The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Goats => Topic started by: Blinkers on January 08, 2012, 01:18:17 pm
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I kinda know the answer to this but thought I'd ask what others would do :-\.
One of my does is almost certainly now barren. She had a very bad kidding a couple of years ago, lost the kids and took a week for her to recover to anything remotely like normal eating etc, although she is absolutely fine now. Last year 2010-2011) she just kept returning season even though my buck covered her every time - so I just left her and then this year (2011-2012) she came into season, the buck covered her and she didn't return and so I assumed she was in-kid. However, nothing materialised on said date and no signs several days later of anything going on (she is just fat I think), and is quite obviously not in-kid. My head tells me to cull her but my heart......well, you know.... :'(
What would you do?
Thanks all.
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I know some would say 'to get rid' but personally I find that pretty tough. My animals are my hobby which hopefully pays for itself but by no way a business so maybe that's where things are different. I have a female that came with another (so they are palls) who didn't get pregnant last year and this year as we now have our own Billy she's been covered several times still comes into season so I'm sure she barren. Saying that I have a friend who sold a barren goat only to find the next year it had kids. I think not getting pregnant after having a bad kidding or problems is quite common - Feebee, my little favorite, her kid died during kidding and the vet had a bit of messing about to get the kid out, the following year (last year) she didn't take after several visits to the Billy and this year she is pregnant (keeping fingers crossed it goes ok - especially for her)
Sorry that's probably not helped answer the question!!
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What you have described is that of a doe that has cystic ovaries.... and obviously will not breed.
I would suggest contact your Vet and get her injected with Estrumate... this will bring her into season & deal with the cysts if that is indeed the cause. Monitor her carefully and get her scanned as soon as practical.
Very few goats are really barren.... just assumed to be because they don't kid. Nubians & their crosses are particularly susceptible to cystic ovaries.
Estrumate has always worked for me.... have had several does with this problem.
Best of luck
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When I spoke to my vet re my one, he said there was an injection I could have done to 'sort out her cycles' - was how he put it - I haven't done that yet as just after I got her I discovered 2 stitches in her side which I believe could have been from a cesarean so thought that has either 'put her on hold for a bit' or caused damage.
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It could be her ovaries- or even just that her cycles are out of order, in which case, yes you can inject them.
It could also be however, that there is scar tissue from the bad kidding, which is stopping a pregnancy taking hold. If it's scar tissue, there is very little you can do.
Does she not come into milk in the summer of her accord? If she did that I would be inclined to try and just keep her milk ticking over and maybe someone would want her for a pint or two of milk a day.
Beth
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Many thanks for all the replies and some very useful information and suggestions.
Beth - No she hasn't come into milk at all since I dried her off for her 2009-10 kidding. I thought because she came into rip-roaring season this year and was happily covered and then didn't 'return', I kept my fingers crossed that all was back to normal. Last year she just kept returning season and so I KNEW she wasn't in-kid but this time, I was pretty hopeful. (PS - Spring is in kid too ;D )
The scar tissue damage is certainly a possibility as there had to be a lot of intervention (09-10) to get the kids out (2 HUGE kids coming at the same time and both dead) and she was very poorly for about 3-4 days before she finally turned the corner and started to improve. Once she'd recovered she's been in peek of health, very happy, glossy coat, eats well (actually she's a gluten for food 8) ) and to all intents and purposes, absolutely fine.
The cystic ovaries are also very big possibility and I'm glad you mentioned it Wytsend as had crossed my mind, but wasn't sure if I was barking up the wrong tree - so will discuss this with my vet.
Plan now is to firstly chat to my vet tuesday when I take a couple of male kids down for disbudding and castration and then get her looked at. If the general consensus had been "forget it, she'll never breed now", then I would have had to deal with the possibility of losing her, but as there has been such a lot of positive feedback and "possibles", then I'm going to take it further and give her every chance.
thanks again all and I'll keep you updated. :thumbsup:
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If you find that it is unlikely that she will breed again, (and you don't say how old she is), you could always advertise her as a companion goat. I seem to have seen the odd query re people wanting one, and if you are not in a rush to sell/give her away, you can wait for the right home to turn up.
There seem to be more people around that want to have goats as pets rather than as milk/meat producers.
For me the decision would be very much along the lines of having space in the goatshed and how she gets on with the rest of ther herd.
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What a lovely reply from Anke, having seen Blinkers Goats I would keep em all whatever they have or have not :)
I know they have to pay for keep but knowing Blinkers Im sure she will make the right decision. If all else fails a companion goat would be ideal, Im sure there is someone who wants one.
Good Luck Mandy!!
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Glad to hear Spring is in kid Mandy- when is she due? I was just about to say I was telling Karla (her half sister the same age) that she was having babies too, and then I thought that might make me sound even more mental than I actually am.....
You do get some goats that are just not very fertile. It doesn't mean they are barren per se, but sometimes they can be hellish difficult to get in kid! I suppose it's just people- some need ivf! We fortunately found a home for one we had like that- but she was a BT, and is still milking away giving a couple of pints in winter, and 4 pints in summer, and it has been 3 years since she kidded. So she was perfect for an older couple who missed having some goats, and only want a small amount of milk for the house. She does have a younger companion who will need to be kidded eventually when she dries up a bit more.
Beth
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Thanks Salopman :wave:. If money was no object, there wouldn't have to be a decision made :-\ but I'm going to give her the benefit of the doubt for the time being :)
Beth, she's kidded twice before without problem of conception or actual kidding so I'm sure its to do with the difficult kidding the other year :'( It was an awful time and for 3 days all she ate was the occasional banana but as she pulled through I feel she deserves to be given another go (third time lucky maybe ???). Spring has calmed down now that she is growing up, she was an absolute horror during her goatling year - she'd rear up and pretend that EVERYONE was another goat and want to playfight!!!! She's much more "normal" now and I've told her so :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
I do have some friends just north of Carmarthen who have recently taken on a Xbred AN goat and are looking for a companion for her - so there's a possibility of a home there for her if they haven't already got something. Will be seeing them Friday, so will make enquiries :thumbsup:. But for the time being - she's staying put ;D.
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I'm with you there, Blinkers. I've been asked if my older goat is for the pot now she is too old to produce anything but my view is (and I know it's not a very commercial one) that she gave me nine years' good service so now she can have a happy retirement. :) :goat:
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Well, I chatted to two of the vets yesterday when I was down their with the kids and they said definately not cysts (as she's been coming into season), unlikely to be scar tissue as there was no damage internally - she just had a bad infection and then I said that I thought she was in-kid as she 'looks' in-kid. Consensus immediately then was that she was almost certainly just too bloomin fat and so her fertility levels were low. I must admit and say that I knew she was too overweight and had tried to slim her down over the summer......but I couldn't keep her shut in when the rest of the herd were all outside having a good time, now could I !!!????? So, at this particular moment in time I am DELIGHTED that this is the most likely cause (not a definate diagnosis, but an almost) and she IS now on restricted haylage and only has a handful of hard feed anyway - She already looks slimmer this morning ;D. So, another missed year but heyho at least she gets to have another try next season :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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Cystic Ovaries most Vets cannot get their heads around !!!! Goats CAN come into season with cystic ovaries... they just don't conceive !!!! It would still be a good idea to get an Estrumate injection even if you don't intend to breed... it will ensure her system cycles properly.
I too have a fat goat.... was given Estrumate because she was coming into season roughly 18 -21 day intervals... she is now safely inkid.
Mosts Vets agree they don't understand goats & why they work as they do !!!!
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Mosts Vets agree they don't understand goats & why they work as they do !!!!
I would say this is the case for most animals that they've not had lots of dealings with ;)
Vets are a bit like GP's (I think) they know a little about a lot of things, but in-depth knowledge of each species is more commonly found with an experienced keeper or a vet with a particular speciality.
I'm glad you Doe is staying put, fingers crossed for you all :thumbsup:
Karen x
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Im glad too Mandy! Give her another go!!
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Glad she is ok - if you do find out any more please let us know - invaluable knowledge
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Glad she's ok. :D