The Accidental Smallholder Forum
Community => Introduce yourself => Topic started by: ricardodba on April 13, 2015, 12:45:40 am
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Hi All,
:wave:
Pleased to meet you, my name is Richard. I've been reading the site for a few weeks now (very informative i must add).
Im about to move with my family (wife and 3 kids) to a house up in Haworth (Bronte country in Yorkshire). The house comes with a 1.5 acre field next to it and is off the beaten track. The field currently has sheep grazing on it.
I would really like to have a go at having a small holding and not just having the land sit there doing nothing.
Plan is to have chickens, a house cow (a shetland)...and a veg growing area...oh, and my 10 year old daughter is desperate for her own pony....and possibly further down the line in the future a few weaners for meat.
Im wondering if its going to be a choice between cow and pony due to amount of land!?
Do this sound feasible with the amount of land i have?...i know its not loads of land!
This isnt going to be an overnight thing and the animals probably wont come along until this time next year now.
I intend on using this year to prepare field i.e test soil, possibly rotavate and reseed with grass and flora and get it in good condition for grazing.
The soil as far as i know is peat.
A few questions I have if you dont mind me asking!
Whats best way to go about soil testing - do it yourself or send off the soil?
Do you have any tips on best grass and wildflower to grow on peat?
Regarding the house cow...if the cow (a Shetland) is with calf at foot does the cow still need daily milking?...
Are there any farmers/small holding people on here from the area?
Any other hints and tips on making taking the 1st steps into small holdings will be gratefully received.
Thanks,
Richard
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Hi Richard from Leeds :wave:
Haworth is beautiful - very jealous ;D
A cow and a pony on 1.5 acres - no is the real answer. Maybe you could rent some extra land?
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Hello and welcome Richard.
Problem is that animals need company of their own species and age - so a cow with calf at foot doesn't really count as two. We had a heifer calve unexpectedly this year (Shetlands) so we put her and the calf out by themselves but the heifer was prety stressed until we put another adult cow out with her. It's hard to guard your calf against wolves when you don't have a herd :)
I do love my cattle though - so maybe you could rent some land?
1.5 acres would be great for veggies, a couple of weaners from spring to autumn, a small orchard and some hens. If it's peat and wet, big animals will trash it (so will the pigs but they'll be restricted and only there for six months of the year).
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you don't really have enough land for even one pony if you are growing in part of the field. After a week of rain the pony will be knee deep in mud and that's all your grazing gone.
Id guess the same applied re a cow too, and it wouldn't be fair to keep a cow alone.
Id say vegetables, a few chickens and a couple of pigs but the piggies wont half demolish the land so plan for that
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Hi, welcome. I can't give any advice as just starting out myself, but love your enthusiasm ;D
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thanks for the replies...although that has put a bit of a downer on things!!... :thinking:
i dont have to grow the veggies on the field...the garden is big enough for what we need.
So i guess the next few questions:
How much land does a Shetland cow need? ...is it down to how much grass the field can supply or actual space for the cow to roam about?...if volume of grass...can this supplemented with other feed and therefore i will have enough land...please go gentle on me - im new to all this!! :excited:
what livestock can i have?...maybe a couple of goats /sheep instead of a cow?
Would it be a good idea to put some kind of drainage in the field?...the field is on the side of a small hill so has a steady gradient running down to the bottom of the field.
I notice there are a lot of mole hills in the field ...is this good or bad?
thanks again :thumbsup:
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How much land does a Shetland cow need? ...is it down to how much grass the field can supply or actual space for the cow to roam about?...if volume of grass...can this supplemented with other feed and therefore i will have enough land...please go gentle on me - im new to all this!! :excited:
http://www.shetlandcattle.org.uk/faqs (http://www.shetlandcattle.org.uk/faqs) has the question "how much land do I need?"
Don't worry, no-one was born knowing this stuff :)
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How much land does a Shetland cow need? ...is it down to how much grass the field can supply or actual space for the cow to roam about?...if volume of grass...can this supplemented with other feed and therefore i will have enough land...please go gentle on me - im new to all this!! :excited:
http://www.shetlandcattle.org.uk/faqs (http://www.shetlandcattle.org.uk/faqs) has the question "how much land do I need?"
Don't worry, no-one was born knowing this stuff :)
From what this says i should have enough land for 1 cow, especially if i supplement with other feed which i buy in:
How much land do I need?
A quick answer is one acre of good grazing per cow during the summer months. But Shetlands are used extensively in conservation grazing schemes, and on heathland, for example, you might need 25 acres per animal. Your land requirement therefore is dependent on quality of pasture and the availability of supplementary feed. If you wish to produce your own feed for the winter, such as hay, haylage or sileage you will require additional land. As a very rough calculation your cow will eat around 5 large bales of haylage over the winter and you would need more than half an acre of summer growth to produce this. If your cows are to live out they will eat rather more. Cows will exist on less land but you will have to depend on bought in feed.[/
obviously not quite enough room for 2 cows...Does a cow need a cow for company or can a smaller animal such as a goat be used?
Thanks.
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A cow really does need another cow for company. I had to quarantine one alone for 60 days and she was so unhappy I think it would have been kinder just to cull her. I tried giving her sheep for company but she started to be aggressive toward them.
Unless your land is very sturdy and well drained having even one cow in one acre year around will make a mess of that acre, unfortunately. I have about 8 acres of pasture but decided to sell our two Shetlands on in favour of looking into goats instead. I think we could have managed them with careful planning so they would always be up in the sturdiest best drained pasture whenever the ground was wet, or if we converted some barn space to house them, but we'd have little margin for error. And since we thought we might enjoy dairy goats just as much that seemed worth a try instead.
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Hi. As others have said a cow really does need another cow for company. I was going to suggest goats, although I know nothing about them, but Thyme beat me to it! Perhaps you could start with a couple of pigs or a few lambs to rear for meat and see how you get on and how the land copes?
As for mole hills - the moles will be creating drainage so that can be a good thing!!
Good luck and enjoy!
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Oh!, I do wish you well and know how keen you feel to do it all at once :) I was going to say "If I were you I would..........." but, if I were you I would want to do it all at once ::) So, I would caution you to do nothing (except a few hens) for a good few weeks, then think about what you want from your land.
One and a half acres sounds a good lot of land until you want to do lots with it and you can do lots, but cautiously. You can't keep two cows, or, realistically one cow on your land.
So, if you want to grow food, I would go for vegetables and poultry at first, eggs, meat and veg and then think, maybe a couple of goats for milk, butter etc. and then a pair of pigs for meat but do go slowly if you aren't to be overwhelmed.
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I was also going to say goats. They can manage with less land especially if you can supplement their food with cur branches. My own goats just have a yard and no pasture but they have plenty of bought in greenstuff.
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Moles show the soil is good, but they're a bit of a disaster where there's dense livestock. They make the area muddy, which reduces the amount of grass growing, and lambs will get listeriosis. But where there are moles there will be plenty of earthworms, which is what they eat.
You don't want moles in your veggie patch because they tip over your plants, especially seedlings. Molehill soil is great for adding to your veg growing area, and for making seedling composts.
I can feel your yearning for your cow and I understand that, but I think you should at least put it off until you've lived there a minimum of a year, to see your land through all the seasons. Yorkshire is quite wet, and cows, even Shetlands, are heavy and their feet sink in - same with pigs whose feet are very pointy. As they sink in they cut up the grass roots and destroy the sward.
Buying in feed isn't cheap either. When my granny was young (late 1800s :o :o) it was her job to bring the cows home for milking - SLOWLY, so they could graze the verges on the way to stretch out the grazing on the farm.
Before we start our smallholdings all of us have big plans, some of which will work, others are unrealistic. So we all understand where you're at right now. Be excited about what you can grow and keep, and once you've moved in perhaps you can rent some extra ground, or even buy some.
Good luck :hshoe:
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Thanks again guys for all your comments.
I dont plan of having any animals other than chickens before next spring.
I would like to get the field looking a bit more like a meadow first. I was going to plow or rotavate the entire field...maybe this is a bit extreme?
I've attached a pic of the field...maybe this will give you all a better idea of how it currently looks..
How do i get rid of the those wreeds?
Should i put drainage in?
Thanks.
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the rushes in your field suggest that drainage would be a good idea but please cost this carefully . Professional drainage is VERY expensive and amateur drainage can cause more harm than good.
Im conscious that we might sound negative..... that's not so but big animals on such a small acreage is probably too much of a challenge
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Personally I think that would be a bit extreme. I wouldn't worry too much about that amount of rushes, you can discourage them just by mowing ("topping") regularly. My biggest fields have rushes around the drainage ditches and scatterings of them elsewhere, it's fine as long as your field is still mostly grass. In my opinion anyway, but all my grazing animals are primitives ::)
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what causes the rushes to grow?
with regards to the draining - i was thinking digging several trenches going from top to bottom of the hill in the field, put in some drainage pipes, back-fill with pea gravel and cover back with soil...does this sound about right?
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Disclaimer: I'm only about a year ahead of you in all of this, but your 1.5 acre appears similar to my land, so take my comments for what value you can :) My understanding is the rushes tend to mean 1) wet ground, 2) proximity to other rushes, 3) acidic soil. But the wet you want to worry about is when the ground is actually soggy some of the time, and rushes don't necessarily mean that -- some of mine are growing in clumps on high ground that is actually well drained, which is what your photo seems to be showing.
So I wouldn't overreact to the presence of rushes or a few other non-grass plants if I were you. What I'd look at is: are there parts of the land that are soggy right now where the grass would turn to mud if you walked on it much? Is there standing water after it rains? Do those parts dry out later in the year (which you won't know yet) and if so can you partition the field to keep animals off those areas until they are dry?
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Hi Richard - can't answer any of your cow queries as I'm just a sheep and dog person, but hello and welcome from just over the hill in Sutton.
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I went on a grassland management course run by the Scottish Crofting Federation last year. Although I'm in Scotland and on the east coast and the land is very different from yours, I had some of the same issues, principally, rushes and also tired looking grazing. As has been said elsewhere, cutting the rushes will keep them at bay and may even get rid of them entirely. We don't want to use heavy machinery on our croft as far as possible and my BH has been scything the rushes to great effect. Most important is not letting them seed so chop of the flowering bits when they appear. We have even used them as a resource for other projects eg as insulation and base layer for a turf roof, and chicken bedding (not so good as not absorbent enough). The big message from the course was though, yes to test your soil, but also to think carefully about what you want from your land and to make sure that it's good enough for your purposes. There is no point in making a lovely looking flower meadow if you are going to have too much stock on it, for example. And don't think ploughing up and re-seeding as a first resort. Start with what you have and look at what small improvements you could make. And perhaps the use of more sheep to graze it down at particular times of year would be a better way. Trickier to manage if they are not your sheep but something to think about. Sorry, this is all too much information at once and you are obviously researching yourself but it really made me think about our land in a quite different way.
Good luck anyway and keep asking questions. The stupid question is the one you don't ask, as many here will tell you. :thumbsup:
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Hi and welcome aboard. We started out from scratch about 5 years ago with no real clear idea about what to do with our 4 1/2 acres but lots of dreams. Foremost amongst these was a couple of dexter cows and some donkeys. To date neither of these species has been seen but goats, pigs, sheep and chickens have. Over time we've learnt more about what our land can manage and we have settled on our sheep pigs and always the chickens. If money is no object then rip it all up put in drainage, reseed, lime. OR find out as you go along. For us that's part of the thrill of it all. Good luck
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Hi Richard and welcome
We aren't very far from Haworth, over in Hebden Bridge.
Are there any outbuildings? there is no way goats and most cows, ponies etc can winter outside round here.
I'd say get goats, but I'm biased :goat: :love: ;D . I have 5 with currently 9 babies. Easier to handle than cows, And I (think) easier to keep inside. two should keep you in milk all the year round.
I really don't think you've enough land for a cow, maybe when you've moved in and settled you may find some land to rent nearby?
I'm afraid we seem to be ruling the pony out, sorry. but you really haven't the land. maybe when your daughter makes some friends it would be better to 'share' land or a pony?
Hens and geese may keep grass down, but would need fastening in at dusk. 6 geese eat LOT of grass!
I'd say if the land has sheep on it don't put sheep or goats on for at least a year, preferably 2. sheep can carry parasites (worms) that can pass to goats.
Wouldn't worry too much about the rushes unless the land is really boggy, drainage is usually done in a herringbone patern, one main drain going downhill and others coming in fromthe side at an angle. If they are old stone drains like ours could be just a part of one has collapsed (heavy tractors have wrecked our field drains before we bought them)
When are you thinking you will be moving?
Just a thought - if the field is currently rented to the sheep owner - make sure there are no tenancy rights, if they are on all the year round there may be problems getting him off. We only allow summer grazing to avoid this.
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Rushes make great shelter for lambs. So if you are planning on breeding sheep, do not remove all your rushes - the amount in your pic isn't much ;) and would be just right for shelter for the lambs of the 3-4 ewes you might have on your 1.5 acres.
Rushes also help bind the surface together, and use a lot of water, so if the ground is wet and the climate also, rushes could be more of a friend than a foe. Just top them in the summer, twice if you can, to stop them getting out of hand.
Permanent pasture is by far the best at withstanding weather extremes, be it drought or prolonged wet. Do not plough and reseed without a lot more knowledge, and local knowledge. Talk to your nieghbouring farmers, they will know what will and will not work on your patch.
If it's wet land and you do plough and reseed, you may find you can't run any hooved feet on it for a couple of years while the new grasses get established. Same may apply to more than three or four choox.
I think you've received the messages No Ponies, Never a Single Cow and Not Enough for Two Cows. Sorry!
But... once you are known and, hopefully, liked!, you may well find that there are ponies about locally that are underused and their owners very happy to have an experienced rider make use of it/them. It's Fell Pony country, it's a breed that loves to work. ;)
And once you have got used to your new spot for a year or two, and had a few choox and maybe a couple of weaners, and know people locally, well then you may find there is summer grazing around you could use for your two Shetland cows. Depending on exactly where, you may need to lead them home for milking, or milk them in the field.
I have Jersey house cows, which produce so much milk I have to buy in calves for them to rear alongside their own, so they hardly notice what I want for the house! I'll share a few things I've learned. If a cow is rearing her own calf then yes, you don't have to milk her every day for her own welfare - but I find it best to mostly keep the routine the same, especially in her first and second lactation, so I do try to milk them every day for at least the first lactation. After the first couple of weeks, you will need to keep the calf off her at night, so that she has a full udder for you to take your bit before reuniting mum and calf in the morning. You can't keep a calf on its own, nor a cow on her own, so the solution is usually that the calves are penned together overnight and the cows run out or are penned together but away from the calves, whichever suits you best. You can have them in pens next to each other so the mums can see and talk to the calves but the calves can't reach the udders.
The other thing I want to share is that you will form an amazing two-way bond with a cow that you milk. I was unprepared for the strength of this bond; it's as strong as that with a horse or pony that is yours and you work/ride. It's a wonderful thing, for sure - but it does mean that you should take the step of getting a couple of house cows very carefully. If you rush into it, then find it isn't working for you, your land, or whatever, then you will have a heartbreaking situation to deal with. Probably it's not terribly difficult to rehome a couple of trained Shetland house cows, but it would still be a wrench for whoever milks them especially but also for the whole family.
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But... once you are known and, hopefully, liked!, you may well find that there are ponies about locally that are underused and their owners very happy to have an experienced rider make use of it/them.
Just want to emphasize that this is so true! I've already had to fend off people trying to talk me into a relationship with their horse that "could use more exercise" and I'm not even an enthusiastic teenage girl :D
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Thanks so much for all your replies.
So it seems, i'll be going down the smaller livestock route with either sheep or goats or maybe both. I wont quite give up on the house cow idea, but maybe down the line if i can get any additional land.
I think i'll spend this year seeing how the land changes etc with the seasons and get a soil test done, get the veggie patch up and running and get a few chickens....oh and a load of fencing :fc:
regarding outbuildings - at present there are none. I do intend on adding a couple of stalls/sheds for any livestock i get...one day id like to have a barn put up :excited:
So moving on to the chickens. Im thinking of adapting a standard shed into a chicken coop...and the reason for this is for ease of cleaning. Kids have had rabbits in the past and cleaning them out could be so much easier if you could get in the hutch!...so any hints and tips on adapting sheds to chicken coop. Have done a bit of research ie keep vented, red mite etc. Id like a few differnt egg types...for me personally i want white eggs (so a leghorn), blue eggs (so a legbar i think will be best)...my wife like the Orpington and marans. They will be able to roam but i do intend n having an enclosure attached to the shed too should i ever want to keep them enclosed.
Regarding the field...so if i leave it as is for now...can i still throw down some wild flower seed to bring a bit of colour into the field?
Thanks
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Sutton Seeds, I think, sell a wildflower mix and I daresay will tell you the best way of sowing. I have scattered
primroses, fox gloves, sweet violets, campions and other wildies along the banks and margins of our land and, after seven years they are becoming established.
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We have a couple of polytunnels for veg you can grow stuff all year round. There is a really good book by Joyce Russell called the polytunnel book. You can grow loss in a comparatively small space leaving more room for livestock
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You wont regret the chickens but set aside lots of time in your week for standing and watching them as they are quite comical and make terrific time-wasters :sunshine:
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hi guys, after an emotional roller-coaster of being in a chain... looks like im getting keys on friday...soooo excited :excited:
There is one thing i need to get sorted quick...I have a German shepherd. She is 18 months old, relativity well behaved and trained.
I took her for a walk on the moors near where we're moving - wanted to get her used to the sheep more than anything - as the sheep roam wild basically!. She pretty much ignored the sheep but when 1 sheep was startled and ran off, Maggie (my dog) chased the sheep...basically wanting to play...no aggression whatsoever!..im guessing a farmer seeing this will possibly shoot her!
What i want to know is how do i get her used to being around sheep...do i try to find a local sheep farmer who'll let me take her around his farm and get her used to being around sheep?...
Any ideas will be gratefully received!
Cheers.
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Hey. Two things. One ; we so wish you well in your venture as we are still on the same purchasing roller coaster. The other, we too have a non aggressive chaser in the form of a large bouncy mongrel. And have the same questions. We have read your posts with interest and send you our ( ignorant) encouragement . Hopefully we can swap wisdom and success stories soon. When my wife left her partnership to allow us to pursue our plan her colleague wrote in a card -'we are are all looking for adventure; enjoy yours'. We say the same to you!!
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Hey. Two things. One ; we so wish you well in your venture as we are still on the same purchasing roller coaster. The other, we too have a non aggressive chaser in the form of a large bouncy mongrel. And have the same questions. We have read your posts with interest and send you our ( ignorant) encouragement . Hopefully we can swap wisdom and success stories soon. When my wife left her partnership to allow us to pursue our plan her colleague wrote in a card -'we are are all looking for adventure; enjoy yours'. We say the same to you!!
Hi, thanks for your comments .
I've just purchased a 6m slip lead and intend on walking her on this for the time being...hopefully if i can get her close up to sheep and keep her calm with a few treats when she is calm, this might help her training...but any dog and sheep experts out there im all ears.
Might sound daft...but...She has lamb in her diet (millies wolfheart dry food)...do i need to change to a different flavor?
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Oh dear !! PLEASE keep her on a lead around other people's livestock!
Even the best trained dogs can cause havoc and heartbreak not to mention the fury of the owners.
My own whippets, greyhound, Ibizan, pugs are fine with our sheep and poultry but I wouldn't trust them loose with anyone else's.
You and your family would be heartbroken if your dog were shot and you would not be popular among the farming community.
Playing soon gets out of hand and any dog from a GS to a Jack Russell will revert to type and sheep don't understand "playing".
I'm sorry if this sounds harsh but it is a harsh subject,
The dog that killed my little flock of Ouessants was the soppiest bitch you could meet but had she been loose around my sheep again she would surely have been shot!!!
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round here (south Lancashire) a dog chasing sheep would be shot very quickly, no questions asked. Im sure its the same in most sheep areas. The dog doesnt have to catch the sheep to do a lot of damage: they seem to want to drop dead for the slightest reason!
And you really don't want to watch your dog turn from playful pup to killer as its not pleasant to see....and I think nearly all dogs are capable of it.
One of our small spaniels is a total soppy lap dog but he has tried to kill some of our chickens a few times: always when they have suddenly started running for no obvious reason and the dog has got giddy. We don't trust him and I don't think you can trust yours either
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Is your desire for a cow just for milk? If so goats would provide a good alternative
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Yes, i will be keeping her on lead at all times...until i get all my land completely fenced and secure.
Id like a cow for both milk and meat (meat coming from calf)...but until i can source more land the house cow will be put on hold. I have been looking into possibly keeping a couple of Gurnsey goats...and maybe using kids for meat...At what age do kids go for meat?...is there a better word than 'kids' here...sounds so wrong!! ;D
Moving on to next subject - are there any Land Rover Defender experts on here?...im going to have to get rid of my car ( its a clio)...not sure if i should get a 90 or 110 and if i should save a bit longer for a 300 engine?...or is the 200 fine? I like the idea of a 110 double cab pickup...enough room for all family and room to throw some bails/dog/livestock in back .
Cheers.
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There is a lot of LandRover thefts round here (probably elsewhere as well) parts can be removed quickly and easily during the night, many friends have lost either parts or whole vehicle (off secure drives and yards), one person came out one morning to find just the chassis(sp?), We had a Toyota Hilux, probably cheaper to run as well.
We now run a Citreon Berlingo van for road use and looking at a 4x4 utility vehicle for the fields.
I may be wrong but I think GG's are a bit fine for meat, unless you cross a gg with a stockier breed? kids can go for slaughter in the Autumn of birth (6 months or so)
('Kids' can be sometimes be amusing if people don't realise your'e talking about goat kids), but I often wonder which was called 'kids' first ::) .
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Hope all on course for getting keys tomorrow! Hope dog training going ok too. Like you we have picked up the clear message from other posts to be strict.
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Good luck for tomorrow :excited:
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How is it going Richard?
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Hi,
Been here a couple of weeks now...been hectic, but also very interesting and fun. The scenary and wildlife - i still cant believe i live here!...its great to see the grouse chicks startng to appear.
Generator arrived yesterday and solar panels etc hopefully this weekend...i've been running off a small 6.7hp generator, 2x 500w solar panels and a 12v battery system...amazing what you can run on it...been a good learning curve for off grid living.
Just getting used to the Rayburn (its a very old one)...i can keep it in all night now. :thumbsup:
Fencing will start to go up next week...so hopeully another couple of weeks and i can get myself a few hens :excited: ...think i've probably missed the boat this year on getting the veg patch running...but got so many other things to do anyway.
Cheers
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Hi Richard
Welcome to 'Ooop North', sounds very exciting for you.
We are only running our rayburn in the evenings, just enough to cook our evening meal and heat water, saves bothering to feed it during the day. Junk mail is called 'Rayburn fodder', useful for lighting it anyway.
for the veg patch you could always try a few salad stuff, maybe short season carrots? I think there may be cabbage that you start off now? anyway sounds like there is enough to do! :) .
I love looking around every day where I live - love it whatever the weather (well maybe no the horizontal wind with rain/snow, but even that has its own power and beauty). Sometimes I think it would be nice to live somewhere flat, but I'd miss the hills and valleys, where the view changes just a few yards up the lane.
You've certainly had some good weather to help you settle in :thumbsup:
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welcome to world of incredibly hard work!!!! :-J
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Hi all,
I just got the off-grid power system up and running in my power shed aka micro power station :sunshine:
Its a 48v 1000a battery sytstem fed by 1.8kw of solar and a 14kva standby generator, the Inverter charger and charge controller are all Outback systems...so far not needed generator on as solar seems so be creating enough...getting between 5 and 6.5kwh per day from solar so far.
Stage 2 is to put a 3m lean-to extension on side of power shed so i can put more solar on roof and have a store below for wood and coal etc...and stage 3 is to purchase a wind turbine.
Fencing hasnt gone up yet, but hopefully will start this week...and i have a nice enclosed pallet which the batteries came in to recycle into a small hen house...it really is none stop, hard work...but im loving it...
:excited: :thumbsup:
Cheers.
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Hi Richard.
Welcome to TAS
I am just over the hill at Mount Tabor. Glad you are settling in and getting the power sorted sounds interesting. :thinking:
There is a chap in Todmorden (I think he is there) who has some really nice POL's, my friend bought some a little while ago, I can find out for you if you like? Just PM me.
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Hi Richard.
Welcome to TAS
I am just over the hill at Mount Tabor. Glad you are settling in and getting the power sorted sounds interesting. :thinking:
There is a chap in Todmorden (I think he is there) who has some really nice POL's, my friend bought some a little while ago, I can find out for you if you like? Just PM me.
Where us MountTabor?...i still dont know way around here!!!...Do you also have a smallholding/farm?
Thanks for the info about the POLs...but have sourced some other local POLs...but if no good, will comeback to you...thanks :)
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[quote author=penninehillbilly link=topic=58503.msg499756#msg499756 date=1432126318
('Kids' can be sometimes be amusing if people don't realise your'e talking about goat kids), but I often wonder which was called 'kids' first ::) .
My friend, who suffers from mental health problems was on a regular visit to her GP and said she felt great as she had helped deliver her friend's kid. She noticed he was giving her a strange look and hastily added, "it was a goat giving birth." :roflanim:
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:wave: and welcome.
Having just scanned this tread a few points from me....
1) you cant train a dog not to chase sheep (before someone contradicts me ) no dog is totally reliable even my old dog who happily totally ignores sheep normally, gets excited when another dog starts chasing ... so keep on lead anywhere where there are sheep.
2) Cattle need to be in at least a group of 2 adults ... which means at least 2 acres of very good grazing and winter housing (or more acres for outwintering) .? It is far too easy to underestimate the amount of land needed for cattle ... Remember you will have 2 years worth of calves/growers at anyone time so at least 5 cattle at any one time (min 5+ acres?)
3) 2 weaners for meat and a couple of goats for milk would be a good way to start.
4) whilst you are fencing you need to think about type of fence ... pony owners wont go near barb, cattle owners almost always use a barb strand to stop cows knocking fence down, sheep need stock fencing, poultry need predator 'proof' fencing and pigs needs very strong or electric fencing.... a mine field in its self!
After all that ............. enjoy! such exciting things to think about :excited:
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As it stands plan is: Chickens first, then 2 weaners to grow on for meat and then a couple of goats for milk/meat...but will need to build a shelter/winter housing for the goats 1st...anyone got any spares!?!?! :fc: :innocent:
Id also like to try a couple of rare breed sheep too.
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Hi Richard.
Welcome to TAS
I am just over the hill at Mount Tabor. Glad you are settling in and getting the power sorted sounds interesting. :thinking:
There is a chap in Todmorden (I think he is there) who has some really nice POL's, my friend bought some a little while ago, I can find out for you if you like? Just PM me.
Where us MountTabor?...i still dont know way around here!!!...Do you also have a smallholding/farm?
Thanks for the info about the POLs...but have sourced some other local POLs...but if no good, will comeback to you...thanks :)
Sorry :( Mount Tabor is North East Halifax. And yes we do, 14 acres at MT and another 18 at another holding which is mostly summer grazing. We keep Herdwick sheep and Embden geese.
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Do any of you who live west yorkshire way/ pennine know of any livestock auctions/shows coming up in near future?
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Look up local livestock auctioneers and ask them to keep you informed of any sales :)
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Clitheroe Auction Mart isn't too far from you. Google it.
This Saturday is the plant and machinery sale; we will be there :excited:
Fur And Feather every Wednesday evening.
The next pure breed poultry day is August .... we will be there if my older chicks shape up well.
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Skipton Mart - (google called Craven Auction)
By show do you mean agricultural show or auction show+sale?
Great Yorkshire is the big Aricultural/day out show to go to, Halifax in August has quite a lot on (esp goats ;) ), and Bingley 25th July.
Kimbo-Thanks for that about Clitheroe this Saturday, might get over there, needing some stuff
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Hi guys,
hope you're all well...we're finally getting our first pol hens tomorrow...coop all up and ready :-) ...its been a long time coming...i see what you all mean by 'hard work' :idea:
What do you all feed your hens and use in your nest boxes...im thinking of sticking with the conventional method of straw for the nest box, a few treats such as dried mealworm and maybe some vitamin enriched feed?
Cheers
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HI Richard
Been wondering how you were getting on.
so what breed are you going for?
I feed mine layers pellets in the morning, let them out of their run mid morning, or they wander off and lay away. wheat in the evening, soaked because I noticed some came through whole.
There will be lots of different ideas on feeding :-)
straw and shavings or similar in the nest box, I now use a type of bedding, i think it's dried chopped oil seed rape stems, or there is a miscanthus based one, better than sawdust or shaving in my opinion.
been to any auctions or shows locally?
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Hi,
we're getting 2 white stars, 1 light sussex, 1 bluebelle and 1 blue egg laying hybrid (similar look to a white splash aracuna)...all chosen by the kids!
Not been to any shows...but i hope to...but might be next year now...in process of central heating install with rayburn cooker as boiler...laying copper pipes in a 170 yr old house is fun!!! :thinking: :o
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Hi,
we're getting 2 white stars, 1 light sussex, 1 bluebelle and 1 blue egg laying hybrid (similar look to a white splash aracuna)...all chosen by the kids!
Not been to any shows...but i hope to...but might be next year now...in process of central heating install with rayburn cooker as boiler...laying copper pipes in a 170 yr old house is fun!!! :thinking: :o
which layer pellets are you using?
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Halifax was a nice show, lovely day as well :-)
I use layers pellets from a local supplier who mill their own, previously I've used BOCM.
My cockerel is half aurucana, I was told the blue egg gene will still be there but I haven't hatched anything this year.
I love my rayburn, we run on joiners off-cuts, cooks the tea, warms the kitchen and gives hot water - free. not big enough for central heating though, there is a separate wood boiler for that.
*If you are on spring water just check, - round here spring water eats through copper pipe and cylinders, in our case usually about Christmas time!
most of our house is on Hep20 pipe and the tank is stainless steel.
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Halifax was a nice show, lovely day as well :-)
I use layers pellets from a local supplier who mill their own, previously I've used BOCM.
My cockerel is half aurucana, I was told the blue egg gene will still be there but I haven't hatched anything this year.
I love my rayburn, we run on joiners off-cuts, cooks the tea, warms the kitchen and gives hot water - free. not big enough for central heating though, there is a separate wood boiler for that.
*If you are on spring water just check, - round here spring water eats through copper pipe and cylinders, in our case usually about Christmas time!
most of our house is on Hep20 pipe and the tank is stainless steel.
Yeah we're spring fed...we're a stuck between a rock and a hard place with regards to the central heating/hot water - the plumber contacted the manufacturer and they do NOT recomend using plastic pipe on Rayburn systems...on the other hand we have acidic water which isnt good for copper pipes...so far we've used copper pipes for central heating and will put a ittle more inhibitor in the system once complete...the hot water system as it stands will also be copper....what to do?!?!...may look at putting some kind of filter on the main in pipe to house.
Anyone any ideas??
Cheers.
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sorry, I was thinking of the tap supply, one Christmas we had to pull all the kithen units out and all the copper pipe behind them, another year it was the cylinder, being Christmas/new year of course we couldn't get the parts, spent about 2 weeks wriggling round units in the kitchen (OH is heating engineer, he was too busy mending other peoples heating ::) )
Ours is only the Royale, heats the S/S cylinder immediatly above upstairs rather than straight to the taps, so that's a sealed system with inhibitor in.
The central heating is seperate and as you say, inhibitor should work.
We also installed a year or so ago, a filter system, with UV? light, supposed to sort any bacteria and deals with the Ph. really wierd going into the garage in the dark, this strange green glow in the corner. ???
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sorry, I was thinking of the tap supply, one Christmas we had to pull all the kithen units out and all the copper pipe behind them, another year it was the cylinder, being Christmas/new year of course we couldn't get the parts, spent about 2 weeks wriggling round units in the kitchen (OH is heating engineer, he was too busy mending other peoples heating ::) )
Ours is only the Royale, heats the S/S cylinder immediatly above upstairs rather than straight to the taps, so that's a sealed system with inhibitor in.
The central heating is seperate and as you say, inhibitor should work.
We also installed a year or so ago, a filter system, with UV? light, supposed to sort any bacteria and deals with the Ph. really wierd going into the garage in the dark, this strange green glow in the corner. ???
i've just ordered a digital ph reader - guess i need to know how acidic our water is. are you finding the UV is up'ing the PH?...what other filter system are you using...can you pm me a link?
the filters im seeing are quite expensive but all 'inline' so only reqiure plumbing in.
What PH is your water...how old were the copper pipes before they corroded?...the new cylinder is copper and now im freaking out a bit...think a filter is the way fwd.
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so the chickens have arrived. .now waiting in anticipation for the 1st egg and what colour it will be...might run a book on it!! :innocent: :excited:
They are currently in a cocoon chicken coop which has a 5ft run...the 60 sqm run will hopefully be finished this weekend and then we'll put the coop in the big run. Im feeding layer pellets in the morning and mixed corn on a night with a few dried meal worms thrown in to get them settled...i've been reading that Marmite on toast is good for them when they first arrive to boost energy and as a once a week treat...anyone else hear'd/tried this?
Cheers.
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Hello
Any eggs yet?
I've been reading all these posts with great interest, as it sounds like we're in a very similar situation to you, and not too far away either (near Colne). We bought a house with 2 acres 3 months ago. Paddock is boggy in places, with a stream running through it. The garden isn't bad, though, so we hope for decent veg growing. We plan on keeping ducks, chickens and pigs. We also abandoned the idea of a house cow! I have no idea about the marmite I'm afraid. We got our first chickens at the weekend, and I'm giving them cider vinegar with garlic in their water, and verm x pellets in addition to their layers pellets. We've only had them for a few days so will see how it goes. Bless 'em, they're free ranging in our paddock which is quite wild and windy! They're near a dry stone wall which will hopefully provide enough cover for them. We were concerned about crop impaction, which apparently can be a problem when too much long grass is eaten, but the breeder said not to worry. Anyway, enough about me, it sounds like you're doing great. The advice on this thread has been fantastic, and I wish you lots of luck with your evolving plans!
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Hello
Any eggs yet?
I've been reading all these posts with great interest, as it sounds like we're in a very similar situation to you, and not too far away either (near Colne). We bought a house with 2 acres 3 months ago. Paddock is boggy in places, with a stream running through it. The garden isn't bad, though, so we hope for decent veg growing. We plan on keeping ducks, chickens and pigs. We also abandoned the idea of a house cow! I have no idea about the marmite I'm afraid. We got our first chickens at the weekend, and I'm giving them cider vinegar with garlic in their water, and verm x pellets in addition to their layers pellets. We've only had them for a few days so will see how it goes. Bless 'em, they're free ranging in our paddock which is quite wild and windy! They're near a dry stone wall which will hopefully provide enough cover for them. We were concerned about crop impaction, which apparently can be a problem when too much long grass is eaten, but the breeder said not to worry. Anyway, enough about me, it sounds like you're doing great. The advice on this thread has been fantastic, and I wish you lots of luck with your evolving plans!
we're currently getting 1 egg a day from one of the whitestars...wish the others would follow suite!
Yes, sounds like you are very similar to us...we plan on pigs next spring. Its all fun :-)