[Marches Farmer]

I agree.  I've found many people with obesity problems have had food ingrained into their lives from a very early age.  Not as a fuel for living but as something given by parents or carers to keep them quiet, as a reward for "good" behaviour or as a comfort they turned to when life became insecure or frightening, maybe because of illness, a difficult family situation or bullying at school. 

Understanding why they view food in this way requires compassion and counselling to leave that behind.

[Kitchen Cottage]

He is my best friend because he is honest loyal and a generous person.  He is also male and I am not really very focussed on my girl friends who talk rather than do and over analyse.

He's the life and soul of the party type and is "big will", at his barbeque you'll find a board and tomahawk throwing.

He could never embarrass me, he's just a decent honest caring man.

Our connection isn't cerebral it's more fun and direct conversation

[Black Sheep]

This is an incredibly difficult subject with much wisdom shared. I agree with the reality that individuals have to want to change for change to occur, so understanding the root cause/contributing factors will be vital if you want to help. This is a very different proposition from just asking/telling people to change.

Behaviour change is very difficult to make - all of us have habits that we dislike but we continue with them. For some people the results are very visible, such as described here, but others are invisible. Just because you can't see the results for the habits each of us have doesn't make us any better than someone who is overweight or addicted to drugs. Sometimes reflecting on what makes change difficult for us can bring understanding of why it is hard for others.

I wanted to pick up on the alcohol. Some quick maths and basic assumptions (like the strength of the home brew wine) suggests to me that the weekend load you mention (at 1 case of beer) adds up to 8,000 kcal from the alcohol content alone (nevermind all the other energy content). Even split a couple of ways this is a major source of energy. Understanding why he drinks so heavily (it also works out to be 252 units) may be one in road to identifying strategies that could help. Perhaps forgetting the food entirely and seeing if he would seek help from an alcohol service may bear fruits.

Lastly, because change is hard with so many prompts around us undermining attempts to do things differently you need positive motivators to encourage and help you maintain it when things are difficult. Negative motivators are not as strong and changing things out of fear will only get you so far before resentment sets in. So helping him identify what he, as an individual, gains by making change and finding ways to reinforce these gains alongside opportunities to celebrate success along the way are vital.

So as a practical example I ask people who I'm helping give up smoking to identify what they gain as a result. For some people that is financial and I ask them what they intend to do instead with the money. For some that is a holiday they have dreamt of. So getting clippings from the brochures and putting them in a wallet, on the noticeboard, on the sun visor in the car and so on, where they provide a constant positive reminder of how they are gaining/benefitting, can provide that motivational support.

[Marches Farmer]

I think professional counselling can often be a very positive thing.  Having someone who is trained, who's entirely "on your side" with no axe of their own to grind, can be immensely beneficial.  Just sitting in a room with a counsellor who's outside the circle of family and friends can provide a breathing space that allows a calm step back from the prevailing circumstances and a clear view of the situation that requires attention.  It can allow the load to be shared without guilt or worrying about worrying someone you consider a friend.

[Fleecewife]

I agree about the alcohol and about the counselling.   I don't think alcohol was mentioned early on, but someone who drinks so much is an alcoholic.  This is a different problem to the overweight, although the cause of it, and really needs to be tackled by professionals.  Your friend will never be able to lose weight drinking so much, and it could well be that he already suffers from malnutrition - in the sense of a lack of a healthy, complete diet.
From your description KC, your friend's drinking makes him the life and soul of the party, where everyone likes him.  If that's the case then why would he want to change?  The behaviour which is killing him gives him a very satisfying reward, which is far more relevant in the short term than the possibility of death.
Yes, he needs to see he has a problem and want to seek professional help - far far easier said than done. Families are broken apart by alcoholism, and lives destroyed.  It makes we wonder about his history with his sons that they appear to hate him so much.   Where is his GP in all this?

[carla78]

Sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind.

Tell him straight. That his weight will end up killing him.

He probably will not react well but a couple of days later he will be fine, then you can start supporting him  - exercising, diet etc.

[Marches Farmer]

I think he already knows, deep down, that his way of life is bad for him.  Doing something about it can be a huge and scary step and sometimes just too big without professional help.

[carla78]

I think he already knows, deep down, that his way of life is bad for him.  Doing something about it can be a huge and scary step and sometimes just too big without professional help.

Sounds bad, but he will know that every time he looks in the mirror. 28 stone calls for drastic action. Not side stepping the issue.

[waterbuffalofarmer]

I have been reading this thread and my advice would be that if he does want/need to lose some weight that it would be best for him to go to a doctor and maybe a trainer who looks at all aspects. Losing weight is indeed one thing, but you have to take into account health problems, if he has any? Example heart, blood pressure, etc, etc. You need to get a full checkup before you proceed onto a diet, especially if you are a little shall we sayover the weight you should normally be. The first step is though that you have to let the person recognise that they have a problem which needs to be fixed, its all very well telling people they have a problem, but it is entirely up to them if they recognise it or not and in order to deal with the problem they have to admit it is there, believe me it is very difficult. I myself am not slim and trim, I am a little too chunky for my own liking and I have a sugar addiction, which can affect my mental state. In order to help somebody you have to work with them, lending support all the steps of the way, gradually making changes to the diet which improve them. I am reading here that you say the reason for drinking is because maybe of loneliness? That in itself should I think be the first step, people need to spend more time and make him feel like he is loved and wanted, this in itself can yield good results, those people around him who love him and make him feel needed and wanted can help to change his diet by maybe saying to him that he doesn't need to do all this to feel loved or wanted, but that they love him and choose to be with him because of himself. Build up confidence and work with him suggesting various things. I hope I am not being too forward, I myself have a little experience of lonely and believe me it can be solved, but like I say it is a gradual process. I hope this helps and I am thinking of you all. I hope all goes well and that I haven't overstepped the mark by offering this advice, weight loss can be a very delicate subject and it is important to take into account everything
WBF

[Alex_]

I am a qualified fitness instructor and used to work in a gym and the only way someone looses weight and keeps it off is if they actually want to.

You can motivate, nag or beg but the only way it's happening is if the urge comes from within.

But if some actually wants to change you do it in small steps.

Make a small dietary change. Instead of chips unlimited leafy greens and broccoli  unmolested (no sauce/salt/etc).

No cheat days but you can have a meal but instead of going KFC or pizza hut you have to make the cheat meal from scratch yourself

Move towards less simple carbs and evening meals just have a protein source, fibrous veg and a healthy fat source. you can get carb free noodles and rice made from konjac Flour ( smells like feet but once cooked smells and tastes fine.

Build up exercise from small walks and weight lifting. Loosing weight from cardio is hard. Work weights. Especially large muscle groups (squats/bench press/deadlift) Good compound movements burn calories.
Weights then cardio is the magic mix to loose weight.

Everyone in the house has to be on board. So the wife has to eat the same. It wont work if he is eating salad and she's eating pizza

[bazzais]

Just be his friend.

[nutterly_uts]

I agree someone needs to want to change but what MAY be a way to faciliate that, if appropriate, would be to find them a dog needing a 1-2-1 home and some gentle exercise. Having a reason to take those first baby steps might just be an effective shove, and it also leaves plenty of scope to have sneaky support from friends - plenty of people meet up for social dog walks  as well as making it more of an event

[Kitchen Cottage]

Lots of good advice on this thread.

He sees his doctor a lot, he's in denial that his weight contributes to his many health problems and denies his doctor tells him it is. 

He won't read and I don't think he'll see any kind of therapist.  He DID go to hypnosis, which he said was working,  but in truth that's a lie because if it was working as he claims I'd see results... and I don't.

His wife is slim and eats far less (obviously) but is so cross after years of Will's weight issue that she laughs at each new announcement that he's on a diet.  That sounds like she is being harsh, but she isn't.  Not only does she face people who blame her for his weight but her life is constrained by his weight.  Stuff doesn't get done around the house, he spends a lot of time on his arse and they exist.

He wouldn't own a dog, he doesn't like them, I think for now I'm just going to encourage him to keep weighing himself (he has a weekly weigh-in at work as they are all on a diet) and hopefully his lack of progress will motivate him.

[doganjo]

You MUST -
    Want to lose weight
      Eat only when hungry
         Eat real food
             Don't eat at set times

This  what I was told once when I said I'd like to lose weight - and it's the  only advice that has actually worked.  I'm a yo-yo, been fat since birth -my Mum came out of the clinic in hysterics when I was 6 months old because she had been told she was killing me - they thought I was on full cream milk but I'd never been on more than half cream, so it's 'in the  blood' as they say.

I was doing fine with the above regime(lost 2 stone and got down to 13) then was put on steroids and back up I went.  It's so much harder now, but the worst thing is the weight comes off so slowly and you get disheartened.

Your friend, KC, will ONLY try to lose weight if he wants to, you cannot help him now it's got to this stage.

[Kitchen Cottage]

Doganjo,

You are right.... and I liked the quote (though funnily enough if I don't eat at set times I overeat).

He wants to be healthier and less disabled by weight.... but not enough to change things.

All I am doing is nagging him with blindingly obvious stuff and it's not working. 

Sadly, I suspect none of us know the trigger in his mind that will work.