fast.However,in the last 4-6 weeks,the fruit and veg supply ran dry so they only had the rolls,I think this is where the excessive band came from-maybe?Again,this was also my first time,so and to be honest,I did not realise regards that new band of growth until you just mentioned it Robert.