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Author Topic: Resources for Learning about Cattle  (Read 7273 times)

BrimwoodFarm

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Resources for Learning about Cattle
« on: September 06, 2016, 04:34:33 pm »
I have a dream, and it involves a small herd of Dexters and attempting to establish a top quality breeding line. However, I have absolutely ZERO experience with cattle. Are there any great resources (books etc) I can be looking at?  :eyelashes:

It'll be several years before I'm in a position to start buying any of these beautiful creatures, but I may as well use the time to do some homework. It doesn't need to be Dexter-based; general info on cattle would be good too. All I remember is my granddad having a grump heifer called Daisy who'd physically abuse us kids whenever we got within reach.  ;)

Victorian Farmer

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2016, 04:57:26 pm »
Look to learn flushing and embryo to start ,iff I was starting I would go for 10 nice dexters then I would use straws instead of a bull .You could sell the 10 the next season and use the young stock .So the bull of choice would be Apple Coda M5218 EX94, it would be  inposabul to have a bull this good .The stock http://wagyu.co.uk/highland-wagyu-cattle/dexter/.                                     http://www.dextercattleforsale.co.uk
« Last Edit: September 06, 2016, 05:11:57 pm by Victorian Farmer »

Dan

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2016, 09:46:46 am »
There are resources on TAS you might find useful.

Introduction to keeping cattle: http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/livestock/cattle/

Cattle books: http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/books/category/cattle/

[member=13]Rosemary[/member] will be able to advise which books she's found most useful, but IIRC the Val Porter Caring for Cows and Cows for the Smallholder are worth a read.

HTH.

waterbuffalofarmer

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2016, 03:34:50 pm »
I would also talk to top breeders how they do it, or members of the society/society heads too. Go to sales, suck up as much info, watch judges poke and prod the animals, but most importantly have a vision in your mind what you would like them to look like. Try and spend a lot of time talking to people and at sales walking around, feeling the animals. How fast they grow? Carcasses, weight, easy birthing, good on feet, good bags with plenty of milk for calves. All very important. The main question is what would you like them to be? What do you want them for, showing/breeding for meat etc, etc. Hope this helps and all the best with your search. Here is something which may help http://www.dextercattle.co.uk/
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BrimwoodFarm

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2016, 04:36:39 pm »
Thanks [member=1]Dan[/member] and [member=42855]waterbuffalofarmer[/member] - great resources and places to start learning!

As it's first and foremost a smallholding, I want to have a little herd of good dual purpose animals I can get milk and meat from. But I'd love to develop some really good bulls too for showing/breeding. That way I can provide milk and meat for my own family, as well as selling locally, but also gain some additional income from selling both bulls and sperm.

Off to enjoy those links :D

Rosemary

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2016, 07:12:53 pm »
Can I ask why you have decided on Dexters [member=160088]BrimwoodFarm[/member]

BrimwoodFarm

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2016, 07:34:36 pm »
Can I ask why you have decided on Dexters [member=160088]BrimwoodFarm[/member]

Is the right answer 'because I love them'?  ;D

Being a non-cow person, I like their small size. I also like the fact they're dual purposes - the Dexter site says you can average 10-12 litres which would be MORE than adequate for me and family with a little extra to sell locally too. I've also read several articles on the fact they're a good grazing cow too, particularly for slightly wild pasture - ideal for the land I currently have.

Rosemary

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2016, 07:39:47 pm »
I guess that will be with the calf off, then you'll have the calf to feed as well, milking twice a day.

I'd be interested in where they get their yield figures from since I'd guess not many folk milk them to *get* the yield.

BrimwoodFarm

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2016, 07:46:39 pm »
Yeah, the only info I've found on that so far is on the Dexter society website. It does mention a cow could raise her own calf along with a larger commercial breed so would there be an option to have the cow raise her own and still take off some milk?

This was my source: http://www.dextercattle.co.uk/the-breed/why-dexters/

I saw some Red Polls are a local show this year too; also fairly small, so that's another avenue I may look into. Might be especially apt since they're derived from Norfolk/Suffolk cattle and my land is right on the border so would be keeping with plans to establish local breed varieties.
« Last Edit: September 07, 2016, 07:49:03 pm by BrimwoodFarm »

Rosemary

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2016, 08:35:12 pm »
The native breed factor is why we went with Shetlands - we wanted a Scottish breed (and a rare one) - so I could see why the Red Polls would appeal.

What you're thinking about is multisuckling - so twinning on a calf along with the cow's own. I honestly doubt whether you'd get milk for yourself doing that. Shetlands are certianly used for multisuckling.

http://www.accidentalsmallholder.net/livestock/cattle/multiple-suckling-with-shetland-cattle/

We've been milking our three Shetlands, but leaving the calf on and milking once a day - but after eight weeks, we were getting hardly anything - 4l off three cows. Next yera, I think I'll take the calves off an feed them cows' milk but it means milking twice a day. And feeding twice a day.

My vet said he'd divorce me if I got Dexters  ;D

BrimwoodFarm

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2016, 09:28:10 pm »
Aha. Does that mean you wrote the wonderful TAS guide?! Lots of awesome info there. I didn't realise about the cow and sheep grazing option, for example. Great way to maximise pasture.

What's your vet got against Dexters?!

Red Polls are pretty lovely. I'm already planning on Ixworth chickens and Suffolk sheep, so they'd certainly fit with the theme. I think they're also more dual purpose than Dexters which, I believe, have become bred towards beef more than dual in recent years.

waterbuffalofarmer

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2016, 10:20:37 pm »
Dexters can have unpredictable behaviour, so I have read, so you would have to carefully study any breeders, how they keep them and their temperaments before buying. If you have the funds, provided the animals in question have all the right attributes, it mightb be worth buying some of the very best, if you can. It will take quite a few years to breed up and breed out any traits you don't like, before you have a really, really good herd. I hope it all goes really well for you.
All the best :thumbsup:
WBF
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landroverroy

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2016, 12:14:58 am »
 Many people start off with Dexters (including me!) because of their size. But as WBF suggests, they are (how can I put it?) not the most placid of animals.
 I once had one that I bought in as an adult, that tried to kill me. I didn't keep her long!
 But those I've raised from calves have been placid enough, as they're well handled, but they sillt have quite strong characters.
 I do think though that you are expecting to do too much with them. As you rightly say, they are a dual purpose animal. But the favoured ones are the beef types, and having been selected for their meat characteristics, their milking qualities will have deteriorated. Until recently there was a milking herd of Dexters, and the milk yield you quoted was probably from this herd. But their conformation as meat animals would be nothing like that which you would need to aim at nowadays for your proposed top breeding herd.
 You might find that Red Polls would be better for your requirements, not only because they have a calmer temperament, but also, bearing in mind that very few animals become top prize winners, then those that don't make it will still have a more marketable carcase.
   
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Backinwellies

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #13 on: September 08, 2016, 02:10:48 pm »
I don't know where you are based but if you want to witness the difference between Dexter and Shetland characters pay us a visit here in S Wales ... we have both and the differences are evident.
Linda

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BrimwoodFarm

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Re: Resources for Learning about Cattle
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2016, 04:56:45 pm »
And this is why I'm asking all these questions now.....  ;) I had NO idea of their unpredictable behaviour. I was thinking small = easier to handle; seems not.

Red Polls seem to be coming up trumps at the moment. There's one thing for the 'I've always wanted Dexters...' but RPs definitely seem to be ticking the right boxes.

 

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