[loulou2204]

Hi, I hope someone can give me some advice please?

I have 2 wethers and got them both in May at around 12-14 weeks. They have their horns.

I'm beginning to wonder if one of them has been properly castrated (they still have their 'sacks' for want of a better word). One of them has stayed fairly small and is calm and isn't really smelly, just normal goat smell.

The other has grown considerably bigger, is quite aggressive in a spoilt child kind of bratty way and he's really quite stinky! If he doesn't get his way or is feeling naughty he will stand on his hind legs and butt me, my children (age 3 & 4) or any one of my dogs (who do not and never have chased them or been aggressive to them). I can not let my children outside with them as I used to when I first got them. I have bruises on my legs where he has butted me or scraped his horns down my leg. He will come for a fuss but if you stroke his head to give him an itch between his horns he will try and tussle with you.
The smaller goat is lovely, quite timid and shy but calm and gentle. The bigger goat is quite aggressive to him but he does give as good as he gets. They do play fight but you can tell the difference between the 2 types of fighting.

Does anyone have any advice on how I can tell if he's been castrated properly?

Thank you

[clydesdaleclopper]

Certainly none of the boys I have had castrated have ever had anything showing in the way of sacks or otherwise. I would suspect they haven't been done but you probably need someone to take a look at them.


You will need to do some behavioural training with them but goats are very intelligent so will learn quickly - both good and bad habits. Find a treat that they like and use it in very small quantities to reinforce the behaviour that you want. it may be best to avoid scratching his forehead as they will instinctively push back.

[Anke]

Are the sacks empty? If that's the case then they may have been done surgically, rather than rubber band as done on tup lambs (and really young goats). However I wouldn't bet on it - if they are smelly they almost certainly have not been done (correctly). Have you had any goats before, so you can compare to previous experience.

I now strongly discourage people to buy goat kids for pets, because they simply are not really suitable for that - especially with young children around! An entire billy kid that is pushy at this age will be extremely difficult to re-train and if he is not to be used for breeding can get very frustrated and very dangerous. There is some force behind that forehead when he buts! I have permanent damage to both my knees from an over-enthusiastic Shetland tup, and he doesn't weigh anywhere near what a fully grown billy will in a year or so...

If your boy is entire you really only have one solution - abattoir, probably both of them and soon before they get too smelly.  (the meat is divine) Sorry if that's harsh...

Please do not sell him on as  a "pet" to someone else - it is not fair on him, but the fault (IMO) lies with his breeder, who probably couldn't face doing the right thing him/herself...

[Backinwellies]

Sorry to hijack post ..... but read subject quickly  and I could do with some help with my naughty weather too!!

[loulou2204]

If your boy is entire you really only have one solution - abattoir, probably both of them and soon before they get too smelly.  (the meat is divine) Sorry if that's harsh...

I really don't want to (nor will I) send them to the abbatoir. They are my pets (not bought for the children) and I would never eat them or sell them or give them away. I believe an animal is for life & I will find a solution come what may.

Could I get him castrated now by a vet? Would he calm down?

Many thanks for your reply.

[Scotsdumpy]

I cant see why you cant get him castrated if he hasnt been done properly.  Im not sure what you could do if he has an undescended testicle which might be his problem. This happens with horses and they are classed as rigs - they can be castrated but this needs an operation. Your vet would be able to clarify your situation and suggest remedies. In my experience of keeping castrates is that one or two will be dominant and even try it on with humans - again to discourage this is dependant on how strong you can be. Sometimes just pushing them down every time they misbehave will work and this is what we do. Ive heard that water pistols or spray bottles work too. Perhaps someone will come along with other helpful posts.

[loulou2204]

I've just spoken to the breeder and he used the rubber band type method. He said the only thing that could have happened is that the band has come off, although this has never ever happened to him before.

I'm going to get the vet to come out and see what is there or isn't there. Apparently they can be castrated with a local anesthetic and can be done on the day at my house. 

[loulou2204]

Certainly none of the boys I have had castrated have ever had anything showing in the way of sacks or otherwise. I would suspect they haven't been done but you probably need someone to take a look at them.


You will need to do some behavioural training with them but goats are very intelligent so will learn quickly - both good and bad habits. Find a treat that they like and use it in very small quantities to reinforce the behaviour that you want. it may be best to avoid scratching his forehead as they will instinctively push back.

Hi, thank you for your reply. When you have had the males castrated which method was used please?

[Marches Farmer]

Hmm, if they'd been ringed then the scrotal sac would also have dropped off - not something you could easily overlook, although a testicle may sometimes ascend into the body - a rig, as has been mentioned.  If he's smelly then his hormones are working and the reason that would happen is one or more testicles in working order.  If you touch his head he will see it as a challenge and, at best, push back or, at worst, pull back and butt you hard.  I would not have such an animal anywhere near a child - one moment's inattention could result in a serious injury.  I suggest getting your vet to take a look if you really can't bear to part with him.

[loulou2204]

Thank you for all your replies. I have just spoken to the vet and he said with the rubber band method the sack should have dropped off!! They both still have them!

The vet is coming next Wednesday to see what's going on!! 

[plumseverywhere]

Hello 

I had a wether castrated surgically (actually wanted him banded but the vet did it same time as dehorning under anaesthetic). he turned quite bolshy and jumped up at me.  With him, I literally wrestled him to the floor a couple of times and stood my ground, he stopped the pushing his luck malarkey after that.
I'm guessing yours are at the terrible teens type age? Firm but fair handling can help but... if he's not been properly castrated I think you will have your work cut out. Good that the vet will come and do it, I have no experience to say whether later castration will calm him or not but the others will. I think the standing to butt thing is an exerting dominance characteristic in goats.Mine do it all the time and then wander off chewing the hay again like friends!
Be wary of the horns, which I'm sure you will, we have horns here and I've had some accidental prods in the ribs, bum, cheek - not deliberately but just when the goat turns her head.


 

[mart6]

If you can handle them you should feel if there is anything in the sack.
You will easily notice if anything is there
Its possible the were banded without both dropping , hence only one done with band,
Then other drops and needs surgical removal.
Had to have one done myself for that reason last week,  quite routine  procedere for a vet.
Helped hold goat while it was done took 20-30 mins tops

[clydesdaleclopper]

Hi, thank you for your reply. When you have had the males castrated which method was used please?

It was banding, same as we do with the lambs. Sometimes if the bands are old the rubber perishes and the ring snaps and falls off before it does the job.

[fiestyredhead331]

sure sounds like a testicle was missed during banding, we've had that happen to ourselves but they go for meat anyway and are kept seperate from the girls so not an issue for us.
We keep one fully castrated boy for sentimental reasons and he is as camp as Alan Carr 

[mojocafa]

How did you get on with the vet yesterday?