The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Other => Topic started by: Rosemary on October 14, 2014, 09:53:52 am
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Can anyone recommend a book or website where I can learn the basics of keeping rabbits (for meat but I guess the basic information is the same)?
Thanks
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Rabbit welfare have all the basic info, diet, health, hutch size etc http://www.rabbitwelfare.co.uk/ (http://www.rabbitwelfare.co.uk/)
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Rabbit welfare have all the basic info, diet, health, hutch size etc http://www.rabbitwelfare.co.uk/ (http://www.rabbitwelfare.co.uk/)
Thank you :thumbsup:
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I am sure that there must be many good books and web sites that can help you here. My take on good care and producing a good product starts with breeding stock and having plenty of time. Sure you can buy in factory produced feed or you can grow excess veg, gather fresh wild plants, make your own hay and treat them to fruits. I reckon that our rabbits take up more time in terms of feeding and cleaning out their runs than does our chickens or ducks. They are fascinating animals especially when you investigate their physiology and behavioural traits and a good return on ones time if you are prepared to try the many receipts that use their meat. Good luck and hope you enjoy them us much as us. ( I actually have a batch that I must process and get into the freezer tomorrow so quite a timely post).
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Rosemary I have an old but very comprehensive book called Raising Rabbits by Ann Kanable you can have it if you like cheers Dougie.
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Rosemary I have an old but very comprehensive book called Raising Rabbits by Ann Kanable you can have it if you like cheers Dougie.
That would be good :thumbsup:
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We're thinking about having two does and a buck. As far as I can see, these need to be kept in individual hutches except when the doe goes to the buck (not the other way round). Or can the two does share except when gving birth?
We're planning to keep the young rabbits, from weaning to killing (about 5-6 weeks) in moveable cages on grass, the same way we keep meat chickens. This might not work over winter so we'd have to manage the timing of breeding to take account of that.
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british rabbit council is the first point of reference, they are very helpful and friendly. experts on advising on the keeping of multiple rabbits.
www.thebrc.org (http://www.thebrc.org)
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Ok I will post the book up to you enjoy.
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We're thinking about having two does and a buck. As far as I can see, these need to be kept in individual hutches except when the doe goes to the buck (not the other way round). Or can the two does share except when gving birth?
We're planning to keep the young rabbits, from weaning to killing (about 5-6 weeks) in moveable cages on grass, the same way we keep meat chickens. This might not work over winter so we'd have to manage the timing of breeding to take account of that.
Generally 2 entire does will fight, especially if hormones start flying round. They definitely won't be able to share when they have litters, although may be alright as youngsters. They are social animals despite that (!) so a split pen where they can see each other for some time each day might work.
Moveable cages on grass will work as long as you prepare for attempts to dig out, but also might be worth considering health from meeting wild rabbits.
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Might be worth contacting this person too :)
http://www.smallholder.co.uk/news/10586213.How_to_start_a_small_scale_rabbit_farm_on_your_smallholding/?ref=ms (http://www.smallholder.co.uk/news/10586213.How_to_start_a_small_scale_rabbit_farm_on_your_smallholding/?ref=ms)
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interesting programme on Radio 4 today about UK meat rabbits - the Food Programme.
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Just went to post but realised David c beat me to it.
Yes, do see if you can get today's programme on Iplayer Rosemary. There was quite a bit on how farmed rabbit is reared (it sounded quite horrific - worse than battery chickens TBH), and an interview with a young chap who was trying to set up his own rabbit farm. "So how many rabbits do you have at the moment?" asked the interviewer. "Er, seven" was his reply, "but I'm hoping to multiply that to a few thousand"! ;D
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Commercially farmed rabbit sounds horrendous which is why we thought we'd try a more welfare friendly route. Getting thoughts together and planning to start in the spring :thumbsup:
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Rosemary , I used to be the membership secretary of the British Commercial Rabbit Association . I spent three years researching rabbits and commercial meat production .
Blacks Scientific books used to do a good book on the subject . Cambridge university libraries were also a good source of info.
I also attended several veterinary orientated seminars about keeping rabbits healthy & was taken under the wing of a learned professor ( John Snowden??? ) who in the late 1960's was the UK's foremost authority on artificial insemination of commercial meat rabbits and show stock ( he's been dead for about 18 years ) and using rabbits for the at the time normal method of human being pregnancy testing.
Rabbits are diurnal they function happily inn the day or night . The stress easily and often die from stress related occasioned sicknesses.
I ran rabbits commercially for a while on thick gauge 3/4 inch electro galve mesh floored cages that were 2 x 2 x 18 inches tall , I didn't feel happy at putting my stock through the discomfort and cramped conditions. So I moved over as soon as I could afford it special home made 4 foot x 4 foot x 3 foot tall wire cages with slatted wooden floors ( 1/4 of an inch between the 2 inch wide slat platform with ( cleaned out weekly) barley straw on the platforms . Each doe also had a 15 x 15 x 15 inch cube nest box filled with a four inch layer of soft clean dry hay that had a 7 inch round hole four inches from the floor as this stops the suckling kits being dragged out the nest if the doe is startled or decided to come out the nest for food or drink .
When ready to kindle the doe strips fur off her reachable parts to line the basic nest so having a bald chested doe is not some thing to fear.
The does do not have normal fertile cycles like most mammals they have what is known as an oestrous which is basically that they get so excited by being in the presence of a randy buck & his rather energetic mating that the eggs in her become available for fertilization . A doe can reabsorb her pregnancy till about the 18th day if memory serves me correct . She can be post partum mated ( that's what happens in the wild ) and is highly fertile for three days after giving birth .
Post partum mating in herds or the domestic situation will shorten her productive life to about reasonable 9 litters after that pregnancies become a bit of hit and miss and frequently only issue one to three kits ..quite often when she is 14 month or older the last one on the way out will be so big it blocks her birth channel , it dies and she dies of blood ]poisoning .
The does usually only feed their young once a day and that tends to be in the early hours of the morning when they have digested their evening meal .
Things have drastically changed , you'll need to check out the RSPCA's " five freedoms " in farming stock to understand a few things about keeping live stock even for just keeping domestic food rabbits lest some person form a protection agency notices you .
Think carefully about how you will give them water especially in very hot or below minus 10 oC conditions.
I used to add a liquid vitamin to the drinker header tanks every three days because artificially feeding & watering rabbits does tend to leave out vital to health enhancing trace elements in their diets and water .
Do ignore the old wives tale about that says , " Rabbits don't need water " ... in the wild they get a lot of it from fresh greens and they also lick rain off plants or go quite often to the waters edge and take a drink at night .
Feeding .. what will you feed them ? Especially in winter when the grasses & other vegetation have lost the vast majority of their goodness & nutrients .
I use to feed a balanced chemist checked mix of rolled corns , chopped alfalfa , chopped hay soybean , biscuit and flaked peas .
When the company the company that made the formula up for me ceased trading I resorted to using Roger rabbit food in three tonne loads ,.which was a wee bit expensive but far better than a wasteful and unpalatable dry pelleted feed soaked in oils with added vitamins to keep the rabbits healthy .
The cages will need to be big enough to accommodate a large commercial doe which is say 2 feet long and able to reach up to 2 foot six tall when hopping or stretching .
So to my mind nowadays you'll be looking at a cage at least 4 foot by four foot by three foot six tall for the does and likely followers average number say seven kits till they are weanable at 7 or 8 weeks old . Then you'll need caging for M or F sexed groups of weaners .
By the time these weaners are 16 weeks or so old they, will not only be eating you out of house and home they will start feeling sexual urges and may well start fighting and biting amongst themselves. So it's best to have some provision for the fatteners & fryers in individual caging .
Rabbits are now supposed by animal welfare rules to be able to see their fellow kind and be able to communicate visually and audibly , so housing them in a common shed where they can see & hear each other can be useful. it also helps keep the rabbits warm and dry which in turn means that they have a far better food to meat conversion rate . Wet or damp rabbits suffer tremendous heat loss and are prone to sickness which is often fatal or easily spread through the rest of the stock .
Lights in the shed are useful during winter , though don't put them on auto dusk switches for that instantly attracts mozzies and other biting insects. I had a sealable two door walk through porch on each of our sheds with a large triple tube Insect-o -cuter fly killer just inside the main shed ( had to empty it about every five days )
I also vaccinated against Myxi for not only were does going to be a loss if I got struck with bit my stock bucks worth several thousand of pounds would have also been wiped out.
Your cages will need to be quite large and definitely fox proof if out doors as well as protected at all times from gnats & midges as these spread calci virus / Residual Hemaroghaic ( sp?) Disease via their bites , along with Myxi .
Rabbit fleas from wild rabbits or rabbit fleas off cats also spread the diseases so keep any moggies away from the rabbits.
Run the rabbits on deep bed barley straw if you can get it . Don't keep the two does in the same cage for they tend to take false pregnancies and also start fighting due to frustration at not being mated especially if they can smell the buck .... who pees all over the place and rubs his face in it to show how manly he is to his ladies.
There is a lot more I can add , I've put a lot inn the rabbits sub section a long while ago ,I have to stop now for I'm on notice to go out on the school run.
Let me know what you think of what I've put Rosemary .
Anyone else ..... Please feel free to give me some feed back so I can bring my mind a bit closer to the subject once again.
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Hmm, useful stuff. Thanks for this. :thumbsup: :thinking:
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Rosemary, I've been playing on the rabbit theme again & It crossed my mind to tell you about the Mordant rabbit hutch
It is a long prismatic shape with the nest /shelter at one end
As it is triangular the three sides save quite a lot money & effort by using less materials .
The floor is also made of wire usually a thick 40 mm galv mesh , it stops dig out and stops fox in though ferrets & rats can some times succeed .
as it is a triangle it's easy to fit two log stretcher type handles either as a set screwed on for each cage or one set for several cages if you make & put a simple upside down hook to lift them by .
Again because of it being a triangle it's easy to hinge one side along the half high level so you can get access to the run , same with the house end . Do make the nest box idea inthe house end for rabbits suffer tremebndously if they get wet fur and can't hinker down nice & snug to dry out.
in winter the nutirions and vitamins of the grass decline as soon as we start to move on from summer right into the spring growth perios so you will need to supplement the grass fees omne way or anothe .
Giving a very varied diet helps keep them really healthy. One thing all the meat rabbits I had as a kid ( I sold them to neighbours ) loved was oven dried potato & carrot peelings & frozen ( cut off with an axe) Brussels sprout stalks in the deepest of trhe harsh winter we had from October to March in the early 1960's .
They not only nest in hay & barley straw they love to nibble it to help keep their teeth down same with up to 3 inch thick chunks of apple wood branches .
The hay & straw also helps their food system work well for they need it to make the correct fecal pellet , which they eat neat , direct from their anus to keep re-infecting their gut with cellulose breaking down bacteria. ( cocotrophy [ SP ??] )
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They're quite fascinating things, rabbits, aren't they :)
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Oh , one thing to be careful of is rabbit pox or syphilis if you get it be brutal in hygene & culling & don't get stock for those suppliers again .
Missed it will wipe your herd out and cost you money .
In the buck he is " off his task " , often has a darkish raspberry sort of coloured penis instead of the normal light pink & it often looks to have several tiny greyish spider web type lines of colour where the flesh cracks open .
In the doe it is like a dark split raspberry again with the spider web sign in evidence from about day four , the vagina is puffy /inflamed .
It was always our golden rule no matter what else happened that any new stock brought in was quarantined in a separate rabbit shed ( old concrete garage well away from the other rabbits ) for at least 14 days . Each rabbit being carefully checked over every other day .
The bucks and does in the meat production sheds were always checked over in good electric lighting at every mating session . In one shed we found evidence of the buck having the pox so culled & cremated him
Five does he'd serviced also had to go the same way . Everything they had had contact with was taken out the shed & submerged into a big tank of " Virkon S disinfectant " for 1/2 an hour, before being power washed off , then sprayed with fresh Virkon S and left to dry before being put back into use .
We think that how it occurred was from mosquitos coming into the shed at night with us when we did the mating as some nights you had to fight your way through the bloody things.
The insect -o-cutor took care of most of them when the lights were turned off .
As a precaution against further incidents of the pox we used to take a large aerosol of fly spray with us to the sheds on calm nights and give a quick 2 second burst of spray by the door , having held our breath whilst doing it and going in through the door .
It seems that the mozzies followed our scents from the house when they were disturbed by the PIR flood lights or the C O2 in our breath . For on exiting the sheds we only seemed to picked up the mozzies about half way ( 80 mtrs from the sheds ) on the way back to the house, as we passed the veg beds & back in to the house via the cellar rooms door so we could de- mozzie ourselves before getting out the work gear & entering the living area.
Rabbits mate better in the mid evening around 21.00 hrs. or if you have time clock set enforced lighting system in the darkness period .