[red-september]

I have just received 4 ewes and a tup.. there all 7 month old and been put in the field together..
Now my concern here is could these ewes be in lamb.. i know that 7 month old is very young to be having there first lambs, and preferably i would not want them to be!
The Tup has tried a few times.. can anyone tell me when a hebridean comes into season? iv heard its November and that they only come into season once a year?? without having them scanned can anyone tell me how to tell if there in lamb..
Also if they do end up having lambs in spring, what will the complications if any be with them being so young, is it worth allowing them to run there full course and have them?

Thanks alot, i hope to be a regular on here.

[Fleecewife]

Hi Red-September
I'm not sure why you would put the ewe hoggs in with the tup if you don't want to breed from them this year.
It is usual, especially with the more primitive breeds, not to breed them as hoggs but to wait a year so they will lamb around their second birthdays.  This gives them the chance to mature properly before putting the extra strain on them of growing a lamb while they are still growing themselves.
Hebrideans will come into season during the autumn but there is no absolute beginning or cut-off date for this.  It is usual practice to remove any males at 4 months, 5 at the latest, then only to re-introduce a male when you want to breed them.  We go by the old dates of putting the tup in on Nov 5th and expect to start lambing on April 1st - this coincides with reasonable weather (if we are lucky) and the growth of new grass as the ewes need it for milk production.
You will not be able to tell if the hoggs are in lamb until up to a week before they are due, when they might start to bag up - but even this does not necessarily happen.  We have never scanned so someone else will tell you when to do this.
If your tup has been running with the hoggs for the past couple of months then you can assume that they will nearly all be in lamb.

[red-september]

thank-you very much for the help..
the Farmer i bought them from has told me they have been running together for the last few month, so that is the only reason, i decided to put them in the same field for now, as i presumed the damage will have already been done.
the reason i asked, was more for clarification of whether a 7 month old ewe was old enough to be in season..
soooo, presuming all 3 of my ewes are in lamb, what do i do now, do i let them carry on? (what complications can i expect with the ewes and lambs, at birth and also in future life?) would it be wise to let them carry on or..
or is there a way i can terminate the pregnancies , is that even an option?

[princesspiggy]

we bought 4 ewe lambs last winter and they were pregnant as the previous owners lambs had got to them - not ideal but they went on to produce healthy lambs and are fine.

[red-september]

thank-you Princess, what breed where they if you don't mind me asking?
Did you have any birthing issues?

[princesspiggy]

they are boreray, no birthing problems. they werent intentionally mated but the sheep do have a mind of their own.
2 out of four gimmers had single lambs, and all is fine. they were april born (on same day), so would have been mated at 7 mths.
this year our hebridean ram has got to the ewes so will be xbreds next year - but no big deal as our boreray ram was only born this year and i wasnt sure if he would work so young - he got beaten to it!
we'l just put the lambs in freezer and make sure the blasted heb rams are away by next year (any takers anyone??)

[Dizzycow]

Our Hebridean ladies are currently in a field with the charming Dougal, a lovely Heb tup. Am I wrong to be concerned that I haven't witnessed any action? Fleecewife - I'm directing this mainly at you as you seem to be an oracle on the subject!

[Anke]

Some guys are more discreet than others....

Until I raddled my Shetland tup I never saw any action, but all ewes produced lambs when expected.

[princesspiggy]

whats the best raddle colour to use on a black sheep ?

[Rosemary]

I use yellow followed by green for my Coloured Ryelands - not black, but quite dark brown.

[Dizzycow]

Ok, Anke, will trust that Dougal is perhaps just a bit shy! Not going to raddle. Will trust mother nature!

[Fleecewife]

Yes you won't necessarily see a tup working, but others are not shy at all     We don't use raddle.  In April we can be seen at feeding time walking along behind the feeding ewes, bent double trying to see if they are bagging up - mostly we can only see when they kick up their heels to hop the trough to get away from us, when we see a flash of pink udder.

Red-Sept - no need to abort the lambs, your ewes will lamb fine and will eventually catch up with their unbred sisters.  In our first year with Hebs we had a couple of hoggs which broke down a fence to get to the tup - they both lambed ok and were ultimately the same size as the others.  You need to be a bit careful about feeding over the winter, providing enough feed to keep them growing, but not so much that the lamb is too big to pop out easily.  They will probably have only singles, but not definitely, so watch for twins too.
Just sometimes a first time ewe will have a problem mothering up so watch carefully and if you see a problem (such as her ignoring her lamb and wandering off without it) then get them into a pen inside straight away - have one set up in advance.
I don't think you will have any problems though - Hebs are very sensible sheep 

[red-september]

ah thankyou very much Fleecewife..
I will be preparing well for the moment then..
as i don't exactly know when they will have been served, should i persume they were served on the 4th november. so they should be due 1st april.. but obviously this is bound to not be the case, so should i be on high alert 1 month either side of that date, or longer?
thanks.

[Fleecewife]

Can you find out from the previous owner when the tup went in?  Or has he always been running with them?   I don't really know when a Heb ewe hogg might first become fertile, but perhaps from about 6 months?   Perhaps another Heb breeder who lambs their females in their first year can tell us.  Certainly they will be fertile by 7 months, unless they are very undergrown.  I think you will just have to watch them very carefully from about Feb onwards.  It could be that the first you will know will be the sound of bleating from your fields    Get your lambing supplies in early - especially 10% iodine for navels, and gloves plus farmers lubricant in case there is a tight lamb.

[princesspiggy]

Just sometimes a first time ewe will have a problem mothering up so watch carefully and if you see a problem (such as her ignoring her lamb and wandering off without it) then get them into a pen inside straight away -

we had that a couple of times when the ewes had twins and left one and we didnt know who the abandoned one belonged too.
the "orphan" is still here...years later ..lol