The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Goats => Topic started by: Carl f k on September 25, 2012, 08:32:19 pm
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I have been reading up on all kinds of goaty stuff and see that some people milk once a day and some twice but no one giving any reasons.. Can anyone fill me in please??
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Its dependent on how much milk your goat is giving IMO. Currently Savannah (our maiden, ie. never had kids) is milked twice a day. She was up to 9 pints but now about 6 pints a day. When she drops more we will hopefully get onto once daily milking.
Puffin was only once a day because her kid was feeding from her same time :)
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Ok.
I milk once a day because it suits how I live - both work and goats.
I leave the kids on all the time until they're 3-4 months old. Then when I feel they're big enough, I separate them from mum at night (just the other side of a wire mesh partition). I milk in the morning then leave the kids with mum all day.
I like them being with their mums in the day and since I can work anything from 9 to 14 hour days, I can't rely on a regular evening milking time, whereas I can with the morning milk.
There's only me now, so I don't need gallons of milk. And if I need an overnight away, whoever comes to feed for me, doesn't have to milk as I just leave the kids with mum overnight too (doesn't work once kids have gone to new homes but that's never til 6 months or so).
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Hi Carl,
We milk twice a day, but this is because we take the kids away from their mums and we milk mums twice a day and hen bottle feed the kids. It means more work for us, but it means we can monitor completely not just how much milk a goat is giving, but also how much milk a kid is drinking.
It might sound cruel to take the kids away from their mums, but in actual fact you would be surprised how many of the mums would rather we do the looking after!
Kids can often prefer drinking from one side of the udder, and end up leaving their mums udder lopsided, which we don't want as we show our goats.
Beth
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I'm milking twice a day at the moment as you do get slightly more that way. The yield drops in the winter so I will probably go onto once a day then. When it starts to increase in the spring, it will be back to twice daily. I don't expect next summer's yield to be as good as this years.
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I usualy milk twice a day 12 hrs between milking but I have just dropped down to once a day as the milk has dropped so the highest milker is only giving 6 pts a day
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Sokel, isn't six pints rather a lot for her to hold onto for twenty four hours? I'm milking twice a day and getting four pints a day. I won't go down to once a day unless she drops to two pints daily.
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6pints is a fair bit to hold onto for 24 hours. But- if a goat is giving 6-7 litres it'll be producing 6 pints in 12 hours anyway. It maybe depends how heavy a milker she is. We drop them to once a day milking once they go consistently below 1.5litres at one milking, so I guess that's 2-3 pints roughly, and 4-5 pints in a whole day.
Beth
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When she was milking heavy she was giving 18 pints a day 9 pints at each milking. With 6 pints she is still soft
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6pints is a fair bit to hold onto for 24 hours. But- if a goat is giving 6-7 litres it'll be producing 6 pints in 12 hours anyway. It maybe depends how heavy a milker she is. We drop them to once a day milking once they go consistently below 1.5litres at one milking, so I guess that's 2-3 pints roughly, and 4-5 pints in a whole day.
Beth
Based on this I've just put Savannah onto once daily milking!! I love you Beth lol!!! oh its so liberating to be freed up at morning school run time :thumbsup:
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When she was milking heavy she was giving 18 pints a day 9 pints at each milking. With 6 pints she is still soft
What are you doing with all that milk btw? And she must need a fair bit of grub to maintain that production... Are you hand-milking her? My hands would never do that quantitiy regularly...
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She was on dairy nuts 18% , golden calf coarse mix 18% , whole oats, sugarbeet shreds , a handfull of alfalfa and various fruit and veg twice a day and unlimited hay this was for the season after she had kidded and she has slowly dropped. her kids are now 17 months old and one of her daughters is a maiden milker giving just under 5 pints a day .
yes we are milking by hand even though we have a machine.
when she was in peak yield there was 2 of us milking but there is only myself now after an accident involving a broken hip ::)
Ohh and the milk we use it ourselves and the dogs get some every day then a farmer friend is rearing calves on it in return for hay
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Wowee! just out of interest, what breed is she? and don't your hands and wrists hurt? I'm struggling with just Savannah to milk and she produces less than your girl, i have to get the children to take over for a few minutes half way as i'm in pain.
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She was on dairy nuts 18% , golden calf coarse mix 18% , whole oats, sugarbeet shreds , a handfull of alfalfa and various fruit and veg twice a day and unlimited hay this was for the season after she had kidded and she has slowly dropped. her kids are now 17 months old and one of her daughters is a maiden milker giving just under 5 pints a day .
yes we are milking by hand even though we have a machine.
when she was in peak yield there was 2 of us milking but there is only myself now after an accident involving a broken hip ::)
Ohh and the milk we use it ourselves and the dogs get some every day then a farmer friend is rearing calves on it in return for hay
I am impressed :thumbsup: . Good arrangement for rearing calves on it, I use my extra for the pigs and the pork ir really tender! (But I do not have 18 pints from one goat per day...) My top milker, a HB BT type nanny gave 8 litres at her peak last summer, but then got mastitis :( a few times, still milking 3ltrs now though, and she did make 1560 kgs for the year! Going to get her mated again this autumn.
But I do feel for your wrists and fingers!
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I had been wondering about reducing to once-a-day with both of mine as they are only giving about half a pint each at evening milking now. Do I just stop, or is there some gradual process I should follow?
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We have 5 milking and TBH my hands are starting to ache by the time I get number 4 finished but its a couple of hours later that I really feel the pain ! I start with the main milker and work my way down so that as my hands start to ache I have less milking left to do ::)
She is a BT from milking lines and her maiden milking daughter is BT x BS again Milking/show lines
CW if they are only giving half a pint on a night I would just stop the night time milking
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She was on dairy nuts 18% , golden calf coarse mix 18% , whole oats, sugarbeet shreds , a handfull of alfalfa and various fruit and veg twice a day and unlimited hay this was for the season after she had kidded and she has slowly dropped. her kids are now 17 months old and one of her daughters is a maiden milker giving just under 5 pints a day .
yes we are milking by hand even though we have a machine.
when she was in peak yield there was 2 of us milking but there is only myself now after an accident involving a broken hip ::)
Ohh and the milk we use it ourselves and the dogs get some every day then a farmer friend is rearing calves on it in return for hay
I am impressed :thumbsup: . Good arrangement for rearing calves on it, I use my extra for the pigs and the pork ir really tender! (But I do not have 18 pints from one goat per day...) My top milker, a HB BT type nanny gave 8 litres at her peak last summer, but then got mastitis :( a few times, still milking 3ltrs now though, and she did make 1560 kgs for the year! Going to get her mated again this autumn.
But I do feel for your wrists and fingers! There's another question I ask myself??? Mastitis.. How do you know they hav it?? Sorry for the questions but if you don't ask you don't learn
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Mastitis - (usually bacterial) inflammation of the udder, most likely bacteria enter through the teat. Signs are: hot udder (generally just one half/quarter), goat uncomfortable at milking, kicks etc, milk will also not go through the filter easily, it has some more solids in... milk yield reduced. Treated with antibiotic, best given as intramuscular injection. First course usually 5 days of Pen & Strep, if not better, bacterial cultures will have to be raised to determine strain of bacteria causing problems and specific antibiotic to be used. (That's when goat keeping gets expensive! :o ).
I have never had anything more than subclinical mastitis, which you usually detect if you are milking twice a day. More difficult if nanny only has her kids on and you don't touch the udder regularly.
Milk withdrawal times apply.
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Mastitis - (usually bacterial) inflammation of the udder, most likely bacteria enter through the teat. Signs are: hot udder (generally just one half/quarter), goat uncomfortable at milking, kicks etc, milk will also not go through the filter easily, it has some more solids in... milk yield reduced. Treated with antibiotic, best given as intramuscular injection. First course usually 5 days of Pen & Strep, if not better, bacterial cultures will have to be raised to determine strain of bacteria causing problems and specific antibiotic to be used. (That's when goat keeping gets expensive! :o ).
I have never had anything more than subclinical mastitis, which you usually detect if you are milking twice a day. More difficult if nanny only has her kids on and you don't touch the udder regularly.
Milk withdrawal times apply.
thanks Anke another question answered :D
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Can I come in with a couple of questions here - was thinking about getting a milking goat but
a) It sounds like it may get a hassle / mastitis / health issues ?
b) ...and I'm going to sound really stupid here, but Plumseverywhere says she is milking her 'maiden' milker which has never had kids - don't they have to have offspring before they get milk? (sorry for being stupid)
:eyelashes:
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My understanding is that goats from very good milking lines can come into milk as 'maidens' without mating/kidding. This is what's happened with Savannah. It couldnt' have happened at a better time though as my other nanny died a few months after I set my soap business up !! huge panic (as well as being obviously distraught) and all of a sudden Savannah developed an udder....(cue angelic music and glittery visions...this was nothing short of a miracle!)
She's done it every spring since.
We have never (touch wood) had mastitis out of the 3 goats who were milking. In fact the only thing I would say about having a milker is 1)make sure you can milk before she arrives. 2) know what to look out for but don't worry unduly 3) know what you will do with the milk before hand or at least have some ideas ;) the quantity will surprise you! and 4) be prepared to have a goat sitter so you can have holidays.
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Can I come in with a couple of questions here - was thinking about getting a milking goat but
a) It sounds like it may get a hassle / mastitis / health issues ?
b) ...and I'm going to sound really stupid here, but Plumseverywhere says she is milking her 'maiden' milker which has never had kids - don't they have to have offspring before they get milk? (sorry for being stupid)
:eyelashes:
I think its more good luck than anything but I have never had a goat with mastitis.
most goats do have to be kidded before they produce milk but from time to time you get a maiden milker, this is the first one we have had in all the years we have kept goats
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Oh I see! That was something I didn't know! So is it down to luck or breeding do you think? Did you just see an udder Plums and thought you'd give her a go and hey presto! You must have been thanking your lucky stars at that time!!
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Goats from from very heavy milking lines are most inclined to come into milk as a "maiden", and even then not every single one from good milking lines actually come into milk. It can be managed on some goats, ie making sure they don't get protein in the summer months. It's always more likely to happen in the summer, as there are long daylight hours, and rich grass to eat.
Some breeds are far less likely to become maiden milkers- Anglo-Nubian's and Golden Guernsey's for example.
Beth
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18 pints a day. I am amazed. I thought my first girl did well producing 8 pints a day. Her daughter has only ever given four and a half pints once she had weaned her kid. She's now down to three a day and is due to be mated this autumn.
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Both my goatllings are from a high yielding BS line, they started developing udders and the billys owner told me to try and avoid having to milk them, so they don't get much concentrate, just a small handful of coarse mix to keep them happy when I feed the mums. I was told they could stop developing properly, they did have cute little udders, but I resisted the temptation and their udders never got too big and hard, the girls are now a good size and I'm looking forward to see how they do next year with babies.
One milker I've dropped to once a day, she's dropped to about 1/2 litre, the other is still on twice a day, but I'm needing the milk for a couple of lambs, and the house.
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Oh I see! That was something I didn't know! So is it down to luck or breeding do you think? Did you just see an udder Plums and thought you'd give her a go and hey presto! You must have been thanking your lucky stars at that time!!
Literally that GP. I sought advice and we did all we could to NOT milk her as she was still so young but that udder just got huger and huger and Puffin's breeder came over and said to me "err, Savannah is adamant she's going to give you milk, you've got to just milk her..." The rest, as they say, is history ;)
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I have heared of one maiden thats milked through for 8 years without kidding .
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Really? that's good to hear. Savannah's quite happy being milked and she's in really good health too (that's her in my profile pic). I was going to put a post on here about perhaps kidding from her one year in order to try and get a doe to keep in case her daughter is also a maiden (I will admit that with our very hectic family life, not kidding every year but still having milk is just the ideal for me)
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Can I come in with a couple of questions here - was thinking about getting a milking goat but
a) It sounds like it may get a hassle / mastitis / health issues ?
:eyelashes:
I think mastitis is more of an issue for a) high-yielding milkers and b) influenced by externla factors like stress (mine did develop it just after a show) and hygiene in the pens (Skyee is one of these goats that doesn't bother to do her business away from where she sleeeps :-[ ...and so her backend needs regular shampooing..). I now teat-dip religiously (a weak solution of Capritect solution onto the teats straight after milking), and also top-up with bedding every other day. We have not had it this year at all (so far.. :relief: ).
Also if you milk them every day you touch the udder all the time and you will know much quicker. I really wouldn't worry about it.
PS.: You are welcome to come down and learn to milk here... I now have two milkers on the go for the whole year...
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Thank you Anke, if you are at 'the show' on Sunday I will try and catch you - that would be great to see actually if that's ok I would love that, I'll pm you if I don't catch you. It's a commitment I know to keep a milker, so am taking that notion through the winter months before I do anything about it, don't want to be fickle. At the moment it feels like the next step in goat keeping.
Another question - does it make financial sense to keep a milker - understanding of course that there will have to be equipment bought to make the dairy goods after, cheese, yoghurt, ice cream etc. In theory it sounds good - price of feeding a family is just horrid these days - and I have had several people saying they would buy it to feed their pets, livestock. Do you need an extra fridge / freezer - is the kitchen big enough to do the routine etc?
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Everything gets done in my kitchen GP - soap making/cheese making/ filtering the milk into bottles etc.
I do have an extra freezer because I keep enough milk frozen to go over winter for soap reasons mainly but also for if I can dry Vanna off and give her a rest.
I think it makes financial sense from a smallholding perspective - especially if you can make your own hay. The outlay is infrequent when it comes to vaccinations (good if you can share, although you have sheep so you will already have what you need). I once did the sums (prior to setting up the soap business) and found that once all concentrates and drugs were covered we saved something along the lines of £30 per week (family of 7) on milk/cheese etc. No idea how it equates now. You can improvise with a lot of the equipment - eg a thermos to make yoghurt/tins of baked beans to make a cheese press/you don't need an icecream maker as you can just stir icecream yourself a few times between freezing :) Ebay and car boot fairs are your friend :thumbsup:
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My sister worked out she would save I think £12 a week on milk alone by having her own goats! Family of six and the children do drink a lot of milk. Roll on November when the goats "move house"
Beth
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Our milk bills are about £50 per month and a block of cheese is nearly £5 (bloomin' outrageous is cheese!) and we go through at least 1 per week do that's around £70 per month total. Don't know if I can beat Mackies Ice Cream but we buy 4 tubs which does us a month so there must be a saving there, at least periodically.
Anyone know a good book on dairying ?- I bought one a while ago but its a bit American/lifestyleee type for me, would like something a bit less about the person who has written it, more practical.
Oh sorry Carl fk, it's just occurred to me I've hijacked your thread.... apologies :eyelashes:
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You want to get in touch with Jean Brown in Leics she used to write quite a few cheese pamflets as well as other goat products
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Our milk bills are about £50 per month and a block of cheese is nearly £5 (bloomin' outrageous is cheese!) and we go through at least 1 per week do that's around £70 per month total. Don't know if I can beat Mackies Ice Cream but we buy 4 tubs which does us a month so there must be a saving there, at least periodically.
Anyone know a good book on dairying ?- I bought one a while ago but its a bit American/lifestyleee type for me, would like something a bit less about the person who has written it, more practical.
Oh sorry Carl fk, it's just occurred to me I've hijacked your thread.... apologies :eyelashes:
thats ok we all learning somthin new :wave: :goat:
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Update to my query about changing to once-a-day now my GGs are down to half a pint in the evening - well, I decided to stop yesterday and they both gave a fraction more than usual this morning but their udders were perfectly comfortable and not at all huge-looking. I'm really glad this topic came up as I had been wondering whether it was worth the time/water/steriliser/effort etc to clean the machine for a pint at a time. Thank you for the advice and, because of that, the confidence to make the change!
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Glad it worked for you country woman :thumbsup:
Savannah protested quite vocally about her missed milking yesterday. She was quite full by evening but only gave me 4 pints (in 24 hours), my hands hurt so much though as her udder was tight - we are back onto twice daily.
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Plums you say you can dry Vanna off?? Does that mean stop milking her? And will she have to have a kid to start again?? Bet u fed up with all my questions :innocent:
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Hi GP - re financial sense of having a milking gooat...
IMO it is not possible to even compare the shop-bought "white stuff" to the fresh, unpasteurised and non-homogenised milk you are producing yourself. I have never calculated up how much money we may be saving (or maybe not), but the cream and ice cream are so much nicer than anything you can by in the shop - even Mackies! :o
I don't have a separate "milk" fridge/freezer, we do use a cream separator, I make lots of cheeses and have made soap in the past too, piggies or orphan lambs get any surplus not needed in the house (actually in April we can be a bit short on home-produced milk... but only means no cheese making for a few weeks).