The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Livestock => Pigs => Topic started by: Greg on October 30, 2011, 06:47:34 am
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I've got four Oxford, sandy and blacks.
Until recently they've been content munching away in a paddock which has been fenced in using a new solar powered electric fence which pulses every 5 or 6 seconds.
One pig in particular has seemed to have worked this out and has been getting out of the paddock and into the garden, they cant get any further than that due to secure stock fencing surrounding my holding.
I came home yesterday afternoon and they're all out!!! The fence is still pulsing away but they've all seemed to have worked it out. :pig:
Is it a case of the fence not having enough power or have I done something wrong. The electric fence covered about 200 meters and I've used two strands of wire, one down quite low and the other about snout height. I keep the bottom wire clear of anything the pigs churn over it.
The idea of the fence was to allow the pigs to strip graze this paddock which has been rough for many years, they are doing a fantastic job rotorvating the ground but I would like to keep them separate from my garden and also my kune's kune's.
Are the battery fences better?? It's too far to run from the mains :-[
Any help or advice appreciated. :wave:
Thanks
Greg.
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Hi Greg,
When you say its Solar Powered - It does have a battery as well, right?
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Yes it does... :)
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Ok,
A few more questions:
How many joules output is the energiser?
Have you got a good earth?
Have the pigs been "Trained" on the electric? - they soon learn not to approach after a few good shocks
We use a mains energiser to power the whole farm, this is close to the house but then we use a single line suspended on stakes to get the power to where its needed. Plus a single earth return to assist the earth return path.
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Is it OSB gilts you have ? I found with mine when they started to come into season (around 4 months) that they were almost impossible to keep in - doing all they could to get out and get to my Kune Kune boar ::) hormones and nature taking over I suppose. I've not had the same issue with any of the other breeds I keep.
It could also be that they've not got enough in their pen to keep them occupied - grass/enrichment etc so maybe a bigger area, a bag full of straw for them to play with - a case of 'the grass is always greener' :-\
Electric fences are a 'psycological barrier' so once they figure out they can get out it (bearing in mind how intelligent pigs are) they usually do :o Depending on how big they are I'd go for a strand at 6 inches from the ground and another around 16 inches from the ground - they could just be stepping over it ;) Failing that, connect a fully charged battery for a couple of days (or if you can get a mains hook up all the better) and the stronger current might help keep them in ;)
HTH
Karen :wave:
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Thankful for the replies and the help...
The battery inside the unit is 12v .5 ah so only a wee one...
The pigs were fine when I had them first and had a zap or two off the fence which kept them in, then one of the boars started almost biting it to test it which suggests its not strong enough now.
At the moment they all walk in and out of the area wily nilly, with the fence on.
The area that they were in has been stripped bare so they could be bored and looking for pastures new.
The entire area that they're in is enclosed with chain link fence and we went around yesterday and checked to make sure it was secure. We put some barbed wire along the bottom of some of the recent fencing.
They are 4 months and I have two gilts and two boars and a gilt and boar kune kune. All the boars have been castrated.
This is the fence kit.
http://www.molevalleyfarmers.com/mvf/store/products/gallagher-s20-solar-energiser-02j (http://www.molevalleyfarmers.com/mvf/store/products/gallagher-s20-solar-energiser-02j)
Thanks for all you help and replies.. I'm really grateful. :wave:
Greg
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I know this is no real help, but one lot of "Iron Age" weaners I kept had worked out that if the biggest got hold of the electric netting by the bottom un-electrified wire, and held it up the others could run under (no shocks to the backs as too hairy), then before the had all run though he dropped it and got under while it was still supported by the others backs
I had to hide and watch what they were doing as I just couldn't work it out. I managed to get round it by large "tent pegs" angled in to hold the bottom wire in place. After that I constructed a single stock wire fenced pen in a new area for each batch with two single strands of electric fence wire just inside - they were turning over what is now the vegetable garden.
Now when I keep them they are in a large gated pen in a barn and are allowed out till they start making too much mess of the orchard and small paddock they have access to - then completely confined in the barn till time for the abbatior.
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unfortunately there is only one way to test your electric fence and that is touch it yourself is the electric wire touching any part of the wire fence it does not matter how powerfull the energiser is if your fence is earthing out it is useless :farmer:
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MINE GOT OUT TWICE.... all fenced off so i put in a 2 strand wire about 9" from the fence so they would get sevaral shocks if they wanted to work on the main fence, it was the gate ( wire frame and string, useuall thing)they buldozed over both times....... since doing that NO PROBLEMS.........
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you can get an electric fence tester a few £ssssss you stick the probe into the ground and the other end on the fence several L E Ds light up to indiciate power had mine years, well worth it....£10 ebay...... this way i dont keep the growth clear of the fence untill power drops, my fences are always shorting out on ground growth, pampus etc but still loads of shock coming through, you need all lights on, on the tester........... someone told me the white wire for horses etc doesnt give out as much shock????????.
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you can get an electric fence tester a few £ssssss you stick the probe into the ground and the other end on the fence several L E Ds light up to indiciate power had mine years, well worth it....£10 ebay...... you need all lights on.
This is definitely the way to go, a fence tester(thought Robert would have his finger on the pulse, but obviously not :D), and you actually only need it up to 2000 volts to stop a pig getting out, but as Harry says 5000 would be best!!!!
There is and never will be any way that I am grabbing no electric fence to test it as that would be darn stupid, especially at my age! ;)
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ive walked into mine sevaral times thinking it was off......... the dogs heard me shout a mile away as i could hear them barking........ i got a clip on light that go on red when power drops..... its clipped on where i climb over... if its flashing red its low power which means to me ive switched it off.
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It costs nothing and really doesn't hurt at all to test an electric fence.
Grass is a poor conductor of electricity, but does conduct it a little, so use a blade of grass to insulate your fingers as follows.
Pick a good blade of grass and hold it between finger and thumb. Stroke the tip of it on the fence wire, so that there's about 4-5" of grass between your fingers and the wire. If you can feel a tiny pulse, the energy is fine. If you can't, slowly move the end of the grass you are holding closer to the wire until you can feel a tiny pulse. If the length of grass between your fingers and the wire is less than about 2", that's not enough of a shock to deter a determined pig.
If you get the grass down to 1" or less, you can hold the wire yourself without pain.
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ive walked into mine sevaral times thinking it was off......... the dogs heard me shout a mile away as i could hear them barking........ i got a clip on light that go on red when power drops..... its clipped on where i climb over... if its flashing red its low power which means to me ive switched it off.
Just stand on the bottom wire with your welly and if it cracks then its good and if there is nothing your low.
I always charge a spare and changed them daily, but you can get a battery which has a circular window in it as well that if "green" is good and "red" it low which is even easier.
Definetely better options than grabbing the wire! :wave:
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Thanks for all the replies... It's far more scientific than first thought!
Is the electric tape type of fencing better than the white wire type then??
I have a 12v 85ah diesel car battery.. Would that be better than using the solar powered system?
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We have metal wire and also use the blade of grass testing method and change our battery over weekly. From first glance it does sound like you've got your strands a lot lower than we were recommended - we have our lowest strand at 15cm or a bit higher in some places and 45 cm top (I cant believe I'm finally metric! That sounds about similar to 6 " and 16"?) and I do walk it daily to make sure they haven't rooted some turf to touch it (which as mentioned earlier will earth the system and rob it of power). Every now and then they they do get a bit excited to see me ( or is it the food?!!!) and come too close to the wire and get a shock - boy what a squeal, but at least I know (and more importantly they know) that it is still working!!! Good luck - I would hate to go through our first piggy chasing day again!!
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Thanks for all the replies... It's far more scientific than first thought!
Is the electric tape type of fencing better than the white wire type then??
I have a 12v 85ah diesel car battery.. Would that be better than using the solar powered system?
The solars good I just think you have the battery wrong as what you need is a heavy duty one.
I think alot of these guys use the white tape as a middle wire, but commercials only use this in training pens.
Hey its what ever works for you!!!
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to answer the point raised by stevie g our fences are powered by mains 7000 volts and yes we do have a proper tester for it i have seen one gentleman grab it to test it and when setting the fence up the instructions said the only way to check for a good earth is by touching the earth rod and the earth wire with your body as a conductor but very funny when anything touches the wire either intentional or accidental :farmer:
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to answer the point raised by stevie g our fences are powered by mains 7000 volts and yes we do have a proper tester for it i have seen one gentleman grab it to test it and when setting the fence up the instructions said the only way to check for a good earth is by touching the earth rod and the earth wire with your body as a conductor but very funny when anything touches the wire either intentional or accidental :farmer:
Brings a giggle every time Robert along as it is not me, ooooooouch!!!
The best way to do it without getting a big shock is to keep hold of it, but hey Iam not training my arm to do that and I feel that it is better in every instance to let go! :wave: Its a case of self preservation!!!!!
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the guy that boldly stated he could hold on to the wire every time it pulsed you could see his body jerk :D :farmer:
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A battery designed for electric fencing use will be better than a car battery. They are designed for all of the energy to be used before being recharged. You will find that they hold a charge much better than a car battery. Keep the other one as a spare.
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Ours is run off a car battery. Keeps our saddlebacks contained with no problems. One thing I've noticed these dark mornings is that when one of the pigs gets a bit clumsy at the sight of breakfast and touches the wire there is a visible spark. Shows me the fence is working for definite.
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££££££££££ssssssss for weaners ££££££sssssssss for feed £££££££££££ssssssss for etc etc etc blade of grass for testing or hold the wire......... BUGGER THAT £10 for a proper tester showing a range of power outputs, you tight lot ;D ;D ;D........... by the way you need a big liesure battery they are designed to be recharged from flat, not like a car battery that should have constant charging....mine is permanatly plugged into and intelligent charger while running the fence, £30, oh no here we go again
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Thanks folks,
I've taken the battery out of the solar unit and put it on an intelligent charger. Once it's fully charged I'll put it back in the unit and move the fence to give the piggies a bigger area.
Thanks for all your advice.. :wave:
I'll keep you posted or should that be fenced. 8)
Thanks
Greg
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the pigs probably only need a few shocks then they probably wont go near it again...... thats why some use the white horse tape so the pigs then have a visual deterent........ might even work disconected once they learn.
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More than once I've forgotten to swith the fence back on. Pigs have never gone past the wire. A while back we tried to corner a gilt to give an injection and she would push through any barrier to get away except the electric fence wire. Once they know it's there they respect it.
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disagree with the last two posters our pigs sense when the fence is off or earthing out also if there is an electric fence that they have to cross to get out the paddock you have to remove it days before you want to shift them :farmer:
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the problem you would have with a car battery is
you cant let it go flat
if it is flat it doesn't charge up to full next time
leisure battery's are made to go flat and charged from flat or part flat
which are better for electric fences we have 2 battery's and a 30watt solar panel and charge 1 other on fence
it works well
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lol well ive got 11 pigs 9 of them escape everyday and they where on the same energier but the other 2 older pigs dont bother getting out , ive just moved them into winter housing total indoors they have a very large polly tunnel to play in but the 9 still escape from there section of it and they are still on electric fence but the older 2 dont bother and they arnt on electric fence at all just have the tape going across there door way so it just shows some pigs are just better behaved then the others , well at least im getting my daily exercise chasing 9 4 month pigs about at least twice a day :thumbsup:
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££££££££££ssssssss for weaners ££££££sssssssss for feed £££££££££££ssssssss for etc etc etc blade of grass for testing or hold the wire......... BUGGER THAT £10 for a proper tester showing a range of power outputs, you tight lot ;D ;D ;D........... by the way you need a big liesure battery they are designed to be recharged from flat, not like a car battery that should have constant charging....mine is permanatly plugged into and intelligent charger while running the fence, £30, oh no here we go again
Tell me about it!!! £250 for 200 m fence kit with metal stakes plus £60 for battery ...... and the tester that came with it doesnt work!!! (hence the blade of grass until I can be bothered to send it back!)
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dont bother getting out , ive just moved them into winter housing total indoors they have a very large polly tunnel to play in but the 9 still escape from there section of it and they are still on electric fence but the older 2 dont bother and they arnt on electric fence at all just have the tape going across there door way so it just shows some pigs are just better behaved then the others , well at least im getting my daily exercise chasing 9 4 month pigs about at least twice a day
Well that made me chuckle :D
I think I'll just go with the flow and accept it as part of the piggy ownership.
Chasing pigs..... An old pig farmer in the village said to me...
"Lad.... It's like herding cats!!!". ::) ;D
After the fun and games getting them back behind the fencing all the time I can see why!!
Cheers
Greg
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I think your battery is more suited to a torch than an electric fence. I use two old car batteries on ours - one running the fence and the other on charge/standby - and swap them every week or two. Works well with our goats and pigs.
I've got a fence tester gizmo somewhere which you're welcome to borrow, but getting a belt off the fence yourself is the best test. I've done this to myself a few times and whilst you're likely to swear (I did!) it won't do you any real harm.
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As for car batteries being no good, b*****ks! I've always used car batteries simply because I have them already so I'm not going to buy a leisure battery especially. So long as you don't have your fence line constantly earthed out by foliage or rooted up earth the battery will last for months. I swap mine over and charge every couple of months and have never had a problem. As for moving pigs past the fence line it's amazing what they'll do when their nose is in a bucket of food.
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blade of grass for testing or hold the wire......... BUGGER THAT £10 for a proper tester showing a range of power outputs, you tight lot ;D ;D ;D...........
:P harry! ;)
It's not about being a tightwad, it's about:
- not buying a gizmo to do something I can do with a little bit of ingenuity and nature's help
- never finding that my tester doesn't work when I need it
- always being able to find my tester
- not having to find a place for my tester to live when not in use
- oh, and being a tightwad ;D
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We have lights that hang on the fences and flash when the fence is shorting out. A real boon on these dark days when it's easy to miss a lump of earth on a fence wire (though I still check the fence visually too once a day). Our pigs take 2 days on average to work out that the fence isn't working. I have seen one deliberately barge another pig against the fence to see if it's working! So far they haven't worked out what the light flashing means!!!
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now tiva you have far to intelligent pigs the ones you had at the highland show were prime examples
every time there pen was opened there they were observing how the pin came out and trying to work out how to get it open ;D :farmer: ;D
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££££££££££ssssssss for weaners ££££££sssssssss for feed £££££££££££ssssssss for etc etc etc blade of grass for testing or hold the wire......... BUGGER THAT £10 for a proper tester showing a range of power outputs, you tight lot ;D ;D ;D........... by the way you need a big liesure battery they are designed to be recharged from flat, not like a car battery that should have constant charging....mine is permanatly plugged into and intelligent charger while running the fence, £30, oh no here we go again
My preference also Harry :thumbsup: as there as you feel nothing.
Should really be duck breeders and they've got bums like one! ;)
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It's not about being a tightwad, it's about:
- not buying a gizmo to do something I can do with a little bit of ingenuity and nature's help
- never finding that my tester doesn't work when I need it
- always being able to find my tester
- not having to find a place for my tester to live when not in use
- oh, and being a tightwad ;D
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Absolutely spot on. The blade of grass method works perfectly and costs nothing.
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5 to 6 seconds between pulses is too long. Mine pulses once per second and keeps the pigs in nicely,
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blade of grass for testing or hold the wire......... BUGGER THAT £10 for a proper tester showing a range of power outputs, you tight lot ;D ;D ;D...........
:P harry! ;)
It's not about being a tightwad, it's about:
- not buying a gizmo to do something I can do with a little bit of ingenuity and nature's help
- never finding that my tester doesn't work when I need it
- always being able to find my tester
- not having to find a place for my tester to live when not in use
- oh, and being a tightwad ;D
SALLY put it in your handbag, or maybe not ;) and hughesy if youve got one. Ive had mine about a million years always worked.
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blade of grass for testing or hold the wire......... BUGGER THAT £10 for a proper tester showing a range of power outputs, you tight lot ;D ;D ;D...........
:P harry! ;)
It's not about being a tightwad, it's about:
- not buying a gizmo to do something I can do with a little bit of ingenuity and nature's help
- never finding that my tester doesn't work when I need it
- always being able to find my tester
- not having to find a place for my tester to live when not in use
- oh, and being a tightwad ;D
SALLY put it in your handbag, or maybe not ;) and hughesy if youve got one. Ive had mine about a million years always worked.
A handbag! ? I don't carry a handbag! ;D
Grass is always around and always works ;D
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There is absolutely no need to spend money on a tester when a nice free readily available blade of grass will do the job fine. But if you like having gadgets go ahead get one.
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the older they get the less chance of escape!
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unfortunately there is only one way to test your electric fence and that is touch it yourself is the electric wire touching any part of the wire fence it does not matter how powerfull the energiser is if your fence is earthing out it is useless :farmer:
We have an elctric fence fault finder, and it tests the fence as well..... none of this touching the fence your self thanks. It is put out by Gallagher.... called Smartfix. around 300 dollars AUD and worth its weight in gold. It will find a fault and it gives directon, tells you the amps lost during the short out and the volts, while this is happening, and once found the rating goes up and the volts go up.
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I like our flashing light. I can see if there's a problem with the fence every time I look out of the window!
Yes, Robert, some of our pigs are just too damn clever! One of our OSB gilts seems to have worked out the flashing light! I've had to move it to where she can't see it!
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Blades of grass? Gizmos for testing? Don't you have any small children ;D ;D
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you can get an electric fence tester a few £ssssss you stick the probe into the ground and the other end on the fence several L E Ds light up to indiciate power had mine years, well worth it....£10 ebay...... you need all lights on.
This is definitely the way to go, a fence tester(thought Robert would have his finger on the pulse, but obviously not :D), and you actually only need it up to 2000 volts to stop a pig getting out, but as Harry says 5000 would be best!!!!
There is and never will be any way that I am grabbing no electric fence to test it as that would be darn stupid, especially at my age! ;)
Getting on are you Stevie....walking stick....... the electric fence just might light you up.....Hey!!!!!
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disagree with the last two posters our pigs sense when the fence is off or earthing out also if there is an electric fence that they have to cross to get out the paddock you have to remove it days before you want to shift them :farmer:
I agree......pigs constantly test the fence with their nose.......the small hairs on their nose carry the charge to the body if it is working ....hence telling the pig that the fence is working
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you can get an electric fence tester a few £ssssss you stick the probe into the ground and the other end on the fence several L E Ds light up to indiciate power had mine years, well worth it....£10 ebay...... you need all lights on.
This is definitely the way to go, a fence tester(thought Robert would have his finger on the pulse, but obviously not :D), and you actually only need it up to 2000 volts to stop a pig getting out, but as Harry says 5000 would be best!!!!
There is and never will be any way that I am grabbing no electric fence to test it as that would be darn stupid, especially at my age! ;)
Getting on are you Stevie....walking stick....... the electric fence just might light you up.....Hey!!!!!
Old, but not darn right stupid hey Blonde.
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We use energisers and old car batteries. We have tape for the horses but for the pigs I bought rope instead, it's a bit thicker than the orange wire. Mine respect it no problem. I can hear it clicking and it has a light flashing too and another that begins to flash when the battery is running low.
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Ours goes to halfspeed when the battery is running down. Luckily you can see the flashing neon now it's getting darker earlier.