The Accidental Smallholder Forum

Growing => Gardens => Topic started by: chairmanphil on February 24, 2012, 09:13:40 am

Title: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on February 24, 2012, 09:13:40 am
i am just about to build an extensive set of these beds and wondered if anyone else has had a go with it?

http://permaculture.org.au/2012/01/04/hugelkultur-composting-whole-trees-with-ease/ (http://permaculture.org.au/2012/01/04/hugelkultur-composting-whole-trees-with-ease/)

and this is the start of mine;

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone006-7.jpg)
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: anderso on February 24, 2012, 03:43:13 pm
I have a load of branch cuttings left over from the winter logging - so I will give this a go - always looking for ways to d things with out to much work --- will let you know how it progress.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on February 24, 2012, 04:38:27 pm
I have a load of branch cuttings left over from the winter logging - so I will give this a go - always looking for ways to d things with out to much work --- will let you know how it progress.

good work, says that fresh wood takes a little longer to break down so add some good rotten willow to it to get the right creatures and fungus in the kultur!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on February 24, 2012, 05:13:18 pm
good info ta :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on February 25, 2012, 09:30:11 am
we are going to do loads of work on the beds today so i will take some pics as it unfolds. should be a good day.  :hshoe:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on February 25, 2012, 06:11:35 pm
we have done so much to them. got loads of pics but going to have a cider and a bite of curry first! what a fine day it was.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on February 25, 2012, 08:46:01 pm
so here are some pics of the days work,

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone006-9.jpg)

the raw materials

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone007-9.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone011-5.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone015-2.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone020-1.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone022-1.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone026.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone027.jpg)

there are others of it later in the day on another phone because mine ran out of battery!  ::)
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on February 26, 2012, 10:24:07 pm
here is where we are now, getting a tonne of top soil next week and finish the job at the weekend.

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone003-8.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone001-9.jpg)
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: Fleecewife on February 26, 2012, 10:29:20 pm
I shall be following this whole experiment with great interest  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on February 26, 2012, 11:05:15 pm
I shall be following this whole experiment with great interest  :thumbsup:

me too!  :D
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: knightquest on February 27, 2012, 09:13:44 pm
Really interested in this.
I've just got a load of guinea pig poo mixed with straw..............Could this be used to cover the logs? Sorry to ask this question without doing proper research but I'm too eager to ask and not read  ;D ;D

Ian
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on February 27, 2012, 09:28:51 pm
Really interested in this.
I've just got a load of guinea pig poo mixed with straw..............Could this be used to cover the logs? Sorry to ask this question without doing proper research but I'm too eager to ask and not read  ;D ;D

Ian

yeah poo is good as it has loads of nitrogen in it. and straw is very good for the kultur.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: knightquest on February 27, 2012, 10:59:41 pm
Thanks Chairman  :thumbsup:

Ian
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on February 27, 2012, 11:04:11 pm
Thanks Chairman  :thumbsup:

Ian

anytime mate.  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: darkbrowneggs on February 27, 2012, 11:09:54 pm
Very interesting -  Thanks  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on February 27, 2012, 11:22:33 pm
Very interesting -  Thanks  :thumbsup:

i'm going round all the farmers and asking if we can take all the rotting willow out of the streams for them to build the back hugel bank! the older the wood the quicker the kultur develops
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 01, 2012, 06:04:10 pm
getting a tonne of top soil tomorrow, if the rain stays off the first 2 beds will be finished saturday.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on March 01, 2012, 08:40:28 pm
i think this is a really interesting method. but have trouble with the nitrogen robbery to start with, how long do you think those logs will take to rot down, i reckon 3 years minimum.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 01, 2012, 09:20:14 pm
i think this is a really interesting method. but have trouble with the nitrogen robbery to start with, how long do you think those logs will take to rot down, i reckon 3 years minimum.

the wood i am using on these first ones are deciduous Lime which if left damp for anytime just rot away very quickly and the apple wood i have put in is 5 years dead so i am hoping with some queensland blue pumpkins this summer/autumn will knock the lime about a bit! i am getting loads of wood sorted now from the hedgerows and field sides which is nearly all willow. i am going to build this stage over the summer and seal in september and see what we have next year. the main reason i started this is i have about 10 tonne of lime and lime wood chips on my neighbors field which he wants me to move so i thought i would try this and it has just gathered pace from there. i own the land and am there for the foreseeable future so even if it does take time i am ok with that. i started working on the plot in 2008 and have cut down 59 trees which has transformed the site. they were mainly llaylandii or however you spell it. no good for the kultur, but the limes and beech i think will go well and are already well seasoned and a little rotten in places.   

this is what the same site looked like 4 years ago

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/Milton%20Evolution/1294.jpg)

and 2 days ago

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone018-2.jpg)

the green house is the point of reference as in the first shot you cannot see the shed!   :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on March 01, 2012, 09:36:40 pm
my land is similar, im on the edge of 100acres of woodland, ive cleared loads so far and have a lovely old lime at the end of the plot, i knew it didnt burn but i didnt know it rotted so quick, ta for that.  i do think the more nitrogen supplied the better, loads of chicken manure or something to get it going. the squash should love it
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 01, 2012, 09:39:09 pm
my land is similar, im on the edge of 100acres of woodland, ive cleared loads so far and have a lovely old lime at the end of the plot, i knew it didnt burn but i didnt know it rotted so quick, ta for that.  i do think the more nitrogen supplied the better, loads of chicken manure or something to get it going. the squash should love it

where are ya?
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on March 01, 2012, 09:43:53 pm
its on my profile or the member map above i think?
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 01, 2012, 09:56:30 pm
its on my profile or the member map above i think?

roughly?
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on March 01, 2012, 09:57:39 pm
near truro cornwall.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 01, 2012, 09:59:08 pm
near truro cornwall.

i know people in Kelly Brae near Callington, not just down the road eh?
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on March 01, 2012, 10:05:36 pm
hes not called pete is he ;)
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 01, 2012, 10:06:29 pm
hes not called pete is he ;)

nah, he is a Frank or a Dorri  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on March 01, 2012, 10:09:43 pm
nah dont know him :D
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 02, 2012, 09:26:15 am
get the top soil today, but not going to close the beds without some fresh grass clippings over the top. also it looks like it is going to be wet over the weekend and Oxfordshire clay is not to be under estimated! keep ya all posted!  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 02, 2012, 07:23:10 pm
soil dumped and very nice it is too! will take some pics tomorrow it was getting a little dark this evening.  ;D
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 04, 2012, 01:14:33 pm
just been to see a neighbour and asked about rotten willow. he says come with me and takes round the back and there is about 10 tonnes of 15 year old willow logs completely rotted! you can have the lot he says and that 6 tonne of horse muck! so it has been a very good day so far!  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: knightquest on March 05, 2012, 05:49:04 pm
Nice!  :thumbsup:

Ian
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 11, 2012, 08:18:18 pm
getting a tonne of grass clippings off a mate next week so should be able to seal the first beds soon!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 24, 2012, 08:44:53 pm
nothing been going on with this for some time but made up for it today!

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone005-11.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone006-11.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone007-12.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone011-8.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone012-7.jpg)

so now it is a case of letting it settle for a week get a few more grass clippings on in that time and then cover with soil.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: clydesdaleclopper on March 25, 2012, 10:43:00 pm
Make sure you get it planted up as quickly as possible and it will help to stabilise the beds. Its a good idea to use nitrogen fixers in the first year of a hugel bed and if you don't know what was previously grown in the top soil that you have imported then you might want to use an innoculant to ensure that the nitrogen fixing bacteria are present.

I think hugel beds are great and one of my 4 year old's many talents is spotting rotten logs  ;D
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 25, 2012, 11:20:25 pm
Make sure you get it planted up as quickly as possible and it will help to stabilise the beds. Its a good idea to use nitrogen fixers in the first year of a hugel bed and if you don't know what was previously grown in the top soil that you have imported then you might want to use an innoculant to ensure that the nitrogen fixing bacteria are present.

I think hugel beds are great and one of my 4 year old's many talents is spotting rotten logs  ;D

what is a nitrogen fixer? as for the top soil it has been screened and had some compost and sand added. it comes from a quarry in farringdon. as the cut in the have tonnes of top soil to sell. so it had grass on it before i got it.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: clydesdaleclopper on March 25, 2012, 11:48:15 pm

what is a nitrogen fixer? as for the top soil it has been screened and had some compost and sand added. it comes from a quarry in farringdon. as the cut in the have tonnes of top soil to sell. so it had grass on it before i got it.

They have nodules that form on the roots that fix atmospheric nitrogen and this becomes available to other plants when they are cut down and the roots die.  Legumes such as peas and beans are the main type of nitrogen fixers that most vegetable gardeners are familiar with.  There is a useful list here http://www.tcpermaculture.blogspot.co.uk/2011/05/plants-nitrogen-fixers.html (http://www.tcpermaculture.blogspot.co.uk/2011/05/plants-nitrogen-fixers.html) of different nitrogen fixing plants that are suitable for temperate climates.

If the soil was growing grass before then it is unlikely to contain the rhizobium bacteria that are necessary for legumes to fix nitrogen unless the grass also contained clover.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 27, 2012, 08:15:19 pm
i am going to just see what happens if it is just left to do its thing for this experiment, will plant it with peas and beans with a couple of pumpkins. it is using logs that were not rotten but had been seasoned for 3 years and most of it is Lime which breaks down very quickly if it is wet. i had about 10 tonnes of wood on the farmers field like he said i could. but now he wants to be able to turn his combine round on this land and wants the logs and wood chips gone by harvest. this is why i am doing the hugels. just thought it would work with the lime very well. we shall see! i have got about 6 single cab hilux pickup loads of powder rotten willow i can pickup anytime and am going to set about a massive back bed running the whole south facing span. this is about 60 meters and will make a great place to put the beech leaves from the avenue and i can blag 10 or so bales at harvest for being a good boy and getting it all clear! this is the plan anyway!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: YorkshireLass on March 28, 2012, 09:04:28 pm
This looks fascinating.... I have taken inspiration and layered up a load of twiggy brash with some manure and grass clippings, and shovelled topsoil over it. It's about 1x2m and1m high. I'm thinking a squash plant or two - but should I throw some clover seeds on to fix nitrogen? By volume there is more "twig" than manure/straw/grass.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: clydesdaleclopper on March 28, 2012, 09:08:48 pm
This looks fascinating.... I have taken inspiration and layered up a load of twiggy brash with some manure and grass clippings, and shovelled topsoil over it. It's about 1x2m and1m high. I'm thinking a squash plant or two - but should I throw some clover seeds on to fix nitrogen? By volume there is more "twig" than manure/straw/grass.

The more twig the better - it will last longer  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 28, 2012, 09:27:19 pm
This looks fascinating.... I have taken inspiration and layered up a load of twiggy brash with some manure and grass clippings, and shovelled topsoil over it. It's about 1x2m and1m high. I'm thinking a squash plant or two - but should I throw some clover seeds on to fix nitrogen? By volume there is more "twig" than manure/straw/grass.

sounds like a good combo, will be very interesting to see the different results. what kind of twigs are you using Yorkshire Lass?
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: YorkshireLass on March 28, 2012, 09:57:47 pm
This looks fascinating.... I have taken inspiration and layered up a load of twiggy brash with some manure and grass clippings, and shovelled topsoil over it. It's about 1x2m and1m high. I'm thinking a squash plant or two - but should I throw some clover seeds on to fix nitrogen? By volume there is more "twig" than manure/straw/grass.

sounds like a good combo, will be very interesting to see the different results. what kind of twigs are you using Yorkshire Lass?

Um.
Things I butchered last autumn.....a fair bit of ornamental quince, some rose, some willow, some fuschia. Before burying in manure I noticed the twigs had mainly dried so I stomped on the pile to break them up a bit. In the pic, the twigs are in the left corner and you can just see the muck pile on the right.

Edit - I did remove the cardboard and bin bag!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 28, 2012, 10:10:17 pm
should be a goodun then  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: Mel on March 29, 2012, 11:30:27 am
Thank you Chairman,love this idea and we are going to make a start! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 29, 2012, 12:32:20 pm
Thank you Chairman,love this idea and we are going to make a start! :thumbsup:

taking off all over, couple of lads this way are just going to do the same thing!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: Mel on March 31, 2012, 08:49:04 pm
Started ours today,cleared out the old strawberry patch which is some 15ft x 7ft,then dug a trench down the centre,the ground is awful hence this used to be a raised bed and there are lots of bricks or builders rubble.

We cleared the trench area and put ground cover down either side as are going to put a small path either side and the rubbly areas are stricken with twitch,nettles and docks which would take us a week to get out! :-\

Luckily we have a woods just out of the village so we went and picked up some large rotting chunks and trunks  to place within the trench,this brought it up to some three and a half feet :D ,I finished off this evening by filling in the gaps with barrow loads of wood chip/mulch which I get from a local farmer,£10.00 a tonne bag-or in the last case two extra large joints of free range pork for 5 tonnes plus a tenner!

This wood chip mulch is cheap because it has been in the sacks for a while,it stinks of loveliness and has mushrooms growing from it ;D .Tomorrow hopefully the grass is being cut so shall rake all of this up,plus all the old hay/leaves from the winter and such-is this right Chairman? and put it on top.then i shall cover with all the topsoil which was the old strawberry bed,we have about 2 tonnes of it so should do the job?!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 31, 2012, 09:01:51 pm
sounds like jobs a goodun! well done. got any pics?
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: Mel on March 31, 2012, 09:31:04 pm
sounds like jobs a goodun! well done. got any pics?
Hope it is reasonable enough!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on March 31, 2012, 10:19:19 pm
that all looks very good to me. but i am in at the deep end myself! will be interesting to see what we think this time next year! nice one kidda!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: clydesdaleclopper on April 02, 2012, 12:23:24 pm
Leghorn - bear in mind that wood chip rots much faster than the solid logs and will draw down more noitrogen as a result. You will need to compensate for this. Looks fab btw  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: Mel on April 02, 2012, 12:37:08 pm
Leghorn - bear in mind that wood chip rots much faster than the solid logs and will draw down more noitrogen as a result. You will need to compensate for this. Looks fab btw  :thumbsup:
Hi,what would you propose? I was going to add grass cuttings and or straw? prior to covering with soil,I had even though of the use of the turf? Any suggestions would be very welcome please!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 02, 2012, 03:03:01 pm
i covered my logs with wood chips, straw, beech leaves, 2 years worth of compost that is about 3-4 years old and grass clippings. going to cover it in top soil this weekend and put the broad beans and peas on top as clydes says to fix the nitrogen theft. but as it says in the first post it will all break down in the end. it all depends how quickly you want it to be very productive. i have all the time in the world and needed to shift the logs and chips. the next lot will be a very different construction with lots of rotten willow going into the heart of it. as people visit it is the centre point of the garden. they just are drawn to them, want to know what they are and how they work. can't wait to see what pumpkins we get off them next year!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: clydesdaleclopper on April 02, 2012, 05:56:58 pm
Leghorn - bear in mind that wood chip rots much faster than the solid logs and will draw down more noitrogen as a result. You will need to compensate for this. Looks fab btw  :thumbsup:
Hi,what would you propose? I was going to add grass cuttings and or straw? prior to covering with soil,I had even though of the use of the turf? Any suggestions would be very welcome please!

sow it with nitrogen fixers and for your other plantings for the first couple of years don't plant anything that is too nitrogen hungry. Hoof and Horn is also high nitrogen - maybe ask some horsey people for the trimmings when the farrier has been and grind them up a bit.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on April 02, 2012, 07:03:14 pm
 hair and feathers are high in nitrogen, and blood is too.
i would be adding serious amounts of nitrogen if you intend using this kind of bed in the next 3 years, but ive no doubt that it will be amazing soil when finished.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: Mel on April 02, 2012, 09:59:56 pm
Oh,That's ok,I have last years chicken manure with all the rotting runner and broad bean plants so this should help.I wanted to place a good lot of cut grass over the top,however,I went to start the lawnmower over the weekend and the pull handle came off :-\ ,the spring thingy has broken to pieces and I am looking to buy another mower-this one is a bit old.

I suppose on this Hugelkultur I could use all the old straw which has been laying around on the ground all winter,trouble is,it does have some ears on it and they are likely to set and grow,or normally they have when I used this on  the old strawberry bed just to keep the berries off of the soil.

Thank you all for your kind comments and help with this,it is appreciated and I cannot wait to plant it,which I am going against waiting and planting it this year-or when it is finished,I am following a hunch with this and which materials and at what level within the Kultur,i.e. All my strawb plants are waiting to go back in,the do not really have deep roots so these shall be the first back in.

I am going to keep taking pictures of the progress all the way,especially of the resulting growth :)
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 02, 2012, 10:12:08 pm
good innit?  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 09, 2012, 03:20:23 pm
was going to cover the beds today, but rained off today so will probably Saturday now.  :(
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 13, 2012, 07:19:47 pm
both beds covered in top soil, very happy gardener. pics to follow later!  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 14, 2012, 08:18:07 am
(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone016-5.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone022-3.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone021-4.jpg)

(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone023-1.jpg)

very proud of my boy Byron, without his work this would be just an idea!  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: Fleecewife on April 14, 2012, 12:07:43 pm
Those beds look lovely  :thumbsup:   So do your artichokes (I can never get mine to overwinter here)

I'm looking forward to seeing the beds planted up and to see how they crop  :yum:.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 14, 2012, 05:46:38 pm
thanx mate, been alot of work TBH thought it was going to be a little easier but that's life innit!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on April 14, 2012, 06:58:56 pm
im highly jealous of your artichokes!!! mine always seem to get demolished by black fly and other bugs. yours look in fine fettle, should be a good crop this year, as theyre up so early and strong. did you cover them over the winter?
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 14, 2012, 08:24:50 pm
im highly jealous of your artichokes!!! mine always seem to get demolished by black fly and other bugs. yours look in fine fettle, should be a good crop this year, as theyre up so early and strong. did you cover them over the winter?

never cover them, they get a little burnt by bad frost but seem to come back ok. they are in a bed which had 4 tonne of horse poo dug in by excavator 3 years ago so very good conditions for them and very well drained which in the winter is a must for arties! just potted up 10 green and 8 purple for this years row. i put a row in every year what you can see there is last years survivors. 
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on April 14, 2012, 08:53:40 pm
i think thats may be why mine never amount to much, im on heavy clay and the drainage isnt the best, i think ill devote one of my raised beds to them this year cos i do love artichokes and so does my daughter, steamed and dipped in oliveoil and soem good balsamic has to be a highlight of summer. ill dig loads of manure and compost in and try again!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 14, 2012, 09:00:46 pm
dig a trench about 2 feet deep and then pick axe the bottom and add as much poo as you have. pick axe again and then replace soil and leave over winter and plant in april. i start the seeds in august and winter the plants in the green house. if you have clay like me try a hugel bed, it will transform your soil over 3-4 years.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on April 14, 2012, 09:10:29 pm
it would be impossible to dig a trench 2 foot deep, i wish! the clay starts about 6inches down and is mixed with shale in layers, all my crops are grown in raised beds that are made with 18inch cedar boards, and i have them filled with compost, manure and leafmould taken from the beech and oak woods near my place, i top them up regularly with more compost, its the only way. i think i will dedicate a permanent bed to artichokes tho, and do as you say, cheers or the advice.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 14, 2012, 09:23:33 pm
it would be impossible to dig a trench 2 foot deep, i wish! the clay starts about 6inches down and is mixed with shale in layers, all my crops are grown in raised beds that are made with 18inch cedar boards, and i have them filled with compost, manure and leafmould taken from the beech and oak woods near my place, i top them up regularly with more compost, its the only way. i think i will dedicate a permanent bed to artichokes tho, and do as you say, cheers or the advice.

i have about 6 feet of clay then onto gravel and chalk. the problem you will have with artichokes is the long taproot. that is how they stay alive in winter, deep deep roots.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on April 14, 2012, 10:40:10 pm
right, in that case, i shall have to dig out the kango, i ve used it before to get a fence post in. that should break it up enough to let me dig it out. it would be worth doing on a few of my beds tbh, i just havent thought about doing it like that before! ::)
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 14, 2012, 11:05:47 pm
(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/Milton%20Evolution/thedigger023.jpg)
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: Mel on April 15, 2012, 09:05:39 am
I have never seen artichokes growing before they look identical to the Cardoon which is part of the same family,I have not used them as of yet,they have come up this year and have an amazing thistle head.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 15, 2012, 02:18:15 pm
I have never seen artichokes growing before they look identical to the Cardoon which is part of the same family,I have not used them as of yet,they have come up this year and have an amazing thistle head.

got about 12 cardoons to put in. next week i think. they are a great veg bit like celery.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: YorkshireLass on April 15, 2012, 02:55:38 pm
So I'm noticing that you all have very flat beds, whereas my "hugel-style" attempt is more a heap in the corner  ;D

The topsoil washed off, but I have had grass clippings to add. I'll rebury once it stops raining long enough!

Should I be reshaping it??
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 15, 2012, 09:12:05 pm
So I'm noticing that you all have very flat beds, whereas my "hugel-style" attempt is more a heap in the corner  ;D

The topsoil washed off, but I have had grass clippings to add. I'll rebury once it stops raining long enough!

Should I be reshaping it??

got any pics?
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: YorkshireLass on April 15, 2012, 09:35:44 pm
Only this, the heap in the left hand corner (this was taken pre-burying/washing off/re-burying!)
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 15, 2012, 09:41:44 pm
what is that made of?
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: YorkshireLass on April 15, 2012, 09:54:08 pm
The cardboard is no longer there  ;D

Mainly twiggy, brashy, shrub clippings. Stuff that was too big to try to compost, so it got piled up.... Small twisted willow branches, ornamental quince, rose...Then the muck heap you can sort of see on the right was added (waste dung/straw from cattle trailer). That lot got covered in topsoil, which then washed off, so it now has a pile of grass clippings on top...
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 15, 2012, 10:00:56 pm
beech leave is what i used and 2 bails of straw then about a tonne of grass clipping from a mate who cuts lawns. rain has been heavy this way last couple of days and all still there. i'm new to all this myself!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 18, 2012, 04:05:50 pm
just planted the nitrogen fixers. loads of painted lady broad beans and peas of various types. good weather for planting peas and beans......oh and ducks! :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on April 18, 2012, 04:13:53 pm
remember that the nitrogen isnt fixed until the dead plants roots rot down ;) they may need some food to crop.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 18, 2012, 04:47:04 pm
remember that the nitrogen isnt fixed until the dead plants roots rot down ;) they may need some food to crop.

going to keep planting the beds all summer with loads of different beans and peas!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 20, 2012, 02:50:12 pm
went and had a look today and some little rodent has dug up and eaten all my painted lady broad beans that i planted wednesday! so will need to keep the planting up to get anything to take  ???
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: clydesdaleclopper on April 20, 2012, 07:45:14 pm
remember that the nitrogen isnt fixed until the dead plants roots rot down ;) they may need some food to crop.

You can encourage this by cutting the top growth - that's what Fukoka does with the clover.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: Mel on April 22, 2012, 05:30:10 pm
I still have not manage to get mine going as have been unable to cut any grass :( :-\
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 22, 2012, 05:45:06 pm
remember that the nitrogen isnt fixed until the dead plants roots rot down ;) they may need some food to crop.

You can encourage this by cutting the top growth - that's what Fukoka does with the clover.

need to put some seeds in the green house so they start, the mice have dug up most of what i have planted as seed!
 ::)
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 28, 2012, 10:26:03 pm
had so many  thefts from the hugel i thought i would set a trap. in the morning i had cat prints in the soil and the trap had gone. found it later on in the grass with some flesh left under the trap part but everything else had been eaten. since then the seed theft has stopped!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on April 30, 2012, 06:15:22 pm
got my first peas coming up and found one broad bean ready to sprout as i planted more peas. think it is going to spring into life at any moment! timing was good with all this rain.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on May 06, 2012, 09:52:59 am
got peas and broad beans coming up all over the place. it would seem the moles have moved in underneath the mounds. is this a problem? bet it is nice and warm in there!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on May 08, 2012, 03:20:29 pm
had broad beans and peas coming up now they are up! up with the roots too! something has pulled about 200 peas right out of the ground and half eaten the pea bit and all the beans have been snapped at the base of the stem! very, very disappointing! seems so pointless!  >:(
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on May 21, 2012, 09:29:31 pm
got loads of peas and beans coming up now. the top soil is cracking all over at the moment and the whole thing has shrunk by about a third.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on June 07, 2012, 09:59:55 pm
all is going well!


(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone003-19.jpg)
(http://i1033.photobucket.com/albums/a415/fandange/philsphone004-20.jpg)
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: YorkshireLass on June 14, 2012, 08:46:41 pm
Looking good!


I've got squash plants on my little heap, they seem very happy, have "mulched" with some sheep fleece to deter slugs and this also seems to be keeping the pile hot. How hot is too hot for a squash I wonder?

Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: deepinthewoods on June 14, 2012, 10:40:07 pm
thats really interesting, could you put a thermometer in and take a reading?  ive assumed that the carbon-nitrogen ratio would be too low with hugelkultur to generate much heat.
i would think that unless you are getting 150degf plus, your  squash will be fine.
160-180deg f is enough to sterilise a good compost heap.my last proper, quick heap hit 160 just for a few hours, that was watered with sheep dag stew!
it would be interesting to see the progress of the rot into the wood at its core.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: suziequeue on June 15, 2012, 07:00:57 am
Quote
"mulched" with some sheep fleece to deter slugs


How are you doing that Yorkshire Lass? Do you just lay some fleece around the base of the plant?
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on June 15, 2012, 08:32:42 am
Quote
"mulched" with some sheep fleece to deter slugs


How are you doing that Yorkshire Lass? Do you just lay some fleece around the base of the plant?


you can do the same thing with wood chips. i use lime chips as that is what i have but anything is good except conifer. conifer has tannins in it!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on June 15, 2012, 08:34:48 am
Looking good!


I've got squash plants on my little heap, they seem very happy, have "mulched" with some sheep fleece to deter slugs and this also seems to be keeping the pile hot. How hot is too hot for a squash I wonder?
i always grow queensland blue pumpkins. they are from OZ as is my lady. they handle heat very well and they can go without water even better. tough as they are!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: Mel on July 05, 2012, 06:22:16 am
I have strawberries,carrots,beetroot,spinach and coriander growing well in the Hugel,at the front i decided to put some herbs in too,it is all growing very nicely except,we need more sun for those strawbs to ripen off :-\
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on July 05, 2012, 08:41:35 am
I have strawberries,carrots,beetroot,spinach and coriander growing well in the Hugel,at the front i decided to put some herbs in too,it is all growing very nicely except,we need more sun for those strawbs to ripen off :-\


i have lots of moles in mine! they seem to love it. but apart from that it is doing very well this end too. i think the wet must be helping. mine have shrunk to about half the size they were when finished!
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: FiB on July 05, 2012, 08:49:01 am
Only just cought this thread - Interesting thanks (although I must admit to feeling slightly upset at the picture with about 2 months of beautiful woodfuel being buried!!! It looked to be quite a few  £££ worth of good timber!).
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: chairmanphil on July 05, 2012, 10:02:10 am
Only just cought this thread - Interesting thanks (although I must admit to feeling slightly upset at the picture with about 2 months of beautiful woodfuel being buried!!! It looked to be quite a few  £££ worth of good timber!).


hahahah, there is old apple wood in there too! i have cut down 60 trees there in the last 4 years and had about 10 tonne out on the back field and the farmer wanted it to start moving so came up with this. still got about another 20 tonne to burn and have burnt even more! if you need some come and get it! Bob the farmer will be well chuffed and i can get more manure on the site!  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: clydesdaleclopper on July 06, 2012, 09:39:56 pm
Only just cought this thread - Interesting thanks (although I must admit to feeling slightly upset at the picture with about 2 months of beautiful woodfuel being buried!!! It looked to be quite a few  £££ worth of good timber!).


I use wet rotting stuff in my hugel beds - the stuff that would be rubbish for burning.
Title: Re: hugelkultur anyone??
Post by: YorkshireLass on July 07, 2012, 05:25:47 pm
Wool is straight off the sheep (hebridean). Stretched out a bit but mainly unrolled around stems.
I'll see if I've got a thermometer kicking around!


(http://i1196.photobucket.com/albums/aa416/YorkshireLass84/DSCI0128.jpg)