The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Sheep => Topic started by: Shnoowie on October 09, 2011, 02:03:02 pm
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We have a few too many Ryeland rams - there are two which we definitely want to keep, and three that need to go. They're all pedigree and registered but nobody seems too keen on buying them, I suppose there is not much call for them!
We have thought about eating them, but they're not really big enough. So, we're considering castrating them so they can run with the girls and at least that sorts out some of our grazing problems. They are all too old for bands - one being nearly 2 and the others being around 7 months. Does anyone know how much a vet would charge - ish for them to be done?
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I asked my vet. recently about castrating a full grown ram (the alternative didn't bear thinking about though all has come well :)) His advise was that I would go to a great expense and that there was a very significant risk of the ram bleeding to death. I would have taken that risk except that a good home was found for him.
Sorry, not much help :-\
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We had one of our 2009 tup lambs castrated at about 5 months old - I got attached to him, so we keep him as a tup companion. He's such a sweetheart.
Anyway, as far as I can remember, the vet charged about £6. We took him to the surgery in the back of the car; Dan held Dickie (the now wether) on his back while the vet administered a local anaesthetic and did the job. Took about 10 minutes; took Dickie home and put him back with his mum and he was none the worse. He was a bit sore later once the anaesthetic wore off (walking like John Wayne) but was fine next day.
Why are they not big enough to eat? We eat out Ryeland tup lambs about 7 months old and they're well big enough.
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Have had several adult rams castrated and gone to pet homes ( yes I know I could eat them but some I do some I don't) never had one bleed to death. If your vet can do it under local for six quid bargain paid a lot more had had it done surgically never had any problems
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I asked my vet. recently about castrating a full grown ram. His advise was that I would go to a great expense and that there was a very significant risk of the ram bleeding to death.
Sounds like your vet didn't actually want to do it and was trying to put you off. Most mixed/ large animal vets are used to having to castrate large calves and I don't really see there is much difference between them and a ram.
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Totally unrelated to your post but I am looking for a couple of ryeland ewes and if I can find some I may well be interested in a ram do you know of anyone who has any ewes for sale?
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Totally unrelated to your post but I am looking for a couple of ryeland ewes and if I can find some I may well be interested in a ram do you know of anyone who has any ewes for sale?
Whereabouts are you? I know of a couple of people who have ewes for sale. Also are you looking for Ryelands or Coloured Ryelands?
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Somerset don't really mind coloured or not.
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If they were mine I would have sold them at a rare / minority breed sale. If they are not selling privately and with the proceeds bough some move ewes to eat the grass.
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I agree, I'd sell them and buy ewes. However we had a load of entire shetlands castrated at 6 months+ and it was about £9 an animal on farm. Everything is cheaper if you can take the animal to the surgery as well.
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Somerset don't really mind coloured or not.
Have pm'd you.
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We've been trying to sell them since this years lambs were weaned - no joy. We never made the show and sale due to illness. One of this years lambs is too small to eat, one will make a good tup and the eldest one is a proven ram, it seems a shame to eat them when they could have uses as either tups, or failing that lawn mowers.
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Don't give up offering the good ones for sale as breeding tups just yet. We find we get several last minute requests for breeding tups from breeders who seem to have forgotten to plan ahead or missed the sales.
As well as surgical castration, there is a thing called a burdizzo, which crushes the spermatic cords without opening the skin. It sounds enough to make grown men weep, but apparently is fine for the sheep.
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Hopewell, my ram is six years old, would this make a difference? My vet. is a large animal expert and, I hope, wouldn't fob me off.
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surgical technique commonly used in castrating farm animals is to open the scrotum at the bottom see the described proceedure
The testicles may be surgically removed. With this method, a sharp knife or scalpel is used to remove the bottom one-third of the scrotal sac. The testicles are removed and the wound is allowed to drain and heal naturally. It is essential that proper aseptic technique be used when the surgical method of castration is used.
According to research conducted in Great Britain, surgical castration is the most painful method of castration as lambs surgically castrated have higher amounts of cortisol in their bloodstream as compared to lambs castrated using other methods. Surgical castration also has the greatest potential for infection and fly infestation. Surgical castration should only be done before or after fly season
Had it done once that way in a ram NEVER again poor bastard! a bloody mess and it was not comfortable for him or to look at. the others were done by an expereienced Small animal vet who used the same surgical technique as for a dog ( yes there is a risk of swelling) but properly ligated really the risk of bleeding to death is a fault of the veterinary surgeon NOT the procedure. if you do decide to get a ram done ask lots of questions first and decide foryourself which technique you prefer and IF the vet is willing to do it that way.
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It is possible to castrate adult rams using bloodless castrators - you can do this yourself. The castrators are quite expensive, so probably best to find someone who has some and possibly they might even do it for you.
It works by cutting through the spermatic cord and blood vessels that supply the testicles., without breaking the skin. Because this is totally enclosed, there is very little risk of infection. You cut the chord in two different places on each side, just to make sure. The disruption to the blood supply causes the testicles to gradually shrivel up. You do have to keep an eye on them for swelling etc and check about 6 -8 weeks later to ensure that the testicles have shrivelled up and that the cords are still severed.
(http://www.viableselfsufficiency.co.uk/P1010062a.jpg)
Its still not very nice, but not as unpleasant as open castration.
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the last time i used a set of burdizos was at college the operator in the picture appears to be using them incorrectly if you goggle burdizos there is an interesting link to wikipedia :D :farmer:
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the operator in the picture appears to be using them incorrectly
I don't think so - can you say what you think is incorrect?
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the head is digging into the scrotum sack also from the wikipedia site it shows a 9 inch set i am presuming the 9 inch is the length the pliers should be turned round 90 degrees that way you are not causing unnecessary suffering if you are not using local anesthetic again from wikipedia the cords are wrapped in nerve endings :farmer:
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How many of you men are reading this with tightly crossed legs ;D ;D
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Because Wikipedia is so reliable!!!
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How many of you men are reading this with tightly crossed legs ;D ;D
I'M reading it with crossed legs in sympathy ;D
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no because of what i was taught at college :farmer:
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the head is digging into the scrotum sack also from the wikipedia site it shows a 9 inch set i am presuming the 9 inch is the length the pliers should be turned round 90 degrees that way you are not causing unnecessary suffering if you are not using local anesthetic again from wikipedia the cords are wrapped in nerve endings :farmer:
I used them as you seem to be describing, horizontally rather than vertically. The ones in that photo look to be a different arrangement, as I don't believe it would be possible to use the ones I have at that angle. The ones I have are more something like this:
http://www.premier1supplies.com/detail.php?prod_id=362&cat_id=13 (http://www.premier1supplies.com/detail.php?prod_id=362&cat_id=13)
You can only use them up to 90 days however.
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O O O O OH OH its just got to be sore just got to be no doubt about it OOOOH.
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As a user of 9" burdizos the picture looks fine to me, never used the type corrie dhu has but looks handy. The law is that over 3 month's of age only a vet can castrate and only under anesthetic
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the head is digging into the scrotum sack
Only the skin, the testicle is clearly below the head of the pliers. It is good practise to sever each cord on two places to ensure effective castration.
the pliers should be turned round 90 degrees
With this model of pliers that would not work. That would split the spermatic cord lengthways rather than cutting it across.
that way you are not causing unnecessary suffering
Not sure what you are getting at here.
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yes the head appears to be digging into the sack even if it is the skin that is if it has a wide head and not the narrow one shown by corrie dhu
rotated round 90 degrees in the operators hand
two crimps is the only effective way to do this form of castration on each cord
with the set of nuts that is pictured it is older than what is allowed to be castrated without local anesthetic :farmer:
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It is also worth pointing out that you have be be over the age of 17 to carry out castration by any method.
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What about vasectomising the rams rather than castrating? they could then be used as teasers to tighten up the lambing.
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Vasectomising is much more expensive and for best results you should use a proven ram. Also they wouldn't be recovered in time for this year.
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JMy advice would be to grow them on until Feb and then put them in the sale as cast rams. You should get a good price at that time of year.
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We vasectomised a couple of ram lambs and never had a problem with them.
They tightened our lambing times up and we can keep them together no problem. I have had a couple of people ask me where they could get teasers this year so it might be worth moving them on this way and at Wilton sheep fair a couple of years ago a teaser made as much as a shearling ram! more than paid for himself. Big farms still use teasers but i'm not sure if a ryeland would get bullied; i wouldn't think so but dont know much about their temperament.
It may be worth a try, just be sure they are left the allotted time for the old sperm to break down