The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Pets & Working Animals => Dogs => Topic started by: Brijjy on February 04, 2012, 09:53:27 pm
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I have a two year old Border terrier bitch who is a terrible wanderer. I don't really know why she goes off apart from the fact that she is a terrier. I have had Borders before, a dog and a bitch, and they were the same. I can't walk her off the lead ever, even when I am just in the field with her. I have tried the reward when she returns to being called and this works for a while then she'll not respond. It's as if she's got bored with it. I have never chastised her for going off as she does eventually return and you can't punish her when she comes back. I am resigned to the fact that she will always have to be on a lead or tethered in the garden to prevent her from wandering. It has proved nigh on impossible to dog-proof the garden. Would spaying her make a difference? My previous bitch was spayed but unfortunately died due to complications from the spay so I never found out if it would have stopped her wandering. My current bitch is an only dog, she did have a companion, a small lurcher but she never really got on with him. I had to have him re-homed (another story, sheep worrier). Sorry to ramble on but if anyone has any advice I would be grateful as it would be great to let the little monster have a good run about.
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I have had terriers for over 30 years Jack Russell's, Borders, Patterdales and Fell terriers and the prey drive is quite strong in most of them, when they get on to or are looking for a scent they can be very single minded. These types of terriers have been breed for generations to work vermin its in there makeup. Find yourself a safe place where she can have a good run as you say she comes back. failing that a place with a fence she cant get through or over, I don't know if spaying would work sometimes it doesn't. Once they have tasted the excitement of freedom is nearly impossible to stop them.
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I too have female Border terrier and.....I cant offer much hope as mine wanders too, even tho she was speyed promptly. She doesnt run off, she just wanders off and carries on wandering! Shortly after we moved up here, I took my eyes off her for a few minutes after telling her off for attacking the broom when I was mucking out the horses, and the next thing, I couldnt find her and a lady down on the road 2 miles away picked her up, thankfully took her to a vets who scanned and found her chip.
Now, I never do anything else when I let/take her out, she is always in sight.
I dont think it's very curable as she does just go deaf as a post once shes a certain distance off and has a nice smell to sniff.
Unless you can dog proof the garden you might have to only let her out when you are there. But I would def get her speyed, as if she wanders you could end up with an unholy alliance...:-O)
The terrierist...
(http://i342.photobucket.com/albums/o405/lachlanandmarcus/Morwennasphotos-Angelasleavingdo-1.jpg)
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We had a pretty Paterdale/Lakeland terrier and he was castrated but we could not take him off the lead ever...no treat was good enough and in the end he ran off infront of a fast car///THE END!! no more for me but he was the cutiest dog ever..I cried for ages when he went!!
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Spaying will make no difference. What DOES make a difference is the initial training of a puppy at 8 weeks, or in a breeder's case even earlier while the pups are still in the nest. If pups are taught the recall whistle as soon as they are weaned it usually stays with them - they don't get fed if they don't come running to the whistle. The stop whistle is a life saver and instant recall in any breed is imperative. You could still do it at her age but you'd have to keep her on a line till she was doing it 100 %. NO free running at all till you are 100% sure she will obey your commands.
Start using a whistle (carries further than the voice and in theory at least it is unemotional, although I would argue the point on that ;D)
For the emergency stop, have her on a lead and tell her to sit, at the same time blow a single blast on the whistle, and gradually lengthen the distance between you as she anticipates sitting when you blow the whistle, till she sits the second you blow the whistle no matter where she is - in the house, in the garden, or wherever.
For the recall put her on a sit stay, again on a short lead to start with, then lengthen it as she progresses, Walk a step away to start with and call her and immediately afterwards blow three pips on the whistle. If she doesn't come immediately give her a tug, and when she gets to you give her a very high value treat - chicken, cat biscuits, liver, whatever turns her on. ::) Again gradually lengthen the distance you are recalling her from. Slowly slowly catchee monkey ................ You'll go through a lot of chicken etc, but it IS worth it!
Hope that helps.
And lastly - she isn't a terrier - she is a dog - all dogs will run off and do what they want to do if they are not trained. Well, almost all dogs. Some breeds don't bother.
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Thanks for the advice peeps. I'll have a go at Doganjos tips. I know my mum has tried a similar thing on her Border who is the brother to mine, with some, but limited success. However he does chase moving things, cats, sheep, cars etc. My terrier doesn't chase anything she just wanders where her mood takes her. Luckily she is chipped and all my neighbours know where she lives. She has been to all the neighbours at some point. ::) Her saving grace is that she is a lovely, friendly dog and absolutely dotes on the kids. I'm sure she thinks she's people! I had thought about getting her a companion but a) she is never alone for longer than a couple of hours a week. My mum dog sits while I am at work. b) although she enjoys the company of other dogs she definitely likes it when she comes home away from the other dogs at mums. She seems to like company in small doses.
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When we first had our terrier his recall was great, we did all those things doganjo but when he got older he chose when HE wanted to come back, his instincts were greater than his bond with us.....we moved to a remote farm location and I am sure he would have ran and ran so we bought a cheap washing line to give him a bit of freedom.......I was dedicated to training him as a tiny pup but it all went pants up as he became a teenager. Before we moved up to Scotland we had a neighbour who had 3 dogs, a Lab, a cross breed dog and a little boarder Terrier very similar to our dog, I saw the Terrier on the stone wall with the others watching and he looked at them, then off he went!!!!!!!! funny but not good!
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We have a Border Terrier amongst our pack( we call him the coconut with a waggy tail) he pays scant attention to commands and we have always had to let him run loose in a completely dog-proof paddock. Worth every penny spent. The fencing doesn't have to be high but feather boarding at the bottom stops burrowing ;) He is eleven now and finds it easier to go with the flow ;D
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I have a wirehaired foxterrier girl, spayed at 18 months - and I would NEVER let her off the lead, as she chases moving wheels (mainly cars) and has done since we got her as an 8 week old puppy.... also not great with other dogs, but she gets a good long walk at least once a day (good for me too). All the other terries around here are walked on leads...
Once mine finds a smell/trail it would be impossible to stop her!
One neighbour with a wee Jack Russell bitch has invested into the electric or magnetic(?) fence/collar for his girl and it seems to work. She barks and stays behind an invisible line on his farm while we walk past. When she is out for a walk it is a lead though. When she is in his car she goes beserk at the sight of another dog....
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Sign your self up for Susan Garrets next recallers webinair series.
She is an international agility and flyball champion. She has a jack russel called decaff who is amazing, but was a very difficult dog.
Her website has lots of tips on motivating your dog to want to work for you, creating a motivting toy, and getting your dog to work under distraction.
Www.clickerdogs.com (http://Www.clickerdogs.com). Say yes dog training.
Some bits are on utube
My jack russel cross ( very wormy, high prey drive type) has the best recall, focus and self control of all of my dogs- only trained him using her style of training along with a better knowledge of learning theory and not letting my dog decide not to work with me or leave work when he had ha enough.
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See, I tried and he knew when I wanted him and he would come to me more than anyone else, I layed down in Moffet part to get him to come to me when we first moved here and he did and I did look silly too but at least he came to see why I was on the floor, I shall stick to my labs they are excellant at recal but Terriers have a bit more guts and put tow fingers up and they are off, love Billy, he was a lovely dog and he would keep up with our pack but no more Terriers for me.....
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My tips are only going to benefit if you do them 100% - dogs are opportunist. If you let them off once that is them retrained to do it the wrong way, so you have to keep up the pressure. And I am the first to a admit that I am better at giving advice and tips than taking the same action myself - so only 2 of my four are completely trustworthy. My older lad goes self hunting from time to time, as does my older bitch but both do come back to recall within a few minutes usually. The other tow rarely go out of sight and come back pretty well immediately. But even so I wouldn't trust any of them off lead in the town(and it's usually illegal anyway - bye laws usually say all dogs to be on lead I believe)
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Our old terrier x?? knew that she was not alowed out of the garden, she was occasionaly spotted down the road. when shouted would race off home, squirm through the fence and appear by the back door to greet you....."I don't know who you saw but look Ive been here all the time! I am a good girl" wag wag wag
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We've got two collies - well, one's a collie for sure and the other is part terrier, I think. Tess, the part-terrier, is torture - her recall is variable. Meg's as sound as a pound. Tess had got better - she's nearly 12 - but she is a dog of independent spirit ;D
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I feel for you! My three year old parsons still ocasionally goes hunting, and once he's on a scent, there is no stopping him! He does come back to the whistle though, learnt from puppy training, so I definitely recommend persevering with that. I must admit I rarely take him out walkies when I have the whistle with me though. He was 18 months old before I trusted him enough to go without a lead and 90% of the time, he is great - it's just the other 10 percent. I think a lot of terriers can take this amount of time and often it seems to be a lack of trust from the owner as well as the dog (I know that is the case with me) - it took a qualified dog trainer to say "trust him" to me to let him off his lead. The thing is they have so much more fun off the lead, it's difficult to imagine not letting them off. ood luck!
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Terrible terrier did have a run off the lead today. She was coupled up to her brother a la foxhound style and under constant supervision. This seemed to work ok as although they both wander they seem to do it for different reasons. However I wouldn't ever do this with them with no supervision.
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We spoke to a wonderful lady with a Deer hound and she paid a lot of money to get an electric colar that she could re call her dog with, once he came back with a sheep!!!!!!
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I have looked into an electric collar but they are banned in Wales unfortunately. This was when I had a lurcher that got a taste for sheep. He was a dog that I couldn't keep on a lead all the time as he loved to run. Most of the time he came back to me but the times he didn't he was into my neighbours sheep. :(
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I know and still think its better an electric colar than a dead sheep or dog!!
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Absolutely - agree wholeheartedly. They have to be on the dog without being activated for at least 2 to 3 weeks before training begins so that the dog doesn't know that the collar is correcting it.
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Apparently the welsh assembly think it is crueller to train a dog using an electric collar than to just let it wander off and get run over or to get into a field of sheep and be shot by a farmer. This did happen to my neighbours dog and allegedly it wasn't a clean shot either. Can't bear to think of that happening to my little monster. :(
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The reason they have been banned is because they were and are readily available and many people do not use them correctly. They must be left on the dog for at least two weeks prior to ANY correction being made, and then used at the lowest setting to obtain the required behaviour. It is seen nowadays that positive training is far better than negative, and many people look on these collars as negative. They can be used as a quick and easy correction and retribution tool by unknowing and unscrupulous people. One of my dogs was trained by a professional trainer using a collar to stop her jumping the field fences and running off. I reckon it saved her life on a few different levels. I have one but I don't use it. Had no call to so far.
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I thought it funny as a dog trainer on my facebook friends was ranting on about her sister buying a Terrier but not being able to cope so took it to her for some lessons! she said they are very difficult dogs!!
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a different breed but anyway - our gsd used to be a right pest for running away to the village (we live on a farm so plenty of space but the moment u turned ur back she was away)
we spayed her at 5 years (because of phantom pregnancies) and she has stopped running away 98% of the time. but she is now incontenant so i wudnt spay another bitch as she used used to a house dog but is now resigned to the utility room which wasnt the plan. she has calmer alot after spaying.